*** UPDATE: The Fenix series has had two generation updates since this post. Check out the in-depth reviews for both the Fenix 5 Plus, and the Fenix 6! ***
It’s been nearly three months since Garmin first announced the Fenix 5 series, a lineup of three core watch sizes/models (5/5S/5X), that spans 14 variants in total. And that’s before we even talk straps. This line builds upon the Fenix 3HR introduced a year ago, which in turn built upon the Fenix 3 from a year prior to that. Yet it incorporates elements seen in the super-pricey Fenix Chronos that came out last summer (don’t worry, that product line gets all these updates too).
Since introduced, I’ve been testing a pile of watches. I’ve amassed 63 workouts on them in that time frame across three continents and from tropical waters to the icy mountains of the Alps. Not to mention the stack of workouts that The Girl (my stunning wife) has done on the Fenix 5S variant. Neither the dog nor the baby have participated in this round of testing. Slackers.
While much of the earlier testing is on beta software/hardware, recent testing over the last month has been on final hardware and largely final software. Plus, units started shipping last week to consumers around the world. As such, it’s most definitely in-depth review time. Like always, once done with the loaner units I’ll stick them in boxes and send them onwards back to the folks at Garmin and go out and get my own via normal retail channels.
With that – let’s get on with it.
Executive Summary – What’s new:
If you’re already an old hand at knowing what’s new about the Fenix 5 series, then you can honestly skip this section. But, if you’re just arriving here for the first time…then let’s get you all caught up before I dive into actually using it.
So what’s so different about the Fenix 5? Well, the two biggest pieces would be it now has maps on the Fenix 5X edition (legit maps!), and that there are three sizes now. Previously there was just one size with a crapton of different bands. Now there are three sizes with an equally large crapton of bands.
For now, let’s talk about all the differences – both nuanced and big. But first I need to explain that there are three editions of the Fenix 5:
Fenix 5S: 42mm wide, smaller wrist focused – offered in regular glass and Sapphire glass Fenix 5: 47mm wide, baseline – offered in regular glass and Sapphire glass Fenix 5X: 51mm wide, includes mapping – only in Sapphire glass
Each of these three editions is then split into basically two categories: Sapphire and non-sapphire. Except the 5X, which only has Sapphire. What’s most notable though is that the non-Sapphire editions do NOT have WiFi (kinda like Garmin Fenix Chronos). Whereas the Sapphire editions all have WiFi.
With that in mind, I’ll note each of the new features below, and whether they are specific to a given version. If no specific version is noted, then it’s applicable to all versions. In the below, I’m largely using the Fenix 3/Fenix 3HR as my baseline for changes.
Display: 5/5X Went from 218×218 pixels to 240×240 pixels (except 5S, which stays at 218×218). Display: Went from 16 colors on Fenix 3 to 64 colors on Fenix 5 Display: Now supports Emoji, right to left languages (Arabic and Hebrew) Connect IQ: Fully supports CIQ 2.2.3+, as well as 64KB for Widgets, 32KB for Data Fields, and 128KB for apps Battery: Increased battery life up to 24 hours (Fenix 5) in GPS at 1s, or 14hrs for the 5S, and 20hrs for 5X Battery: Increased UltraTrac battery life to 75 hours (Fenix 5, less for 5X) Gyroscope: Added Gyroscope to all models, used to increase track points in UltraTrac mode User Interface: Slight tweaks to UI to match Fenix Chronos series User Interface: Added new quick access controls menu, to access apps/widgets Strava: Added Strava Live Segment support for Bike & Run Sensors: Added Varia Vision Heads Up Display Support (all ANT+ remote displays technically) Sensors: Added Varia Bike Lights (all ANT+ lights technically) Sensors: Added Varia Bike Radar (all ANT+ radar technically) Sensors: Added Shimano Di2 Shifting, ANT+ Gear Shifting Support (SRAM RED eTAP & Campagnolo EPS) Sensors: Added ANT+ Muscle Oxygen Sensors (MOXY/BSX) Sensors: Added Bluetooth Smart sensor support (HR, Power, Speed, Cadence, Footpod) Optical HR Sensor: Revamped tech, now records 24×7 data every 1-2 seconds Optical HR Sensor: Flattened out even more, virtually flush with back of unit Training Data: Added FTP Estimation for cycling Training Data: Added new Training Load functionality Training Data: Added split of aerobic and anaerobic training effect Training Data: Now supports Swimming PR’s (along with previously added Swim Structured Workout support) Live Group Tracking: Added to all Fenix 5 models, à la the Edge 820 group tracking Golf: Added TruSwing, Greenview, and Autoshot features Other Sports Added: Mountain Biking, Treadmill and Indoor Track separated, Ski and Snowboard separated, Navigate app, and Track Me app Navigation Functions: Added Proximity and Navigation Alerts (for distance to waypoint, and time/distance remaining to destination) 5X Only – Mapping: Includes Topo maps in package, can add your own maps if you want 5X Only – Mapping: Ability to display mapping for current position 5X Only – Mapping: Ability to create automated running/riding routes (round trip mapping 5X Only – Mapping: Can find POI’s around you (i.e. food, including Chipotle) 5X Only – Mapping: Routing engine can ingest GPX & FIT files for turn by turn navigation
Got all that?
Ok, but what’s been removed or no longer present compared to the Fenix3 series? Well, according to Garmin it’s purely one thing: WiFi on the base models (Sapphire glass models have it).
Oh, one last thing. Wondering why there’s not a Fenix4? That’s because the phonetic pronunciation of that in Chinese roughly translates to ‘fast rise to quick death’. Not exactly the starting point Garmin wanted to begin with.
If you’re looking for the complete ‘what’s new’ wrap-up in one go, then here’s a detailed video that covers it all:
Ok, let’s get crackin’ on this box.
Editions and Unboxing:
There are 14 versions of the Fenix 5, which fall into the three basic groupings: Fenix 5S, Fenix 5, Fenix 5X. I talk about the basics of those in the previous section. Of course, within that, each model has different things included in the box. For example on some of the higher end Sapphire glass variants, you also get a secondary strap.
Trying to keep track of all the Fenix 5 versions? Join the club. Feel lucky you don’t have to type it all out and ensure it’s correct. Here’s the best way to think about it.
First, choose your watch size:
Fenix 5S – 42mm: This is the smaller one, unofficially targeting women Fenix 5 – 47mm: This is your standard issue one, officially targeting everyone Fenix 5X – 51mm: This is the mapping one, it’s bigger to fit in more battery/storage/processing
Here’s how these three look side by side, assuming you were just using the simple silicon band (no fancy bling) – Fenix 5S, Fenix 5, and then Fenix 5X:
Next though, you need to choose whether or not you want Sapphire glass. That drives whether or not you get WiFi. In theory, it also might prevent your unit from getting scratches on the lens. In reality, that’s usually not the case.
Fenix 5S: Non-Sapphire is $599, Sapphire is $699 Fenix 5: Non-Sapphire is $599, Sapphire is $699 Fenix 5X: This ONLY has Sapphire, starting at $699
Decided what size and version you want? Ok, good. Now you get to decide what bands you want. Here’s how that rolls out:
Fenix 5S – $599: White bezel with white silicone band (band officially called ‘Carrara’) Fenix 5S – $599: Silver bezel with turquoise silicone band Fenix 5S – $599: Silver bezel with black silicone band Fenix 5S Sapphire – $699: Black bezel with black band (+ includes a yellow silicone band) Fenix 5S Sapphire – $699: ‘Champagne’ bezel with gray suede band (+ includes a white silicone band) Fenix 5S Sapphire – $849: ‘Champagne’ bezel with golden color metal band (+ includes a black silicone band) Fenix 5 – $599: Slate gray bezel with black silicone band Fenix 5 – $599: Slate gray bezel with yellow silicone band Fenix 5 – $599: Silver gray bezel with granite blue silicone band Fenix 5 Sapphire – $699: Black bezel with black silicone band (+ includes a yellow silicone band) Fenix 5 Sapphire – $849: Slate gray bezel with metal band (+ includes a black silicone band) Fenix 5X Sapphire – $699: Slate gray bezel with black band Fenix 5X Sapphire – $849: Slate gray bezel with metal band (+ includes a black silicone band)
Oh no no, we’re not done yet. Finally, you need to decide if you want a bundle or not. The bundle is only offered in the following editions, so if you want an HR strap bundle (that comes with the HRM-TRI strap), for capturing swim workout data), then you have to pick one of the two specific bundles offered (neither 5S or 5X). Burger King this is not.
Fenix 5 – $699: Slate gray bezel with black silicone, with HRM-TRI strap Fenix 5 Sapphire – $769: Black bezel with black band + yellow silicone band, with HRM-TRI strap
Got all that? Good. That makes one of us.
Now, you may be wondering about all these bands. Officially they’re called QuickFit bands, as they are designed to pop on and off super-quick. And indeed, they do with a single button press. There’s virtually no risk of these popping off in an open water swim or the like, because the lever is below the band against your wrist.
The idea being you can buy extra bands of differing colors as you see fit. And oh – these QuickFit bands are also compatible with the Garmin Fenix3 series as well. Because I’ve gotten tired of typing out spec sheets, I’m going to go into abbreviated mode now. The bands are as follows:
All of which is a long-winded way of saying: Your mileage may vary on the unboxing front. I’m going to go through the unboxing of a single unit here in photos/text, and then I’ll cover all the three core units in the video below.
First up – we’ve got the box itself. This box happens to be the Fenix 5S Sapphire edition. But again, you can check out the full video of all three units in a moment.
Inside that box you’ll find the watch looking up at you, with all the parts goodness below the surface.
So what’ve we got? Well first up is the watch itself. Here’s the front and back.
Then we’ve got the secondary suede strap in there.
Of course, with the QuickFit system, you can pop it on and off super quick. The Girl has been doing that with this 5S for a while now. For workouts she uses the white silicone strap, and for the rest of the day, the suede strap.
Next, we’ve got the charging cable. It’s new to the Fenix 5 series, but Garmin says it’ll now become the standard for all future wearables. One cable to rule them all.
Lastly, there is the quick start guides you saw above. However, I want to take a brief diversion to talk about that cable. Due to that, I present you this video below I put together – which shows both the upside and downside to the new charging cable.
Finally, as promised, here’s the mother lode of unboxing videos – with all three editions unboxed, plus size and weight comparisons. It’s like knocking out two sections of this review in one sitting:
Ok, let’s move onto the comparison section.
Weights & Sizes:
You asked for it; it’s time to talk size between the units. Here are the exact specs of the three sizes (plus the Fenix3 HR at the bottom for comparison):
Fenix 5S: 1.7” x 1.7” x 0.6” (42.0 x 42.0 x 14.5 mm) – 67g Fenix 5: 1.9” x 1.9” x 0.6” (47.0 x 47.0 x 15.5 mm) – 87g Fenix 5X: 2.0” x 2.0” x 0.7” (51.0 x 51.0 x 17.5 mm) – 98g Fenix 3 HR: 2.0” x 2.0” x 0.6” (51.5 x 51.5 x 16.0 mm) – 86g
But that can be hard to conceptualize, so instead, let’s make it easier in simple text. Note, in the below I’m specifically talking about the width of the watch (round part), not so much the depth.
Fenix 5S: Roughly same size as Forerunner 735XT/230/235 (techically slightly smaller than those) Fenix 5: Slightly larger than the 5S, but smaller than Fenix3HR Fenix 5X: Virtually identical to Fenix 3 HR in size (except not as deep)
Note that technically the screen on the 5S has less pixels (218×218) vs the 5/5X (240×240), but it retains the same color (64 colors). There’s no changes in terms of contrast or display brightness between any of the watches, or compared to the Fenix 3 series. If you liked the Fenix 3 brightness, you’ll be fine with the Fenix 5. And if you didn’t like the Fenix 3 brightness, you probably won’t like the Fenix 5 brightness.
First up, let’s look at just the three core watches side by side:
Next, for fun, let’s add in the Fenix 3 HR as a bit of a benchmark on size. You can see that the Fenix 5X and Fenix 3HR are identical in terms of face size. This is why you can switch the new bands on the Fenix 5X to the Fenix 3/3HR lineup. Whereas the Fenix 5 and Fenix 5S won’t be compatible with the older Fenix 3/3HR bands.
Now let’s get all horizontal and see how they stack up. Here it’s super clear just how big the optical HR sensor bump is on the back of the unit.
What? You’re into optical sensor bumps. If that’s your thing – then here’s two more pictures comparing the Fenix 5 to the Fenix 3HR optical HR sensor bump:
Now let’s throw them all down on the pavement and see how they shake up. I tossed in the Fenix Chronos, FR920XT, and FR735XT in there. Note that the FR735XT shares the same exterior shell dimensions as the FR230 and FR235. So if you’re familiar with those watches, that should help you understand a bit.
And here’s the depth on them. You’ll notice just how much that bump from the Fenix 3HR has been reduced with the new optical sensor design on the Fenix 5 series (or even compared to Chronos). Keep in mind on Chronos it’s thinner in part because of the fact it has less battery. The sensor bump is still bigger on Chronos than the Fenix 5
Next, just two lonely watches to more clearly show just how close the Fenix 5S and FR735XT are in size.
But I hear ya – sensor bumps aren’t your thing. Instead, it’s wrist fetishes. No worries, I’ve got you covered. Here’s my wrist with all the units on it.
Oh no…we’re not done yet! Here’s some additional photos on a small women’s wrist (The Girl) of the three models:
She notes that she likes the size of the 5S the most, though wishes the poles were a little bit smaller.
And then here’s the same three models on my brother’s wrist, which is a bit larger than my wrist (which is the wrist seen for all other photos in this post):
Phew – more than you ever wanted to know probably!
The Basics:
I’m going to mix things up a little bit in this review from past reviews. Partly because I get bored writing things in the same structure each time, and partly because I think at this point there’s some things that are considered ‘base’ knowledge. Meaning that I’ve often split up into separate sections swim/bike/run, with there being so much overlap between all three sections. For this I’m going to round-up the watch basics into this section, then sports into the next, and then talk about unique Fenix 5 pieces like the new Training Load components. Then I’ll separately dive into accuracy.
To start with, you’ve got the watch face. While it may look similar to the Fenix of the past, there’s actually a fair bit of customization allowed under the cover. Virtually every element, including the data fields (even the Fenix logo) can be customized to your liking. And that’s before you even talk going to Connect IQ to download a watch face by a 3rd party, or using a photo with the Garmin watch face app.
For example, you can customize to show metrics like steps, calories, sunrise/sunset times, altitude, text message notifications, miles run, and more.
New to the Fenix 5 is also the ability to quickly access widgets and functions. That’s done by simply holding the upper left button, which opens up a ‘wheel’ of controls These include functions like locking the screen, enabling do-not-disturb mode, or controlling music. You can slightly customize these, by adding other functions like quick-access to the VIRB camera controls, setting time quickly via GPS, or the timer and stopwatch functions. Personally, I’ve found this most handy for just locking the screen (i.e. while skiing to prevent accidental presses from gloves).
Next, it’d be remiss to not mention the activity tracking that occurs. This has been standard on Garmin wearables for some time. It tracks your daily steps and movement, including stairs (using the barometric altimeter. You can either add these stats to the front watch face, or you can simply press the down button to get to the activity tracking page, which shows your steps towards your goal for the day. That goal is constantly shifting – attempting to motivate you to walk more.
All of this activity tracking data is, of course, available through the Garmin Connect Mobile app, on iOS/Android/Windows Phone (as well on online via web browser). The app syncs continuously throughout the day in the background.
A notable change to the Fenix 5 series is the updated optical HR sensor in relation to 24×7 monitoring. While the Fenix 3 HR had an optical sensor, and it also monitored your HR 24×7, it didn’t quite update as frequently as it could have. Sometimes it’d be every few seconds, and yet other times it’d be hours in between updates (during workouts, it was always every second). With the Fenix 5 however, the optical sensor has been reengineered to sample every 1-2 seconds.
That sampling is then uploaded along with your daily activity data to Garmin Connect. While Garmin notes that some people may not see a major improvement in the visual graphs shown on GCM for your daily heart rate, I certainly have. They noted that behind the scenes all that data is captured, but that a lesser set is shown online (logical, since you don’t really want to try and display 3,600 data points per hour, times 24 hours, on your mobile app). In any case, here’s what that looks like.
All of this data can be used to track your all-day heart rate. I’ve talked about this in the past, but the benefit of tracking resting heart rate is to identify trends, such as getting sick. In fact, it was easy to see over the last few weeks when my resting HR went from being in the low 40’s, up to upper 50’s – that I was getting sick (and sure enough, I was).
As you may have noticed above, you’ll also get automatic exercise recognition for certain sports like running, walking and cycling. Note that this doesn’t turn on the GPS, but rather is just using accelerometer data. You can tap these to get further details about the activity. For example, above you can see those little grey circles. One is when I walked to dinner, and another when I walked home from dinner. Below you can see the level of detail I get about each one (one going to dinner, one going from dinner), which is simply just the distance and start times (5:50PM vs 8:50PM).
I’d strongly recommend though that any time you do an actual legit workout, just use the normal sport modes. That’s going to give you the data recording you want. Otherwise, the automatic exercise recognition is basically just for capturing random walks around town, a quick commuter ride around town, etc…
Next, we’ve got smartphone notifications. For the most part, these are pretty similar to the past. The Fenix 5 supports the standard notification centers on your smartphone, so any app can trigger notifications. From Twitter to texts, and Snapchat to Strava. These will simply appear on your wrist and you can view them as-is, or press to get further details. Alternatively, you can clear them. Anything cleared will also clear on your smartphone. Further, you can open up the widget to view any missed notifications.
Note that what is new in the Fenix 5 is the support for Emoji icons, enabling you to finally see your smiley icon in its full black and white text glory.
One last basics item to cover is WiFi. The Fenix 5 has WiFi included *only* on the Sapphire edition units, so basically, the more expensive ones. WiFi is utilized to allow for quicker uploading of workouts, as well as sync of data like updates. Realistically it’s not all that much faster than Bluetooth Smart. But it is kinda convenient to just walk in the house and have things upload the second you close the door from a run.
To configure WiFi networks, you can use Garmin Express, which allows you to list numerous networks. Note that you can’t connect to proxy/filtered networks (like a Starbucks or most airport networks). But home networks, MiFi access points, and such are all good.
With that – we’ve covered all the non-sporting basics, aside from a run through the settings control panel. But if you’d like to see what’s in store there, then simply hit up the below video – where I walk through the entire watch user interface, screen by screen!
It’s time to move onto getting active with it, and seeing how it works in sport use.
Sport Usage:
Now to dive into what we’re all here for: Using the darn thing for sport. After all, while the Fenix 5 is a great day to day smartwatch, the reason you buy it is likely for outdoor sports goodness. Or at least, some sports goodness.
I’m going to iterate through some basics on a few core sports, but keep in mind that for the most part everything from a core functionality standpoint in one sport applies to another sport. Meaning aspects like data field customization, alerts, etc… are all basically the same. Where things differ of course is connectivity to sensors (e.g. power only in cycling, at least without Connect IQ add-ins), and then also how certain metrics are displayed. For example, you’d get pace in running versus speed. But many metrics can be tweaked – such as whether you want to see altitude in meters or feet. I actually like to mix and match that myself, where I’ll keep pace/speed in MPH, but altitude in meters while riding in Europe.
So, let’s talk running first. To start up any sport we’ll hit the upper right button. That brings us to the sport selection screen. It’s here we can choose any of the default sports, customize some (like triathlon mode), and add others. Also, we can access standalone apps – such as 3rd party apps or even 1st party Garmin apps like the HRV Stress app or Navigate app.
In any case, we’ll choose running – and in this case, an outdoor run. For an indoor run, you’d select ‘Treadmill’.
Once that’s selected it’ll go off and find satellites. You can see the status of this by the ring around the edge of the watch. Wait until it’s green. Red is bad, and orange is less bad. Green is good. In general, I like to wait a few seconds extra (10-15 seconds) before starting, after it’s green. This ensures it’s truly got good legit satellite coverage. A few folks have also noticed that on the very first GPS activity you do outdoors (ever), you may want to give it an extra minute or so before starting. That seems to help significantly.
At the same time, it’s going to be acquiring your heart rate optically. You can see this by the little HR icon at the top. When it’s blinking, it’s thinking. When it’s done thinking, it stops blinking and stays lit. Don’t run till you’ve got it lit full-on.
If you’re using a heart rate strap (external), or a footpod, it’ll go off and connect those accessories. Of course, ensure you’ve got them paired first.
Next, let’s talk data fields and data screens. This basically applies to all sports. Essentially, you can customize the crap out of data fields and screens. No device on the market gives as much customization as this. You’ve got customizable data pages (screens), that can have up to 4 fields each. That can be one field, two fields, three fields, or four fields. And then within both three and four fields you can arrange them two different ways each (technically three ways for three fields – one without field titles).
You can create numerous custom data pages, I haven’t figured out the limit because you can create so many. But you can also select from standard data pages that can be lightly customized as well. These include: Virtual Partner, Map, Compass, Elevation (Graph), Music Controls, Running Dynamics (x2 pages), plus a heart rate zone page. Lots of pages.
I tend to keep mine somewhat basic. Essentially I’ve got a page focused on workout totals (i.e. total distance, total time, etc…), and then another focused on laps (i.e. lap distance, lap pace, lap time, heart rate). Btw, you can select either automatic laps based on a preset distance or manual laps based on pressing the button.
Within laps, you can also customize a lap banner, which will display the lap details after pressing the lap button. So you can mix and match what data you want there. I’d point out that this is the one area that Suunto has an advantage over Garmin, with their Spartan series. They’ve got a super cool lap summary page. Ironically, this lap summary page is modeled in turn after what Garmin did on their Edge series devices. But alas, it’s never come to the wearables lineup.
Note Suunto also can now do 7 data fields per page, though I honestly haven’t had much of a reason to need more than four on a wearable. So one could argue that’s a benefit for Suunto, though again, I think the real strength is their lap page.
In any event – let’s actually just run. Once running (after you’ve pressed start), it’ll record all your data including your location. In order to show how instant pacing works and responds, I’ve put together this quick video:
While running you can, of course, change data pages at any time by pressing the up/down buttons. Heck, you can even customize the data fields mid-workout if you so choose (something you can’t do on Suunto/Polar devices). It’s all pretty darn flexible.
Once done with the run you’ll get summary and PR information – such as longest run, or fastest 5K run, etc… You’ll also get recovery time metrics (more on that in the next section), and workout benefit details.
And then finally, you’ll find your workout will sync via Bluetooth Smart or WiFi (if your unit has it), or you can just plug it in. It’s here you can then explore the activity online using your mobile app or browser. Also, if you’ve connected to Strava, TrainingPeaks, or one of the other Garmin Auto Sync services, it’ll end up there within a few seconds too.
One final note is that the Fenix 5 still doesn’t support running power meters natively (Suunto does). However, you can use the Stryd Connect IQ data field to get that data. That field will then show up just like a normal power meter field within your data pages, and allow you to record the data online to not just Garmin Connect, but also apps like TrainingPeaks – which will show it as well (seen towards the bottom, with the little ‘IQ’ pieces next to each graph).
Next, let’s talk cycling. Virtually everything I’ve talked about above applies here in terms of data field customization and such. About the only major difference is when we start talking about power meters, which the cycling mode supports.
I talk about sensors in a full section down below, but it’s worthwhile noting here that the unit does now also support Bluetooth Smart power meters and Bluetooth Smart Speed/Cadence sensors (in addition of course to ANT+ sensors it’s always supported).
While riding, you’ll be able to display data from the power meter, as well as any other sensors you have. Plus distance and speed data from GPS, and altitude data from the barometric altimeter. One downside to the Fenix 5 though for triathletes is the lack of a quick release kit. As such, you’ve either got to wear it on your wrist, or pick up one of those cheap $11 rubber mounting blocks for your bike. But those blocks don’t tend to fit triathlon bike bars very well. Hopefully, we’ll see Garmin offer a quick release kit. Given the triathlon season is just getting underway…now would be a really good time for that.
Note that the Fenix 5 supports Strava Live Segments, via the app built into it. This allows you to see your status of a segment you’ve starred, which will automatically trigger when you cross the segment. This is true of both cycling and running. I talk a bit more on how this works in this slightly older post, when the functionality first came out.
Next, let’s move onto swimming. That’s where things get a bit more unique sport-wise. The Fenix 5 supports both openwater and pool swims. For openwater swims, it’ll use GPS. Whereas for pool swims, it’ll use the accelerometer.
I’ve actually got a crapton of experience with openwater swims and the Fenix 5, thanks in large part to being in warmer climates for January-March.
To demonstrate how it all works, I’ve put together this video that walks through step by step both the unit in action, as well as accuracy after the fact:
The key thing to understand with openwater swimming modes on any GPS watch is that it’s a constant struggle for units to figure out where you are. Each time your hand goes under the water, it loses GPS signal. And each time it gets above the water (for all of 1-1.5 seconds), it partially regains it. Usually, it doesn’t regain enough signal to know exactly where you are – so instead it starts trying to plot based on a spread of points. That’s why openwater swims are rarely perfect in track length. As a general goal, I find anything within +/- 10% to be acceptable for openwater swim distance. Obviously, I’d prefer it be spot on, but plenty of openwater swimming over the years says that’s roughly the line in the sand.
There are things you can do to improve your success rate though:
A) Always get signal above water before starting
B) Always press the start button above water, and then wait for 2-5 seconds before your first strokes
C) If making a sharp turn somewhere (such as a buoy), I find it helpful if you slightly slow down your stroke rate at the turn buoy – giving the unit just an extra split second of your wrist above water to try and find GPS
D) Always wait until out of the water to stop the GPS track, ideally waiting 5-8 seconds for it to ensure it has a clean lock on GPS
If you do those four things, I find substantial improvements in GPS tracking during swims (across all device vendors). None really impact your workout.
Next, let’s talk pool swims.
As noted earlier, for this it leverages the accelerometer in the unit. That’s then combined with a known pool length, which it’ll prompt you to select it from some common lengths. You can also customize the length as well if you’re pool is wonky. Once it’s set, it’ll remember it for future swims – but you can easily change it if you pool-hop.
Overall I found no issues with the swimming on the Fenix 5 throughout a few different pool swims in both an empty pool and a busy pool (18 people in my lane).
As always though with (all) pool swimming and accelerometers, there’s a few tricks you can use as well to get better accuracy:
A) Obviously, ensure your pool length is right
B) The key to swimming watches is remembering it’s looking for a ‘cue’ as to when you’ve reached the end of the length. So, push off forcefully each time
C) It doesn’t matter if you do flip turns or open (non-flip) turns, I mix and match depending on the craziness at the end of my line
D) Again, just push off sharply, no matter what you do
E) Avoid stopping/starting mid-lane, since it’ll confuse things
F) If you have to pass someone mid-lane, it’s best to ramp into that pass as evenly as possible. Versus just instantly sprinting mid-lane, since it may think you’ve just done a new length. I realize that’s easier said than done – but just giving some general advice
G) Don’t do the YMCA song at the end of the lane, even if at the YMCA. Also, if you go the bathroom, pause the watch.
Speaking of pausing, note that the Fenix 5 does include an inverted display color when you pause it – so you can know whether your mid-set or not. Also, you can use drill mode for things that don’t involve your wrists (i.e. kickboard drills). That allows you to simply enter in the total distance for that drill set at the end of the set.
Once you’re done, you’ll get summary data on the watch, but you’ll also get it of course on Garmin Connect as well. Both per length data as well as per-set data.
Ok – with all three core triathlon sports taken care of, let’s briefly talk about triathlon mode. This is the key element to a multisport watch, and enables you to seamlessly transition from sport to sport, all within a single recording. It’s what differentiates a Garmin/Polar/Suunto multisport watch from a TomTom watch that may support all three sports individually, but not as a single workout/race.
With the Fenix 5 you’ve got a triathlon mode that by default includes openwater swim, outdoor cycling and an outdoor run. It’ll also capture transition times too. You just press the lap button to change to a new sport.
One tip I’d recommend is during a triathlon, is to lock the watch. Garmin actually offers an automatic locking option after each sport (you can enable/disable it per sport), so that it’ll automatically lock as soon as you change sports. To change sports again, you’ll hold to unlock, then press again to change.
Next, if you want to customize the multisport mode you can do so too. For example, to do an indoor triathlon, or to do a duathlon. Or to do a brick workout. Also, you can just make-up a multisport mode on the fly by simply holding down the middle left button and changing the sport to something else. Basically it offers never-ending multisport mode.
Speaking of making things up – you’ve got the ability to select numerous other sports, as well as customize those sports. Here’s the grand total of sports that I see on the watch today:
Running: Run, Trail Run, Treadmill Run, Indoor Track Hiking: Hike, Climb, Walk, Navigate Cycling: Bike, Bike Indoor, Mountain bike Swimming: Openwater Swim, Pool Swim Triathlon: Triathlon Mode, Swimrun, +general multisport mode Skiing: Ski, Snowboard, XC Ski Other water: Stand Up Paddleboard, Row, Row Indoor Other: Golf, Golf TruSwing, Strength, Cardio, Jumpmaster, Tactical, Other (make your own up)
Phew!
Next, let’s talk structured workouts and intervals. Structured workouts are ones that you download from Garmin Connect. You can create them online there yourself, or download ones as part of a plan from them (such as running or triathlon plans).
These can’t be created on the mobile app, but can be sync’d via that app. So you’ll need to edit/create the ones above using a desktop/laptop computer (don’t even bother trying on the app). Once that’s done, it’ll show up on your watch for you to execute:
Typically structured workouts are more complex than basic interval workouts (which I’ll cover in a second). So with a structured workout you may have numerous targets and/or rather complex phases or steps within them. The watch will guide you through each of those steps/targets, and you’re basically along for the ride (or run).
Whereas with interval mode, you’re running through a relatively basic interval workout (basic in structure – it may still be quite painful in terms of execution). With these you’ll go into the interval mode on the unit itself, and then you can customize the interval’s work duration (time or distance or open), the rest period (time/distance/open), as well as the number of reps and the warm-up/cool-down periods.
Once that’s all customized, it’ll iterate through these steps and again, you’re along for the ride. The key difference between this and the structured workout above really gets to the complexity of what you can do. With the interval timer on the unit itself you can’t set targets (i.e. a target pace), whereas with a structured workout you can.
Ok – we’ve covered all of the core sport pieces. Note that the next section will dive into the training and stress pieces, whereas the section after that I’ll talk about navigation and courses. Courses can also be used for pacing as well (i.e. racing against a previous effort), so those do have some overlap there into the sport realm.
Training Load & Stress:
Perhaps the biggest change in the Fenix 5 is the inclusion of new Training Load and Stress metrics, as well as now listing the aerobic and anaerobic training effect (versus just a single training effect before).
At first glance, you’d probably say these were just more puff numbers. But behind the scenes there’s actually a fair bit going on, and it’s including a pretty massive codebase from partner FirstBeat into the watch. All of these metrics are identical to what FirstBeat has been using for years in their pro athlete offering, which is a big software suite that pro teams use to try and gauge training and recovery. Garmin has in turn licensed portions of that, which are now seen in the Fenix 5.
One really important thing to point out is that these metrics take time to adapt to you. Realistically FirstBeat says it takes about two weeks in total to get to the point of having truly valid data. That also assumes that you’re able to get two workouts that trigger a VO2Max estimate (either running or cycling, but two of the same sport type). It’s those two key items that allow it to really hone in. It’ll reach it’s ‘full potential’ once it has about a month’s worth of data on you.
So what type of data is it giving? Well, there’s a bunch of metrics. Nothing here requires a heart rate strap. First, we’ve got the basics – like VO2Max for both cycling and running. These have been around for a while.
Then we’ve got recovery hours. This is a continual timeline of your recovery hours. This grows with each workout, and shrinks over time, like flipping over an hourglass timer. Along the bottom it’ll give guidance on how to train:
Then we’ve got the new Training Load piece. This tells you how much load you’ve had in the last 7 days, and whether that’s optimal, overtraining, or undertraining. Remember though – this is based on understanding you as an individual (which gets to those first few weeks). So it’s looking at your past training load and figuring out what you’re capable of. Said differently: It’ll be different for everyone based on their historical loads.
The specific number given in the middle ranges differently for each person. The below graph kinda helps to put it in perspective. But again – the optimal range will vary by individual.
A couple of things to keep in mind about the Training Load function:
– The number is a 7-day rolling value
– It’ll take one week before you see the first number
– It takes four weeks to be ‘fully calibrated’, inclusive of VO2Max estimates
– It requires either the optical HR sensor be enabled or a heart rate strap be paired to accumulate load
Then we’ve got the previous Race Predictor function. This is pretty straightforward and just does a lookup table based on your current running VO2Max, your gender, and your age. Nothing more, nothing less. This also assumes you’ve done the training such that your legs can maintain that distance. In general, for most people, it tends to be in the right ballpark of their *potential*. Again, you’d have to have the training in the legs to hit that.
Lastly, we’ve got the Training Status screen. This is new, and it’s pretty cool. Up top it’ll tell you your current training Status, followed by whether your fitness level is falling, and if the load is increasing. Here’s mine as of today:
So what’s it telling me? Well, it says that I’m doing unproductive training. That makes sense. I’ve been traveling the last few days, along with skiing. That’s moderately unproductive. Officially, here’s what the description from FirstBeat means:
“Your training load is at a good level, but your fitness is decreasing. Your body may be struggling to recover, so be sure to pay attention to your overall health including stress, nutrition and rest.”
Which is ironically exactly true. I was sick last week, and combined with the travel and weird hours – it’s not ideal. Kinda neat when something works.
In the photo above you’ll see the fitness and load directional arrows. One is showing my fitness is decreasing as a result, while my load is actually slightly up. That’s because I’ve been doing ad hoc (but unstructured) shorter runs the last few days (3-4 days in a row), coming off of skiing for a week. So it’s less than ideal from a training standpoint.
Here’s another example from a few weeks ago, which is showing the opposite, as I was peaking at that point coming off of a strong week.
Next, at the end of every workout, you’ll be given a split of anaerobic an aerobic training impact, in terms of a number between 0.0 and 5.0. While Training Effect used to be a single number, now it’s split.
So what’s the above telling me? Well, there are tons of different phrases it can give back to you:
In order to make that easier, they’ve put them into a spreadsheet, which I’ve uploaded to below. Actually, two spreadsheets:
Finally, note that all of this is displayed on Garmin Connect at the end of each activity, you can see it here:
What isn’t (yet) displayed though is graphs showing this all over time. That would allow you to plot this and determine where you stand with training load in general, and potentially going into an event.
Two last notes – the Fenix 5 includes both the ability to establish Lactate Threshold levels as well as cycling VO2Max. The lactate threshold feature was introduced in the past with the Garmin FR630 and Fenix 3. As was cycling VO2Max on other units. With the lactate threshold feature you do need a heart rate strap (as you do if you want to use the ‘Stress Test’ score app). Also, with the cycling VO2Max test/values, you’ll need a power meter connected. Just wanted to make that clear.
Also, the Fenix 5 can record HRV data from an HR strap to the activity files, if you have specific apps that want to take advantage of that. To enable that you’ll dive into the settings menu and turn that to enabled.
Overall I’ve been pretty impressed with new FirstBeat driven features– more so than I’ve been in the past with similar training status/recovery type metrics. At the end of almost every workout I’d say that the ‘Training Status’ page (i.e. productive, unproductive, etc…), and fitness/load arrows are inline with how I feel. Of course, they’ve got years of experience with his algorithm in their dedicated software platform. Obviously though, I’m interested in seeing how it works for others as well – once folks are able to get 3-4 weeks of time on their units with good data to starting getting details on.
Navigation and Courses (and 5X Maps):
Historically one of the biggest differentiators between the Fenix series and the Garmin Forerunner series has been the navigation capabilities. Turning back the way-back machine to the original Fenix (aka Fenix 1), that was all about navigation. Then over the course of the Fenix 2 and Fenix 3 it became more focused on sports, albeit not to the detriment of hiking/navigation.
What I want to do here is show you how it works to create a course/route, load it onto a unit, and then navigate on it. That’s the basics. But then I’ll show you the unique differences within the 5X, since that has maps on it. Whereas with the 5/5S, they don’t have maps and instead use a breadcrumb style trail with general directional guidance (i.e. compass style).
To begin, you’ll need to create a course. The easiest way is to do this with Garmin Connect, where you can drag and drop your route over a map.
Once you’ve got the route done (I’ve got some tips a bit later in this section), you’ll send it to your Fenix 5. You can do this from the desktop or mobile app. From there it’ll show up in your list of courses on the unit:
Ok, with that all set we’ll crack open the course to navigate on it. It’ll offer the ability to show a map (which is just an outline) as well as the elevation profile. Below is how it looks on the Fenix 5 (non-X), we’ll get to the 5X in just a second.
Within the ‘map’ view (on all Fenix models), you can use the upper right button to iterate between three different zoom/pan functions. See those three tiny circles in the upper right corner? If I press that upper right button it then changes the lower-left button functions. Once for zoom options, once for pan left/right, and once for pan up/down.
While navigating the course it’ll show your current position and then it’ll show your planned route. It’ll also notify you anytime you need to change direction. Further, the little red arrow uses the magnetic compass to point you in the right direction.
If you want you can also select a past activity to follow. In doing so, it’ll actually set it up as a bit of a race, allowing you to pace/race against it while running/riding that course:
And you’ll get your current position within the elevation profile as well.
If you wander off-course, it’ll let you know about that as well (see the little turn indicator counting down along the bottom of the screen below).
And this is to some degree where we get into the key differences between the Fenix 5/5S and the Fenix 5X. When you’re routing on the 5/5S it has no context of what you’re on. It just knows you need to go in a given compass direction. Whereas on the 5X, it actually has routable maps – so it knows you’re on a road/trail.
You can see that below too – it’s not telling me of any impending turns, despite the route being on a twisting road – because it knows I can’t go anywhere but that road.
This is important because when I was on a winding mountain road, the Fenix 5 would constantly notify me at every switchback in the road, even though there was nothing else to do but follow the road. Whereas on the 5X, it knew that I was on a simple switchback, and didn’t notify me to keep following the only road there was (logical).
Speaking of routing, let’s talk a few more 5X specifics. On *only* the Fenix 5X is the ability to do round-trip routing.
This allows you to request a route (i.e. cycling/running) of a given length and if you want a given direction, and it’ll go and find you a course using the map set it has.
Well technically, it will offer up three routes for you to choose from:
You can then execute these courses just like you would any other course. It’s great for running or riding in places you don’t know, since it’s going to leverage cycling routes and other non-car friendly options when available.
I’d note that the creation of the route can take a wee bit of time. Within the city, it would take about 60-90 seconds (easily) per route. Whereas out in the middle of nowhere it was far quicker.
The other downside is that it does depend on the trail data within the mapset. For example in Spain when I was in a hiking mecca, the base mapset (it was a European Fenix 5X edition), didn’t include any (or at least, many) of these local trails. So the only options it gave me for hiking/running were on the main roads. Which was definitely a bummer.
Inversely, in Chamonix in France – I got tons of great options for routing, and many/most trails were understood.
Next, we’ve got the 5X’s ability to search through local points of interest. This means you can lookup a place to eat, or a place to get gas (useful for also finding food or water on a long ride), and many other places:
Once you select a POI, you can route to it as well just like before. This is essentially the same functionality you’d find on the Garmin handheld series. And again, none of this requires a phone to work. It can be done totally without any connectivity. What’s cool about this is the Around Me function, which has the watch tell you everything around you:
Or, you can filter it to just certain categories – like food.
What’s interesting is you if you look above you’ll see a little wedge on the upper right portion of the circle – kinda like two clock hands. This allows you to press the red button and then get a listing of places within just that wedge. Thus narrowing down the list.
You can rotate that little pizza pie around, to zoom in on another section:
And all of this does work pretty darn well. However, there are some tricks to making things work better, especially on route creation.
First, when using Garmin Connect’s site, you’ll likely try first in satellite mode. That’s fine, as that’s the best bet for figuring out routes. However, it won’t always work. For example, in this simple case I tried to create a route between the road and that beach you see down south of it. The red line is what happened when I told it to connect those two points:
So basically, it didn’t find anything there routing wise. Pretty much useless.
Instead, if you try clicking the dropdown in the upper right and select “OpenStreetMap” from the upper left corner, and try again. Ahh….much better!
Note in both cases I left on the option for ‘Stay on Roads’, which also translates to ‘Stay on trails’. Else it’d just connect the two dots and ignore roads.
The point being here that you’ll definitely need to experiment a bit. Also, somewhat frustrating you still have to do this all via desktop computer. There’s no option for doing this via your phone.
And the above is a perfect example of that. On this roadway it’d be very common for folks to stop at that parking lot and then want go to for a few mile/kilometer hike. There are many options (some of them you can plainly see in the map). Yet planning those would require getting back out a desktop computer, unless the Fenix 5X happened to know about it (and in the case of this area, it didn’t know about many trails I tried).
Which ultimately gets to my final point here: The 5X is very cool, and generally quite responsive. And if you’ve done enough planning it works out really well. Or, if you’re just in an area where the mapping quality is good. But if you’re not, then you’ve paid an extra pile of money for something that a $1 phone app tends to do a lot better. Or, as I said years ago in my previous Fenix reviews: I want to be able to plan routes from my phone and then immediately transfer them to my watch. Is that asking too much?
Heart Rate Sensor Accuracy:
The Fenix 5 series includes Garmin’s Elevate optical HR sensor built into the bottom of it, which I used both in workouts as well as in 24×7 continual HR monitoring mode. With the Fenix 5, this sensor got a slight overhaul/upgrade, most notably when in 24×7 mode. Previous to this, Garmin’s Elevate sensor would sample rather infrequently (outside of workouts), at rates from every few seconds to every few hours. It was all over the map.
But with the new lower-power Fenix 5 optical sensor, it now samples every 1-2 seconds. Basically, it’s always on. In addition to the change in sampling frequency, they’ve also reduced the sensor bump. Of course – my goal is to find out if there were any undesired repercussions from this, specifically in sport mode. When it came to 24×7 mode, the new data looks much better, and the accuracy seems spot on for casual activities like watching TV, walking, or just living life.
Thus with each subsequent new unit released I re-visit sensor accuracy. While it’s the same physical hardware, one can see the impact that firmware updates make. Additionally, each watch has a slightly different form factor (exterior design), which can impact accuracy in terms of external light getting into the sensor area (which degrades accuracy of optical HR sensors).
Before we move on to the test results, note that optical HR sensor accuracy is rather varied from individual to individual. Aspects such as skin color, hair density, and position can impact accuracy. Position and how the band is worn are *the most important* pieces. A unit with an optical HR sensor should be snug. It doesn’t need to leave marks, but you shouldn’t be able to slide a finger under the band (at least during workouts). You can wear it a tiny bit looser the rest of the day.
Ok, so in my testing, I simply use the watch throughout my normal workouts. Those workouts include a wide variety of intensities and conditions, making them great for accuracy testing. I’ve got long/steady runs, hard interval workouts on both bike and running, as well as tempo runs and rides. Not to mention skiing and hiking. Night and day, sun and snow. I’ve got it all!
For each test, I’m wearing additional devices, usually 3-4, which capture data from other sensors. Typically I’d wear a chest strap (usually the HRM-TRI), as well as often another optical HR sensor made by Scosche and in some cases also a Suunto Spartan Wrist HR that I’m also testing. I generally consider the Scosche sensors to be the most accurate optical HR sensors for fitness/workouts today. Note that the numbers you see in the upper right corner are *not* the averages, but rather just the exact point my mouse is sitting over.
Let’s dive into the first data set. Note all this data is analyzed using the DCR Analyzer, details here.
First let’s start off with an interval run of sorts. The first part is a bit of a warm-up, and then I go into four interval sets of about 5 minutes each, followed by three slightly more intense (but shorter intervals). On one arm I had the Fenix 5 with the optical HR sensor. On the other I had a Suunto Spartan Ultra paired to a Scosche Rhythm+, and then I had a Fenix 3 paired to an HRM-TRI heart rate strap. Here’s the overview:
So, a couple of things. First up is at the front we see the two optical sensors match nicely, while the HRM-TRI chest strap is a bit low. This is actually an interesting case because the chest strap is wrong here. A classic case of a cooler day (with some light winds) and it taking a few minutes to ‘click’. I believe I added some more spit to the chest strap around the 6-8 minute marker, and adjusted it a bit and then it matched nicely.
And in fact, from that point forward throughout the rest of the intervals things are really very clean and actually some of the best tracking I’ve seen. If I were to nitpick a bit more, it looks like at the end of the first interval the HR strap properly reduces the HR quicker than the optical sensors by a few seconds, but nothing major. You’ll notice at the start of the 3rd interval I appear to ‘lose’ the connectivity to the Scosche. Said another way: The battery died and quite literally flat-lined.
But for the rest of the run, even during the very short/hard sprints at the end, the Fenix 5 is looking quite good.
Next, let’s look at another run (this time back home in Paris). This time a somewhat steady-state run, but it included some rollers, which means my HR was constantly shifting. Additionally, cadence was shifting a bit too as I’d go up/down slight inclines.
At a high glance, things track relatively close. But there are some quirks. For example, early on there’s a bit of separation, which I’ll give the HRM-TRI strap as being the more correct of the two.
And then into the run, if you pick it apart more closely you see where the optical HR sensor seems to be slightly overshooting and occasionally undershooting little shifts in intensity. It’s not massive, and only lasts a few seconds each time. But it is notable.
Most people would consider the above nitpicking, but it’s certainly worthwhile pointing out.
In general, most of my runs mirror the above results. Usually it’s pretty good, and usually it doesn’t miss any major moments. I have found in general if there’s going to be an issue, it’s almost always going to happen in the first 120-180 seconds. While I often wait a few seconds longer after ensuring an HR lock, I haven’t seen that have a major impact on my first few minute success one way or the other.
Next, let’s shift to a cycling. This is historically where Garmin’s optical HR sensors have struggled. I’m going to pick an outdoor ride, namely because you can check out one of my trainer rides below and see it performed almost flawlessly (the optical HR sensor). Outdoor is hard, indoor is easy. This ride was almost 8 hours long, so there’s lots of variability in pacing and such. So I’m really going to focus on one of the climbs I did, since that was a bit more intense.
Here’s that climb, once zoomed in:
You can see it definitely missed the first 4-5 minutes, being offset by about 20bpm (that’s a lot), but then it seemed to lock in pretty well for much of the rest of the climb, save a few moments here and there. Still, not quite ideal.
Next, another section of that ride before a break where a small group of us were rotating through at pretty high intensity for about 10 minutes or so. You’ll notice that it got the general plot correct, but was still off 3-6bpm for fair chunks of time.
And this is in general what I’d see. The Fenix 5 Elevate optical HR sensor is definitely improved over the first generation Garmin Elevate sensors (either via firmware or hardware) when it comes to cycling, but it still leaves a bit to be desired in this area. Personally, I’ll use a HR strap or other optical HR sensor (i.e. the Scosche) while cycling outdoors. For indoor trainer use, the Fenix 5 optical HR sensor seems just fine though (no vibrations on the road to screw it up).
So overall – I’d say things are pretty good (the best we’ve seen from Garmin’s sensor tech) while running, but a mixed bag while cycling. Note that Garmin doesn’t enable the optical HR sensor during swimming (either indoor or openwater), except to simply sample for your 24×7 HR. So while you’ll see the light go on and off, that data isn’t recorded to the workout file. Garmin has experimented more with this in recent months, but still doesn’t believe the accuracy is there yet to keep it on while doing swim activities. For that, you’ll still need/want either the HRM-TRI or HRM-SWIM straps to pair with.
Lastly, here’s a table of all my activities on final or near-final software from the last couple of weeks:
Garmin Fenix 5 Data Sets
Date
Workout Type
Data Type
Units Used
Comparison Link
Mar 22nd
Running
GPS Focused
Fenix 5 + HRM-RUN, Spartan Wrist HR, FR735XT no HRM
All of the above link to the DCR Analyzer data, where you can then dig into the individual activities in more detail if you’d like. Further, you can download the original data at the bottom of each page.
GPS Accuracy:
There’s likely no topic that stirs as much discussion and passion as GPS accuracy. A watch could fall apart and give you dire electrical shocks while doing so, but if it shows you on the wrong side of the road? Oh hell no, bring on the fury of the internet!
GPS accuracy can be looked at in a number of different ways, but I prefer to look at it using a number of devices in real-world scenarios across a vast number of activities. I use 2-6 other devices at once, trying to get a clear picture of how a given set of devices handles conditions on a certain day. Conditions include everything from tree/building cover to weather.
Over the years I’ve continued to tweak my GPS testing methodology. For example, I try to not place two units next to each other on my wrists, as that can impact signal. If I do so, I’ll put a thin fabric spacer of about 1”/3cm between them. But often I’ll simply carry other units by the straps, or attach them to my shoulder straps of a CamelBak. Plus, wearing multiple watches on the same wrist is well known to impact optical HR accuracy too.
Next, as noted, I use just my daily training routes. Using a single route over and over again isn’t really indicative of real-world conditions, it’s just indicative of one trail. So my training over the last nearly 3 months have covered over 61 workouts with the Fenix 5 in the following locales:
Cycling: Australia, France, Spain, United States Running/Hiking: Australia, France, Spain, Finland, United States Openwater Swimming: Australia, Spain Skiing: France, Italy
These have included the following condition types:
Dense forests, desert mountains, cliff-laden mountains, the highest peaks in the Alps, tons of city running/cycling, light forests/suburbia, generic dessert (flats), coastal roads, open oceans
Almost all of my activities are available on Strava from the last three months, and almost all of those are from the Fenix 5.
When it comes to the data I’m focusing on for accuracy details in this review, I’m going to mostly limit it to the last few weeks, since earlier data was beta data. Though even in earlier beta conditions, I rarely had issues with GPS accuracy. During the beta (where software is being worked on), the only issues I saw were related to openwater swimming – but Garmin has since addressed those. I also saw a weird quirk with respect to tunnels, which Garmin has also since addressed (or at least, I haven’t seen it again). Such as in my run yesterday it are tracked through this tunnel area.
So while I’m focusing on data from the near-term, since that’s largely on final/production firmware – this data is indicative of the kind of data I saw throughout my time period with the unit.
First, let’s just start off with a run. Note all this data is analyzed using the DCR Analyzer, a tool you can use as well. Details here.
This run is fairly straight-forward in that it’s along the beach in Barcelona, but I figure it’s a good place to start. Plus, I make some nice turns/loops near some buildings to add a layer of complexity.
While running along the main portion of the boardwalk, things were just fine – which is largely to be expected. It’s pretty open.
Once I got towards the end of this stretch of beach, I decided to do some interval loops around a set of buildings. These buildings, in particular along the roadway, would have me running within 1 meter of 6-8 story structures. A great place to see how well it could hold a track.
Looking at the above, the Fenix 5 most accurately tracked where I was. The Fenix 3 in second place, and the Spartan Ultra cutting the corners at every opportunity. The Fenix 5 even correctly tracked when I brain-farted and missed the turn at the very southern tip – having to turn back around slightly.
Let’s look closer though at going down the roadway next to the buildings (left side):
You can see here that the Fenix 5 easily threads the needle on this, keeping my track properly between the two sets of buildings. Good stuff. Interestingly however, each time I passed this massive lookout tower, all three units veered left (even though I stayed to the right). Clearly some sort of interference going on there.
I run this route a lot as a test route. And in particular I’m looking for a few things. First, does it correctly cross the bridge and not cut the corner. In this case, the answer is yes, it nails it.
Next, as I go down the tree and building lined canal – does it follow my track and not get distracted by large structures?
On the way in (right side), the answer is yes, it stays on the track quite nicely. On the way out (left side), it almost perfectly gets it, but then takes one diversion into the side of the building by about 5m, just as I crossed the road up against the building.
Next, how does it handle the tunnel, highlighted in yellow (about 200m long)? I’m looking here for it to not get distracted and go off into the buildings at either entrance/exit when it loses satellite reception. It does so better than the FR735XT, though not quite as nicely as the Suunto Spartan Ultra (though, up above the Spartan Ultra is in the buildings for most of the canal test area).
Finally, as I come back onto the islands, I’m looking that it manages to hold track without putting me in either the water or the buildings. This is another really tough spot because of the tight roads and tallish buildings. But it does well, without any issues.
Note, I would move onto a cycling activity – but I’ll be honest – they’re boring. And they all look perfect. So, rather than just showing you perfection, let’s nitpick something else.
So next, we’ve got an openwater swim. This one is an interesting openwater swim – and one I highlighted up above in the openwater swim video. I like it because it’s actually a fairly complex swim track. What you see here is the Fenix 5 on my wrist, the Fenix 3 on the swim buoy trailing above/behind me, and then the Suunto Spartan Ultra as well in the mix (it got started late, but we can still look at the track from that point forward). Here’s the overall track.
Let’s zoom into the first 1/3rd or so, and see how that looks.
You can see below that the smoothest is the purple line on the swim buoy, however the Fenix 5 is reasonably close to it. It bobs a little bit to the side here and there – though not a massive amount. This is common for openwater swim tracks as it’s not quite as precise as being above water the entire time.
Next, we’re looking at the middle section (passing another pier), when I properly started the Suunto Spartan Ultra. You can see that in general the Fenix 5 and Fenix 3 maintain the same dance. The swim buoy laden Fenix 3 is smoother of course, but the Fenix 5 is pretty darn similar. The Suunto Spartan Ultra isn’t really competing at this point. I don’t know what it’s doing, but it’s been a continual problem for me in OW swims. Suunto now has the unit and is trying to figure out what’s up with it.
Next, this last part where I come into this sheltered area behind the break wall. I selected this route on purpose, specifically because it was complex. And the two Garmin watches actually did quite well at mirroring not only each other, but also my exact track (interestingly, it’s here that it’s obvious the Fenix3 was accidentally in smart recording mode). In fact, technically the Fenix 5 actually correctly cornered the last turn around the rocks a bit more perfectly.
If we look at the final distances, here’s where they stand:
In this case the Fenix 5 had an overage over the reference track by about 180 meters. That’s a tiny bit more than I’d like to see (ideally I want it +/- 10%), though, it’s in the ballpark for openwater swim units. Note DO NOT LOOK AT the distance for the Spartan. Remember, that was started 500m into the swim (i.e. 1320m + at least 500m). So it’s already added a bunch of extra distance; obviously, it’s way off.
So overall, it’s not too shabby. I also included another two openwater swims in these sets down below – which gave comparable (or slightly better) results.
Note that I’m just highlighting the above three GPS data sets, but everything else is below in the table. I picked the above three because I felt that covered the most varied of conditions – and were also representative of what I saw on the whole. Some days/areas were slightly better, and some areas/days slightly worse. But nothing in terms of major outliers.
Here’s a table of all my activities on final or near-final software from the last 2-4 weeks. Note that in general, I’m excluding activities where I didn’t have multiple devices, or excluding activities where GPS isn’t involved (i.e. indoor treadmill runs or similar). As well as stuff from earlier beta firmware versions.
Garmin Fenix 5 Data Sets
Date
Workout Type
Data Type
Units Used
Comparison Link
Mar 22nd
Running
GPS Focused
Fenix 5 + HRM-RUN, Spartan Wrist HR, FR735XT no HRM
(Note: All of the charts in these accuracy sections were created using the DCR Analyzer tool. It allows you to compare power meters/trainers, heart rate, cadence, speed/pace, GPS tracks and plenty more. You can use it as well, more details here.)
Sensor Support (ANT+ & Bluetooth Smart):
The Fenix 5 series is the first Garmin unit to not only support a slew of ANT+ sensors, but also now supports Bluetooth Smart sensors. Previously Garmin would only utilize the Bluetooth side of the house for connecting to your phone via Bluetooth Smart. Now however, you can connect to both ANT+ and Bluetooth Smart sensors, assuming both follow published standards.
At present, the Fenix 5 supports the following sensor types:
ANT+ External Heart Rate Sensor
ANT+ Cycling Power Meter
ANT+ Cycling Speed-only, Cadence-only, and Speed/Cadence Combo Sensors
ANT+ Running Footpod
ANT+ Gear Shifting Profile (SRAM RED eTAP/Campagnolo EPS)
ANT+ External Temperature Sensors (Tempe)
ANT+ Lighting Sensors (Garmin Varia/Bontrager lights)
ANT+ Radar Systems (Garmin Varia Radar)
ANT+ Remote Display (Varia Vision heads up display)
ANT+ Muscle Oxygenation Sensor (i.e. Moxy/BSX)
ANT Shimano Di2 Gear Shifting Profile
ANT Garmin VIRB Action Camera Control
Bluetooth Smart External Heart Rate Sensor
Bluetooth Smart Cycling Speed-only, Cadence-only, and Speed/Cadence Combo Sensors
Bluetooth Smart Cycling Power Meters
Bluetooth Smart Running Footpods
Phew! Lots of sensor types!
Now, the most important wording I noted above was ‘follow published standards’. On the ANT+ side, this means either following specific adopted ANT+ profiles (i.e. the heart rate sensor or gear shifting profile), or in a few limited cases, following company-specific standards. For example, Shimano Di2 doesn’t technically follow the ANT+ gear shifting standard, rather, they’ve done their own thing. But they were the first to do that thing, so everyone supports it anyway.
Where things get messy is private/extended variants of standards, especially on the Bluetooth Smart side. For example – running dynamics. There is no standard on either ANT+ or Bluetooth Smart for running dynamic type data (i.e. vertical oscillation, ground contact time, etc…). Instead, Garmin uses private-ANT (just like Shimano does for Di2). And other companies like Wahoo with the TICKR series use private methods over Bluetooth Smart. These aren’t compatible. Meaning that you’ll get base heart rate data – but you won’t get any running dynamics stuff when using a non-Garmin strap. Maybe some day, but today is not that day.
The same is true of offline data, meaning the ability for a heart rate strap to cache/save data when not connected to a watch. Garmin uses this with the HRM-TRI/HRM-SWIM heart rate straps to save data while you swim, because it can’t send that data to the watch through the water. When connected again, Garmin uses the standard ANT+ ANTfs offloading capability to allow a watch to download that data. This is a published standard (and has been for more than half a decade).
However, others don’t follow this standard, and there is no equivalent published standard for offloading fitness data on Bluetooth Smart. Thus other companies do it differently. For example, both Polar’s new H10 and Wahoo’s TICKR-X can save data offline, as can Stryd, Suunto, and 4iiii heart rate straps. But none do so the same way on Bluetooth Smart, let alone utilize the ANT+ ANTfs standard for offloading.
Said more simply: You’ll need a Garmin HRM-TRI/HRM-SWIM strap to download data. And you’ll need either a Garmin HRM-TRI or HRM-RUN to get running dynamics.
Of course, folks could pressure both sides of the equation to support other standards. For example, folks could pressure Garmin to open up Running Dynamics to be an ANT+ standard for a variety of efficiency metrics (nobody has tried harder to pressure them to do so than I). And inversely, folks could pressure companies like Wahoo and 4iiii to support ANTfs offloading of data from the strap for offline access.
Finally – some might wonder if you can use Polar’s H7/H10 and other like straps that transmit heart rate signals underwater live, to do so to the Fenix 5 (underwater). The answer no. That’s because while underwater the Polar device doesn’t use Bluetooth Smart to connect to these straps, but rather an analog frequency (the same one used for gym treadmills and such), which Garmin doesn’t support.
Here’s a simplified FAQ section, since I’ve seen about 1,328 questions about this:
Will the Garmin Fenix 5 support running dynamics from my Wahoo TICKR strap?
No, see above for details. It will read the heart rate data just fine.
Will the Garmin Fenix 5 connect to my PowerTap P1 pedals via Bluetooth Smart?
Yes, they can. You’ll connect both sides (Left/Right) and the Garmin will properly track left/right balance. However, because there is no standard for Torque Efficiency and Pedal Smoothness on Bluetooth Smart, you won’t get those unless you connect via ANT+. The general guidance of *every* power meter company I talk to in the industry is given the option to connect your power meter over ANT+ or Bluetooth Smart, always choose ANT+.
Will my power meter work flawlessly over Bluetooth Smart?
I’m just gonna be straight about this now: This will continue to be a mess. Garmin has done a pretty good job in getting compatibility working for the dozen+ ways that power meter companies have adopted the Bluetooth Smart standards in power meters. In the few BLE power meters I’ve tested, they’ve worked. But I haven’t tested every firmware version of every unit out there – and I can guarantee some don’t work. It sucks. A lot. Garmin isn’t the only one shaking their head. Everyone is. Different companies handle it differently. Suunto has tried as well to just ‘make it work’ as quickly as possible, while Polar seems to drag its heels on making things work. Everyone I talk to in the industry here about this topic truly sighs and puts their head in their hands in frustration.
Who to blame is a mixed bag, but either way, the consumer is left holding said bag. The good news is that every power meter out there except the Polar power meters support dual ANT+/Bluetooth Smart, so just use ANT+ and don’t worry about it.
Will the Fenix 5 connect to my Polar strap underwater?
No; said Polar strap uses analog signals to broadcast underwater. Garmin doesn’t have that hardware in the Fenix series to connect to that.
Does this mean the end of ANT+?
Not likely. I do think it applies pressure to ANT+ though to maintain relevance, but I think they can do that through things like standardizing running metrics and stuff – thus encouraging companies to utilize the platform. But until the day comes where I can look back on the preceding 6-12 months and say that every Bluetooth Smart power meter (or cycling sensor) has worked flawlessly with every head unit (from a connection standpoint), then ANT+ will likely continue to do quite well.
Can I connect to my ANT+ FE-C trainer?
No, Garmin’s wearable lineup does not support connecting to/controlling via ANT+ FE-C. However, virtually all trainers that support FE-C also broadcast ANT+ Power/Speed – so you can still connect to those signals just fine. You just can’t control the trainer from the watch. For that, you’ll need another app/device.
Can I connect multiple Bluetooth Smart sensors?
Yes and no. You can connect multiple sensors to a Fenix 5 – no issues there. However, you cannot connect multiple devices to a single Bluetooth Smart sensor. So if you’re connected to your Bluetooth Smart heart rate strap with the Zwift app (on your phone), then the Fenix 5 will be unable to connect to it as well. That’s because Bluetooth Smart at this time cannot accept multiple master device connections.
Bluetooth 5.0 does resolve this (upcoming), but so did Bluetooth 4.1 – and nobody has adopted either from a sensor standpoint in the sports industry yet. ANT+ does not have these limitations, a key reason it’s used in gym/coaching scenarios today.
Bugs & Quirks:
I often include a section in my review about specific bugs and quirks seen in the product. From a software development standpoint, there’s often a fine line between a bug that needs fixing – and what the software industry calls ‘by design’. Meaning it’s not technically a bug, but rather something that’s designed that way (however sucky that might be). In my case, I’m going to call those ‘quirks’.
Given I’ve been testing a pile of units since the day it has come out, I’ve got boatloads of time on said units. Much of that time has been on beta firmware versions. In general, I’m drawing the line that I’m only going to cover bugs seen in the final production version of things. After all – that’s somewhat the point of beta – to rid itself of bugs. I have however been tracking bugs I saw during beta, and specifically validating those have been fixed in the production version.
Also, note that I’m specifically looking at issues *I’ve encountered* during swim/bike/run/ski/hike/daily use/etc… This isn’t designed to be the end-all-be-all of bugs that may exist in the product.
With that, here’s where I stand:
Bug – Connect IQ Issues with Stryd Running Power Meter: I get constant dropouts with the Stryd footpod using their Connect IQ Data Field app. Ironically I didn’t have this earlier in beta, but it surfaced in the last 3-4 weeks. At present this appears solved in the latest un-released beta, which will likely hit shortly. At least, it was resolved in my run yesterday (for the past month it’s been broke). I’ll cross this out once things publish to production.
Stryd Update (Aug 1st, 2017): This has slowly manifested itself more clearly to be limited to the Fenix 5/5S (but not the 5X or FR935). It also impacts a few other random sensors in edge cases, but is more obvious with Stryd. Stryd no longer recommends people use either the 5/5S with Stryd, and I agree. I’ve run countless runs with it and Stryd, and the experience just sucks as much as it has 6 months ago. It’s part of why I use the FR935 instead (I also like smaller watches). As for potential fixes, it sounds like that ship has sailed. Stryd doesn’t have much they can do from a chipset standpoint, and it sounds like Garmin pushed the boundaries of the chipsets in the 5/5S a bit too much from a reception standpoint. I asked for another update last week (July 27th) from Garmin on the issue, specifically asking if either a software or hardware update was possible, or if changes to hardware were being made. Here’s the response:
“We are aware that there are reports of ANT+ reception issues, particularly with some specific devices. Garmin is looking at ways to improve the performance, but there does not appear at this time to be a “quick fix” software update. We do anticipate future designs to improve support for identified third-party devices that are not consistently meeting expectations today.”
Translation: It needs a hardware update (and that’s based on talking to a fair number of people in the know). My bet here is that at some magical point in the future there will be a small but undeclared chipset change on the 5/5S. It’ll likely happen as quietly as the new manufacturer static testing procedures for resolving the Fenix 3HR altimeter issues (and why you don’t see those issues on other new units). And my bet is after that point folks can probably call in and ask for a swap of a unit without issue (like you can do now for those seeing F3HR altimeter issues). But I also could be wrong. They could just never update the chipsets involved and it’ll remain a broken scenario. The irony here being that Stryd is probably THE app that Garmin holds up most often as a Connect IQ partner, and they’ve essentially screwed them on their best selling and most premier device.
Bug – Drops in ANT+ Connectivity when Shimano Di2 Connected: This annoying bug manifests itself only when connected to Shimano Di2, which will cause near continuous drops of other ANT+ sensors (i.e. power meters, external heart rate sensors, cadence sensors, etc….). Note that this appears to be happening significantly less in the most recent software versions – but it is still happening enough to me that I can repro it. So I think they’re getting closer to fixing it.
Bug/Quirk/Something – Optical HR accuracy in outdoor cycling definitely leaves something to be desired. Running seems pretty good, outside of a few blips sometimes in the first minute or two.
Quirk – There’s no quick release kit: One of my top complaints about the Fenix 3, before they released one, and the same is true here. For a triathlon/multisport watch, it’s a pretty big omission. Hopefully, Garmin will be able to find a way to create a quick release kit, similar to what they eventually created for the Fenix 3. Obviously, this would likely block the optical HR sensor, but I think that’s a fair trade-off in a triathlon where you’re likely to be using the HRM-TRI heart rate strap for recording HR underwater anyway.
Now in some ways, what’s more important than the bugs I stumble on is how the company reacts to the bugs you stumble on. In general, Garmin has a pretty good track record of tackling software-focused bugs relatively quickly.
Where they have less than an ideal track record is tackling trickier bugs – such as one that seemingly popped up for some Fenix 3HR users this past fall – making their barometers pretty much useless. The company has dragged their heels for 4-5 months now (despite my constant reminders about the topic), and their most recent response is just as unhelpful. There’s a very real slice of the population who have units that just don’t work (there’s, of course, a far larger chunk of the population that are just fine). It’s these sorts of incidents that are less settling when they happen.
Hopefully though we won’t see any unforeseen major issues with the Fenix 5, and that any uncaught bugs are quickly squished. As is the case, I’m currently testing the next firmware version – which fixes bugs that while not impacting me, no doubt impact someone.
Product Comparison Tool:
The Fenix 5 is loaded into the product comparison tool. At this point I’ve consolidated the three variants into a single entry, since the tool focuses on features more than sizes. The variations are noted accordingly in the entry below. For comparison sake, I’ve placed it against the Fenix 3 HR, as well as the Suunto Spartan Ultra, and then the FR735XT. You can, of course, mix and match your own comparisons using the comparison tool here, thus adding products as you see fit.
Again – remember you can make your own comparisons using the comparison tool here.
Summary:
I think it’s fair to say that the Fenix 5 is the best watch Garmin has ever made. While it may not be revolutionary in terms of features, it’s more of a polished evolutionary update. After nearly three months of usage, there are very few items I can quibble about in terms of oddities or quirks. And the early feedback from all of you after you’ve had nearly two weeks of usage since Garmin has started shipping seems largely the same.
Certainly, there are little things I’d like to see changed – but those are actually mostly on the platform side. For example, the mobile app supporting route creation, or the ability to see better web/app trending on the new training load and recovery metrics. Similarly, if you come from something like an Apple Watch you’ll also miss the ability to get pictures from text messages on the watch. But that type of display/capability of course comes at a heavy price on battery life. Certainly not a tradeoff I’m willing to make yet.
And that’s a key thing to understand: Sure, the Apple Watch has a brilliant display that looks stunning. And it has many apps. But…it also lasts one hole whopping day of battery. Maybe two if you’re lucky. Watches like those from Garmin, Suunto and Polar are instead designed to last weeks and have battery for GPS activities over 50 hours. It’s just a different market. More importantly, they’ve got easy to use tactile buttons for numerous functions that the Apple Watch lacks (as do some Android Wear watches). Which isn’t to say there isn’t a place for an Apple Watch, there absolutely is. It’s just not on the wrist of a triathlete in an Ironman, nor on the wrist of someone on a multiday hike through the Alps.
In any event, I suspect that either the 5 or the 5S will become my daily watch going forward (I tend to like smaller watches over the larger 5X). The Fenix 5 has quick responsiveness, accuracy, and is easy to use. Simple as that.
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Hopefully you found this review/post useful. At the end of the day, I’m an athlete just like you looking for the most detail possible on a new purchase – so my review is written from the standpoint of how I used the device. The reviews generally take a lot of hours to put together, so it’s a fair bit of work (and labor of love). As you probably noticed by looking below, I also take time to answer all the questions posted in the comments – and there’s quite a bit of detail in there as well.
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And finally, here’s a handy list of accessories that work well with this unit (and some that I showed in the review). Given the unit pairs with ANT+ & Bluetooth Smart sensors, you can use just about anything though.
This is a dual ANT+/Bluetooth Smart cycling cadence sensor that you strap to your crank arm, but also does dual Bluetooth Smart, so you can pair it both to Zwift and another Bluetooth Smart app at once if you want.
This is one of the top straps I use daily for accuracy comparisons (the others being the Polar H9/H10). It's dual ANT+/Bluetooth Smart, and in fact dual-Bluetooth Smart too, in case you need multiple connectons.
Seriously, this will change your life. $9 for a two-pack of these puck Garmin chargers that stay put and stay connected. One for the office, one for your bedside, another for your bag, and one for your dog's house. Just in case.
This speed sensor is unique in that it can record offline (sans-watch), making it perfect for a commuter bike quietly recording your rides. But it's also a standard ANT+/BLE sensor that pairs to your device. It's become my go-to speed sensor.
This wifi-connected scale will track your weight and related metrics both on the scale display and in Garmin Connect (plus 3rd party apps like TrainingPeaks). It'll also then sync your weight to your watch/bike computer, to ensure accurate calorie data.
The HRM-PRO Plus is Garmin's top-end chest strap. It transmits dual ANT+/Bluetooth Smart, but also transmits Running Dynamics & Running Pace/Distance metrics, stores HR data during a swim, and can be used without a watch for other sports. Also, it can transmit XC Skiing Dynamics as well.
And of course – you can always sign-up to be a DCR Supporter! That gets you an ad-free DCR, access to the DCR Quarantine Corner video series packed with behind the scenes tidbits...and it also makes you awesome. And being awesome is what it’s all about!
Thanks for reading! And as always, feel free to post comments or questions in the comments section below, I’ll be happy to try and answer them as quickly as possible. And lastly, if you felt this review was useful – I always appreciate feedback in the comments below. Thanks!
Has anyone had any issues with the quickfit bands yet?
I’m leaning towards using a Nato as I don’t want to trust my £630 watch to a clip but then obviously I would lose the OHR but I would rather keep my watch than have OHR.
If I wear my F5 while at the gym doing strength training but didn’t tell the watch thi was an activity (that is, I didn’t start it with the start button) I see the F5 reports the “active calories.” If I then go and manually enter the activity on Garmin Connect and specify the time I did it, will this all be smart enough to know it was the same time? Or will it double couth the calories?
Ray,
What are the chances, if any, that Garmin incorporates a way for the Fenix 5 to connect to their new Inreach devices. What I mean is, if you are using both on a long hike or in a remote place, it would be a perfect solution to have the two devices linked via BT and you could get notifications on your watch without pulling out the Inreach. It would be great to send back a list of quick replies that you already have setup too
I think we might see that down the road, but the feeling I got was that right now the inReach stuff is more in the ‘let’s get the tech integration from the acquisition sorted’ realm, rather than the innovating on new stuff realm. If that makes sense.
Because I included side views in the comparison section?
And there’s approximately 100 other photos on my wrist, plus about 30 minutes of video footage, most of it on my wrist? Heck, the swimming video’s thumbnail pic is literally a side(wrist)* shot.
Hi Ray,
Great review. Any idea if you can turn off the navigation alerts on the 5? So just follow the breadcrumb line in peace, without being constantly told to turn right/left?
Thank you!
Tell me about it. This watch software miles behind the Fenix3. I could drag a track onto my Fenix 3 directly in Basecamp. This poor software isn’t compatible with basecamp routes or tracks. Pathetic. You have to export out of basecampimport into Garmin Connect, send to watch as a route and withstand a million turn by turn alerts. Please Garmin just make this watch work for hikers looking for at least as many features as the Fenix 3. Instead they make a million products that just look different but don’t actually differentiate.
Just learned from Garmin forums that my issue with Basecamp seems to be limited to the Mac version. Also learned a workaround: put the .gpx file in the NewFiles folder directly on the watch. So yippee – back to using Basecamp as my track/route source! Now to figure out the turn by turn alert on/off toggle…..
Great review as always Ray.
I’m getting old – visual/audio poor! I have the 920XT and have trouble with feeling vibrating splits. When racing the little man – don’t know if I’m behind or ahead – can’t see that small. So is the graphics / wordage any bigger and is there a difference in size throughout the range.
I’d splash the cash if I can see the bloody thing!
Thanks Ray
Simple question and disappointingly no reply. I’m either too old, too thick, just not in the gang or a combo of all. So I’ve gone ahead and bought one (with me pension!) and it’s all your fault if I can’t see the bloody thing! Have a great day :)
You’re taking a risky gamble! Fenixes are watches so small screen. And previous models didn’t score well. (the black screen one!!!) You can always return can you?
I run with an Edge on my lower arm. One screen has just 2 data fields. BIG!!! I don’t give a shit about what’s normal……
A fellow presbyope! The transflective colour display is pretty low contrast and I struggle to see it unless in bright sunlight or in the dark with the backlight on.
I have just bought a Polar M430 which has a much higher contrast monochrome display than my Fenix 3 HR and is a lot easier for me to see. No swim metrics as yet (though the wrist HR works well in the pool!). If they add the latter in a software update I can ditch the Fenix completely. I would then use the M430 for sports and my Suunto Ambit 3 Peak for hiking / navigation at which it excels.
I have written an app, field and widget for the long sighted on the Garmin Connect IQ site. Search under Presby! My virtual partner field is much more fun and very visible.
Ray, thanks for advice on using Bluetooth for Stages connection it wasn’t perfect there was a lot of drop out in the first ten minutes of ride but after that seemed to hold on consistently so I remain hopeful will be testing again in an hour.
I have a bug for you.. I thought I was going nuts, I keep switching off key vibes then I come to realise that at some point it has switched itself back on again. I can’t imagine this is a “quirk”.
Yes, it does, both. Just note that built-in temperature sensor is affected by your body heat when you are wearing it. You can connect Tempe, anyway (although I always keep misplacing the damn thing).
It may be somewhat early to say, but after a week of use, I am very satisfied with the F5. I have no problems wearing it day and night, and it has a great set of features and flexibility. GPS accuracy is good for me – yes it does wander off a bit more than desired time to time, especially when hiking/mountaineering, but for now it is always perfectly acceptable. Of course, others may have different (realistic or unrealistic) definitions of “acceptable accuracy”.
One feature I would like to see is the ability to change sports during a current activity without creating a pre-defined multisport activity. I think some FR series watches can do this, and it is certainly available in Suunto Ambit series. Sometimes I go out hiking, see a lake and do a bit of swimming, come across a trim trail and do some strength training, then hiking again, etc. As a kind of an outdoor and adventurer watch, it would be really nice to have this.
Ray had mentioned this capability in the article stating, “Also, you can just make-up a multisport mode on the fly by simply holding down the middle left button and changing the sport to something else.” But that is a little different than what the method described in the Garmin forum post about creating a hot key, unless the middle left button is now a hot key and has been defaulted to switch activities.
Rays said his method didn’t allow you to records laps within an individual activity (the lap button still only functions to switch activities, not record laps within activities). If the hot key method still allows you to record laps that is what I’d be looking for. Not only because it could let you capture laps (ie, turn-around on an out-and-back run leg of a triathlon) but also to prevent accidental presses of the lap button from irreversibly screwing up your multisport activity record (ie, an accidental press starting T2 when you are still in the middle of your bike leg).
It is probably just me, but I don’t see how to change sports using the middle button during an activity, for example to change from Climb to Swim. Still, the shortcut approach works perfectly.
I did a quick test, and the lap button does allow to record laps within an individual activity if you use the shortcut to change sports.
found out what was causing the issue – I have a wireless access point in my pain cave – a post on the Garmin forums mentioned this can interfere with ANT+ signals.
I was a little sceptical – but when I powered down the access point my 5X connected to the Kickr power immediately. Note that the 5X has no issues connecting to the Kickr Speed relay – just the Kickr Power. My F3 has no issues automatically connecting to either with the access point on or off. Weird.
Can anyone tell me what the battery life of the Fenix 5S is like compared with the Forerunner 630 in GPS only mode? Assuming the 630 is paired with a HR strap and optical HR is on for the 5S. I sometimes do bike rides that last up to 12 hours.
Hi there. I just got my 5x and was very excited about downloading some trail runs into maps. I tried it once and the watch totally froze up after I started the download from Garmin Connect. Had to do a hard reboot and try again…..same thing happened! Has anyone else had a similar problem trying to transfer a course from Garmin Connect to the watch?
I’m amazed with how much effort you’ve put to prepare this exceptional review. Well done, sir!
I have one question that bugs me.
I’ve seen that you were testing the Fenix 5 HR sensor in various conditions. Have you seen the Fenix 5 HR sensor working really bad in the cold while running? Any cases of locking on cadence or showing really bad figures? 3 months in the year I run when it’s really cold (below freezing), so this part is rally crucial to me.
I’ve checked the data sets you published but in case you didn’t have multiple devices you would not post the results.
Is it possible to have different units in different profiles?
Example: I track my runs in miles, but i do my workouts in m/km. Right now (920) there is no easy way to toggle, other that going into the system settings and setting it globally each time I want to change. What would be ideal is if this was a per-profile (app? activity type?) setting, so that the Run app would be imperial and then I could create a custom Workout on that was metric.
I sold my beloved Fenix3 and my Fenix5 arrives later today. In the meantime I’ve been using my 10 year old Forerunner 305. I’ve been looking at the tracks and am reminded at how good the GPS is on this unit. Better than my Fenix3 and probably better than the Fenix5 (time will
tell). Of course the Fenix5 does so much more and is beautiful as a standalone watch, but for GPS accuracy the Forerunner 305 is hard to beat.
Nice review, Ray!
Regarding the GPS accuracy, there are actually huge amount of data that could be used to dramatically reduce the statistical error. In fact, Strava (as other companies in this business) records the device name for every activity (see link to strava.github.io). Already now, there should be sufficient data to allow a very good estimation of the Fenix 5 accuracy. As soon as very popular events happens, tons of very comparable data are suddenly available (i.e. at the same location and with identical boundary conditions).
For sure, if such an “analysis tool” does not exist, it’s not because of lack of interest!
For some (obvious?) reasons, those companies are reluctant to release such “sensitive” information.
(If only their database would be fully accessible…)
P.S. However, a very “low level” visual analysis can be made by taking any race on Strava and by looking at the “flybys”. It gives already a good hint about the different device accuracies.
While you could find outliers in GPS accuracy (i.e. someone a mile over in a marathon), this older post of mine explains why it wouldn’t be of much use to use crowd-sourced data to determine GPS accuracy: link to dcrainmaker.com
Thanks Ray, it’s a very interesting post!
If someone wants to exclude races from the statistics, Strava Segments offers enough data to say a lot about GPS accuracy of different devices. I don’t expect any correlation between the use of a specific device model and the boundary conditions (like environment, weather, satellite position…), so the sum over all user data can be used without bias.
Moreover, the accuracy I was talking about it’s not the one you can naturally observe in the real effective paths followed by runners participating in a race. If the tracks remains within the street boundaries, I don’t think that anybody would complain about GPS accuracy. Take for example the most popular race in my hometown: link to strava.com
It has the particularity of entering different environments, like the narrow streets of the old town, as well as forest and open spaces. Practically all recorded tracks show systematically lower accuracy within the old town or the forest, with paths jumping far beyond the street boundaries (especially in the old town). However, results differ a lot from device to device. Just zoom within the old town or the forest to see what I mean: link to labs.strava.com
Key Performance Indicators as the accuracy, trueness, precision, as well as their “standard deviation”, could be extracted from data according to the different devices.
I’ve read Ray’s post about “Racing the Line” awhile ago and have referred other people to is when they’ve commented about their GPS results at a given race. I agree with the analysis…when applied to an individual athlete at a race. However, the Law of Large Numbers (link to en.wikipedia.org) suggests that if you had access to a large enough data set, you could in fact create a conclusion on relative accuracy of devices. Unless you assume systemic differences between users of different devices (all Polar users take the outside of turns and all Garmin users take the inside of the turn, or all Suunto users start their watches late), then the resulting averages between devices can be compared. Perhaps not directly compared to the official race distance for the reasons Ray outlines in his article, but certainly to each other. If one particular model’s average distance was significantly different from the other devices, it would suggest a tendency for poor accuracy for that model.
But again, it’s called the Law of LARGE Numbers for a reason…you’d need a sufficiently large number of devices in your pool of data. So individual anecdotes of poor accuracy carry little weight in my book.
Thanks Joe, that’s exactly what I meant.
There is no reason to assume a correlation between racer’s behavior and device. On the other hand, there are segments on Strava with more than 300’000 attempts! (As for example link to strava.com). There is enough statistics there to extract extremely significant results regarding device accuracy.
Moreover, once a good algorithm has been developed, nothing prevents a broad application over all segments (non-overlapping and featuring a minimal amount of attempts). We are already in the domain of Big Data and results would be extremely reliable…
I started reading and didn’t notice at first how ‘in depth’ the review was. Wow, what a long review! I did save it to my favorites because I need more time to read an view all of it ;)
I assume you’re talking about readability Michael. I had the same problem with my F3. Reading some of the small data fields, especially without glasses and/or in movement. I tested every watchface app available for the F3 that had the information I wanted in non-workout mode with larger fonts: HR, time, date, altitude and battery life were the most important to me on a daily basis. The best I found for the F3 was the “Optimus HR” watchface followed by the “HRwatch” and “NoFrills”. These all have some degree of customization available to them, including font options.
Watchfaces are not my problem – the data fields when running have, in my opinion, a font which is too thin to read while moving. The font of the Fenix 5 seems to be much bolder. There is a data field with bold font for the 3HR but you can’t customize it.
But thanks for the watchface tipps, I will try them!
I have found that the Fenix 5x HR during a run seems to run much higher then using a strap. The first few runs all were averaging at least 10-20HBPM higher then I would have expected for that pace. I tested it adjacent to a F25 with a running HR strap. While the average was close, the peaks were way off. Have you seen this at all during your runs?
Just to clarify – did you wear the FR25 on the same wrist as the Fenix 5, or on the other wrist?
If the same wrist, that can actually definitely lead to problems as noted. If different wrist, then that’s more of a wrist placement type thing to start troubleshooting. :-/
The Fenix was on the left and the F25 was on the right. The Garmin Runner strap was across the chest. I have used the Scosche RHYTHM+ with similar results as the chest, thus my concern on the wrist HR from the Fenix showing higher then expected HR.
I have the same results like Michael. Compared thru Running activity Garmin Vivoactive HR (on left wrist) with Fenix 5x (on right wrist). Fenix 5x is always 10-20 HBPM higher. I suppose, that the high weight of Fenix 5x is the reason. It is bouncing even tight bounded.
Thanks for the good and detailed review! Was first thinking about a 5x, but with the limited maps functionality and the bigger size (and price) I switched to a 5. So I just ordered the 5 and 5s (for the girl) from clevertraining.co.uk with the DCR codes.
I don’t see myself preparing all routes at home. So for the mapping I will just use Google Maps on my phone. I was hoping for the Google Maps functionality like on Android Wear, but it seems limited for searching addresses and planning routes.
“Which ultimately gets to my final point here: The 5X is very cool, and generally quite responsive. And if you’ve done enough planning it works out really well. Or, if you’re just in an area where the mapping quality is good. But if you’re not, then you’ve paid an extra pile of money for something that a $1 phone app tends to do a lot better.”
Anyone know if you can read notifications in non-English alphabets on these models? Specifically, I’m interested in being able to read messages in Hebrew.
Also if that will ever be possible with a firmware update on the Fenix3 HR?
” Each time your hand goes under the water, it loses GPS signal.”
That’s a show stopper for me, until they make a small GPS pod to go in your swim cap to relay with the watch. They should even have a swim cap with a pocket for the pod in the bundle !
“So what’s the FR935 all about? Well in a nutshell it’s a cheaper version of the Fenix 5, with a plastic shell as opposed to metal. Basically – it could be named the Fenix 5P – for Plastic. “
Does anyone know if the Fenix 5X will have a better antenna than the regular Fenix 5 because this would solve my issue of it not playing well with the Stages.
The reason I even ask is because the Fenix 3 had no issues before it so I wonder if the increased size of the 5X means there is room for a better antenna (or whatever the bit is that receives the signal), just a thought.
Thank you for the review.
Based on your experience, do you think there might be a risk that the 5X suffers the same fate as the Epix? Namely, not receiving regular firmware updates/support in the event that it proves to be less popular than the 5/5S?
Or is that risk limited by the fact that all three models might share a common firmware “core”?
Anyone notice the fēnix® Chronos is now a fēnix 5s link to developer.garmin.com
(I know Ray mentioned the update to chronos, but thought I’d mention that in terms of software its a fenix 5s)
Hi! Do u know what’s happened with battery life in UltraTrack mode, today just after they realised 935, they slide battery life in specification tab (garmin website) for fenix 5 from 75 to 60 hours and 5X from 50 to 35?
from manual:
Up to 12 days
Smartwatch mode with activity tracking and 24/7 wrist- based heart rate monitoring
Up to 20 hours
GPS mode with wrist-based heart rate
Up to 50 hours
UltraTrac GPS mode with gyro-based dead reckoning
From web page (Garmin.com)
Smart mode: Up to 12 days
GPS/HR mode: Up to 20 hours
UltraTrac™ mode: Up to 35 hours without wrist heart rate
I bought one of the newer HRM tri, HR bands for use with my soon arriving F5x. I planned to use it at times, primarily for the advanced running dynamics. These you do not seem to be able to get with just the optical HRM on the F5/F5s/F5x. I saw email from CT today, and it talked about a Garmin running dynamic foot pod, something I’ve not heard about (at all)> Seems like this might be exactly something I would want. it would provide the running dynamics, but the OHRM would still be in use. Is there a different use case for this pod? I search for a review here, but didnt notice one. Is it that new?
Ok. found my own answer. I must have posted this while the 935 and POD videos were being uploaded. This pod does seem to do exactly what I want. For those interested. Here is Rays’ video on the pod.
I hear you on the usefulness/validity of the advanced running data. That said, with the CT VIP discount, I have $69 sitting in the account. so maybe I’ll just apply that, and get myself an essentially free pod.
Hi Dcrainmaker,
First of all many thanks for the review. Thanks to you and went ahead and bought my first Garmin watch, the Fenix 5.
However, I took it out for a run today and the GPS. It made me run through a lake and through buildings. I have GPS and Glonasss activated.
I ran a 1km under a minute for example.
I’m posting a pic below.
Any help or guidance would be appreciated. I hope it’s not a faulty GPS unit.
For thos interested it looks like the 5s and the 5 have just as much ram available for connect iq and the 5X has way more ram to work with. With the 5x having as much or more in the case of a watch-app as the Edge 1000/820. 1000
Thanks for the info. Eli. I assume that means many more options and versatility with the different app software applications. Would that apply as well to the firmware update potential and abilities, especially for the 5x?
All it directly tells us is the limits connect iq apps are under. The much higher limits of the 5x tells us that the 5x can probably handle more powerful apps.
Think of a data field that works great on an edge 820/1000. May not be able to be ported to the 5/5s but may run fine on the 5x
Hi there, does the Fenix 5 monitor HiiT, boot camp, weights and circuit classes ok? I currently have a Fitbit charge 2 but would like to upgrade to this but want to ensure my class workouts are still monitored over and above just HR monitoring.
Thanks for the great review as always! I have been eagerly waiting for it to decide between the F5 and SSU. If you take OHR out of the equation, and you look at the current state of updates for the Spartan Ultra, is it a close call at all between the F5 and the Spartan Ultra, or is the F5 ahead by a sizeable margin? Note that for my personal needs (trail running, backpacking, etc) battery life and accuracy are more important for me than an exhaustive feature set. Thanks in advance for any thoughts!
Great review as always! I am curious if you happened to run tests on altimeter accuracy for the F5 vs F3 vs Suunto Ambit vs Spartan? In my experience, there is a pretty wide range in accuracy difference, especially when you start to use “fused alti” (and Garmin’s equivalent) vs manually setting reference, etc. Altitude accuracy is a critical need for my pursuits (mountaineering etc) and is in many cases more critical than GPS accuracy. Thanks in advance for your thoughts!
I’d been keen to know this too.
I do a lot of “Stair Climbs \ hill climbs”
Run up a flight of stairs.
Walk down, and the re-calibrate, repeat for 12 sets.
I;d say 50% of the time it has the correct altitude when at the bottom of the stairs / hills on the F3.
The Ambit handled it a lot better.
Hi. Great review. Thanks. I like the idea of
Training Status/Load/effect metrics: split of aerobic and anaerobic training effect. Do you think we will see it in fenix 3 firmware update or is it hardware dependent and won’t be possible on fenix 3?
Don’t know if it is possible but FaceIt for Fenix5 is limited to 16colors like Fenix3 (at the moment?)
Results are very worse than for Fenix Chronos which uses 64colors !
Don’t know if it is a bug or a limitation of Fenix5.
Ok I have tried like 5 different sites between, Garmin Connect, Suunto, Strava, Ridewithgps, Gaia GPS, and the basecamp app but nothing will import a GPX route with the waypoints and the elevation point. This is ridiculous. For a navigational company and a navigational watch, there is no reason why it should be this difficult. Suunto movescount site is so easy, you make a route with waypoints and sync. If I wasn’t inlove with the hardware and map feature on the 5x I would move back. I am very technically inclined, I cant image a non tech person to figure this out.
Yeah, the whole creation of waypoints continues to be a mess (I talk about the lack of mobile routes option a fair bit, but this is in the same camp).
Though, on the flipside, I suspect most people that have GPX routes with waypoints and associated elevation data are probably fairly technically inclined.
Got my Fenix 5sapphire today and one of the coolest features was that I could turn on backgroundlight based on motion. this is same feature the Fitbit has.
If I move my hand in a certain pattern, (like you do when you want to check out what time it is) the backlight turn on automatically
This worked great on Fw 2.00, but I updated to fw 2.4 and now the feature do not work anymore
I tried to toggle the setting on/off but no luck
Do anyone else got this to work on fw 2.4 ? Can I downgrade back to 2.0?
Thanks for the review, I enjoyed reading your review of the latest offering in the fenix series. I am using fenix 3 with Heart Rate Monitor. i use my fenix3 for CrossFit, Golf and occasional running. After reading the review, i am planning to upgrade but have few queries –
1. Does fenix5 let you create profiles for CrossFit?
2. Do you need to buy Garmin’s TruSwing Golf Sensor to record various golf swing metrics or does it work without the sensor?
3. Where can I get more detailed reviews related to Golf app on Fenix 5?
Great review.
Can someone confirm that the Fenix 5 can do the following:
Broadcast HR to an older edge 510 via Ant+ while at the same time still receive email and text notifications from my iPhone via Bluetooth?
In all past Garmin HR units, if you are broadcasting HR, all other functions are typically shut off. Like on on Vivo HR, Fenix 3hr, etc.
Ray good evening,
desperately need your help as I’ve been trying for hours
I bought through your site on CT the 5X
Came with the US maps, but I’d like to add also the EU map
bought EU Cycle map, and installed it through Garmin Express
It doesn’t show on the watch, and says there are no routes where I am now i.e. Europe.
I wanna keep US because I often go there, but how to get the proper EU map is a mystery to me
Oh, well, can’t install additional Garmin maps on the 5x, and alternative methods with openstreetmaps not practical with website closed at times, like for ex this weekend…
Back to clevertraining the watch goes!
Not sure how to install them (but I can guess), or how to verify if they are all there. But when I was in Garmin express, and I saw some links about maps, it appears to me that all the maps, US, EUR, etc etc were shown as already installed. I may have miinterpreted the info, but it it led me to believe my watch came with all the maps installed. I could check if someone tells me how.
Yeah, the OSM site being ‘down’ this weekend was odd, and honestly pretty darn unusual. Sometimes it’ll be delayed a few hours in a queue, but I’ve never seen it say like it did this weekend that it’s simply offline till Monday. I suppose that’s a good reason to donate a few bucks to their site!
(It actually impacted me as well, as I needed to grab the France maps for my Edge 820, after having put Australia maps on it for back in January).
Thanks for the – as always – very thorough review.
Due to a misunderstanding with the Stryd webshop I got a US version of the 5X so, because I live in EU, I have no maps.
I suppose it will be best if I either return the watch or download maps from the OSM site?
When downloading, should I choose “generic routable” or “bicycle routable” when I mostly use the watch for running?
And another thing: on the watch there are 3 different gmapsup.img files, a gmapcycle.img (2,15 GB) and a CustomMaps folder. Where does the OpenStreet map go, please?
I’d personally do bicycle, but I want to see if there are any tangible differences between the two in a hiking case.
Over the next few weeks in California it’s on my to-do list to write up a 5X-specific guide (or guide section for that other post). It’s a bit easier to do here since there’s tons of great trails right out my door…versus having to wander somewhere else.
I think I’d try both. The reason to worry about the cycling maps is that a lot of places forbid mountain bikes on certain trails. Where I live it’s rare, but there are a few trails (including the cross-Pennsylvania Mid State Trail) where mountain bikes are forbidden. So I’d worry that the cycling maps wouldn’t have these trails on them, and there’s no reason for a runner to be excluded.
What maps are loaded on the 5X originally? In the US there is the cycle maps: link to buy.garmin.com
Which are open street maps which could limit that maps to just cycling accessible areas (Though if it is just OSM why do they charge $50). The only other maps Garmin supplies are the topo and trailhead maps but not sure what comes on the watch as the web site doesn’t say.
For downloading your own maps, are you using link to garmin.openstreetmap.nl
? Seems like the features on the maps are the same (so no cutting out trails, roads, and the like) but just changes routing priority and the way they display (the TYP file). So I’d go with bike routable. link to wiki.openstreetmap.org
But if you just want europe maybe go with the non-lite version here: link to openfietsmap.nl
If you want to understand how TYP files can gretaly change a map even if all the data is the same: link to avdweb.nl
BTW Ray, when you do your extended look at the 5X can you do a simple compare with the HR from it. Thinking while the hardware is the same, a higher weight watch would move more and so be worse for getting a good HR. Is that true?
I just checked with Garmin customer support to confirm that the Sapphire 5 with the black silicone band comes with a extra YELLOW band. They confirmed the additional band but said it was BLACK (so apparently you get two black bands).
The review above says you get a YELLOW band which is far more desirable.
Is Garmin customer support mistaken? Has anyone ordered this variant?
Ray, excellent CT experience, just placed my F5X order and it’ll be shipping out Monday!
My understanding is that an HRM strap is only required to obtain Lactate threshold and Stress Level Tests, and for everything else, Firstbeat-related metrics, the optical HR is just as good as using the HR strap in terms of Running. Is this correct? Did you see any differences between HR strap results vs using OHR for the latest set of Fistbeat running metrics? As a runner, I’m hoping to skip wearing the HRM strap, but not at the expense of sub-optimal / inconsistent Fistbeat analytics/results. Any comments? Cheers.
Hi Ray,
Is this possible Fenix3 can support “Training Load and Stress metrics” or ” aerobic and anaerobic training effect” by firmware update?
Garmin is smart, every time release new product, It must has some new fashion function.
Thanks!
Is it possible that you post a Monitor-FIT-file from a Fenix 5 for download? Before buying a Fenix 5, I would like to check if my current software can process F5 monitor files. I have been able to validate F5 Activity-FIT files, but not yet monitor files, so I’d really appreciate it.
Finally got a f5 and am already really disappointed.
Stryd ConnectIQ datafield drops out a lot making the data useless and we have already started the massive Beta game that happened with the fenix 3, including updates to the GPS software.
I have had my 735XT for almost a year and have never had to load a Beta, Stryd ConnectIQ datafield almost never drops out and GPS tracking has been good without any updates from day 1.
As an initial user feedback I would not buy the fenix 5 if you are a serious athlete and the data is important to you. If you are a casual athlete and want a good looking watch, then it is probably OK.
Will be testing GPS today against 735XT with newest released Beta for f5 and if GPS performance is subpar compared to 735, mine is going back int eh box and back to CT.
I’m also very disappointed with the F5. I’m a first time Garmin user but the GPS is giving me a hard time.
I have got a replacement for the watch but the the same issues. I run in an area where there are high rise buildings which glass/mirrors.
I downloaded the beta and tested it again against my iphone 6. Overall did three walks. The differents is between 300 meters to almost one KM for a 3 km run. That’s off by 10 to 30%. Once the watch loses GPS lock, it just goes crazy. It takes me literally everywhere.
OK, tested with Beta from today and distance accrual was off by 6% and had multiple GPS dropouts over the course of a 5 mile run that I have run 100s of times with many watches. Even the fenix 3 was not this bad in the beginning. In addition Stryd ConnectIQ data continues to have multiple dropouts and I had with connection with my P1 pedals.
As a training tool this watch is not reliable. Back it goes to Clever Training.
Same issues here: serious drop-outs from my Powertap P1 pedals and the Stryd. The minute I grab something from my jersey pocket, for example, the signal drops completely. The file looks horrible and the averages are way off as compared to my Edge 1000 (by 30w). Just wondering if this is a hardware or a software problem?
Additional update: My Stages PM does not work at all. The F5 connects ok when hold the watch close to the cranks. But the minute I move my hands and leave them on the bar the signal drops. (Riding with my left hand hanging down is not all that comfortable and aero ;-) ). Will call Garmin tomorrow. Not cool.
Here is what Garmin will say: “Call Stages.” Then Stages will tell you “Call Garmin.”
Stages PM = weakest signal of almost all PM sold.
Garmin = increasingly putting in ever less sensitive antennas since many PM have very powerful signals, due to cost or size I don’t know why.
I’m bummed because although my Edge 820 still gets a signal from my Stages when on a bar mount I wanted reliable signal to my F5S Sapphire (whenever I get it, been 3+ months but who is counting) so that I could leverage the ability of the new F5 series to propagate training recovery information across sports (wish Garmin Connect could do this for me).
I have occasional dropouts too (P1 power pedals, stryd, wahoo speed rpm). Very annoying.
Never (…never noticed) happened on garmin 520 or polar v800 (bluetooth)
Same with Rotor 2inpower
Rotor said:
Thank you for getting in contact with us. The 2INpower signal is one of the strongest signal comparing to all of the powermeters in the market, which you can easily can proove with your Edge 1000 and the 920XT. Please make sure your 2INpower also has te
latest firmware version installed.
Garmin said:
In regards to your query, we are quite limited as to what we can assist you with here.
Garmin does not support Third Party Applications, Maps or Accessories, we can only provide help and support for official Garmin products.
I appreciate this was not the answer you were looking for however I can only apologise for any inconvenience caused.
Hello Ray,
Since the Fenix 5 now accepts BTsmart footpod sensor, is it possible, at least in theory, to use the Treadmill Smart Speed APP on iOS to send the pace signal so that the Fenix 5 would pick it up?
that app is normally designed to send the pace to the Zwift running application
Hi 6co,
i just tried pairing the TSS App to my Fenix 5 and I couldn’t get it to work. I tried it as a footpod, then tried it as a speed/cadence sensor, then tried it as a “Search All” sensor, and it never worked.
Have my own Fenix 5X now for two days. Thanks for the excellent write ups and videos. I’d be lost without. Truly amazing how much info the recreationalist has available now. I used CT and VIP, thanks for that tip. Used them to get my Neo last year as well. Paired with a Stages power meter, Neo, Tickr, and Sosche.
Seeking advise regarding the F5. I run in an area with tall buildings with mirrors/glass. Think something like Manhattan.
I just bought the F5 and it’s struggling alot in this area. It looks like the watch is teleporting all around when it loses the signal. What are my options at this stage?
1. Should I disable GPS? Can it track accurately distance without GPS?
2. Should I use a foot-pod as well as the GPS? My concern with the footpod, is that if the watch is switching to the built in accelerometer when GPS is lost, the technically the teleporations should not take place. Will the footpod overcome this obstacle? Technically, if the watch was switching over, then I shouldn’t get these teleportations at all. The watch should have some checks in place to determine whether the data is legitimate or not. For example, there should be an alarm bell when you’re running the 1KM in less than a minute. How will that be any different with the foot-pod? If the foot pod will resolve these issues, then which one should I get?
3. Should I go for a forerunner? I’m guessing that the plastic casing will improve GPS signal.
4. Should I opt for another watch? If you were living in the NYC area, what watch would you wear for mapping capabilities?
Many thanks for your response and feedback. I’m a first time Garmin user. My previous experience running was with phones. I had no idea that these types of issues could occur. I’m now stuck with a good watch that doesn’t fit my needs :(
I started my run today w 5% battery, admittedly low but I figured that my 235 allowed me an 8 mile run when intermittently notifying me of low battery
I finished my 4 mile run w no alerts, hit stop on the watch
Looked about a minute later to hit save, and the screen was blank
Now after recharging , the unsaved run details and history are nowhere to be found
The only record I see is “last activity” which shows time distance and pace but no detail
Clearly my fault but it would be nice for garmin to save the details of the current run before shutting down the watch, would also be nice to have low battery warnings ala the 235
So I could know when driving on empty, exactly how many run miles I can actually do
Okay, this question is for anyone, not just Ray.
Based on what we’ve seen so far, is the 5X worth getting if I want it for running, cycling, general cross training workouts, and hiking? First impressions were that it’d be great for our frequent hiking excursions, a nice alternative to pulling my phone out to make sure we’re on the right track (which got real old in Colorado last summer). But the more I look at it, I’m not sure how useful the maps would be in that kind of a situation, especially not being touch screen.
Thoughts? Any input from the community is appreciated.
Are you asking about the size or the quality? I have an Epix, so the screen on the 5X should be at least as good if not better. The screen on the Epix is very good, much better than a phone in full sunlight, somewhat deficient in low light conditions. The maps are quite useful, and give plenty of context (I use Garmin’s 24k TOPO US and openmtpmap.org maps on mine). Topographic lines are legible, but the Epix doesn’t do relief shading (and neither does the 5X as I understand it). It looks like what it is, a tiny full fledged map on your wrist, but I find it big enough. The Epix does have a touch screen, but I rarely use it. The only time I’d miss it is when zooming in and out, but that you can easily do with the buttons as well.
If your hands are free, handhelds are better for hiking, since they can be clipped somewhere within easy reach, but they’re not good for running. Cycling is better done with a dedicated cycling unit, but the 5X can do everything an Edge can except be easily visible when cycling (especially if you’re using the built in HR).
Yeah, it was more a question about the maps, and their quality/usability on the watch. I saw another review which brought up the idea of getting the 3, or lower level 5 for the fitness stuff, which is fantastic, but then getting a really good quality Epix to take hiking. His big issue was not being able to adjust maps quickly because you have to use the buttons, since the 5 isn’t touch screen. We’re doing more hiking as my kiddo gets older, so I’m wondering if I should just put down some money on a dedicated GPS (and yes, we have paper maps too as a backup :). Thanks for the input on the functionality. It seems like it may be one of those that i really need to test in the store to see how it works for me personally.
I really do like the all around fitness functionality of the Fenix watches, since they can also be worn out and about without looking out of place.
That’s the best thing to do. Go somewhere where you can actually see the screen and compare devices. The 5X can certainly do everything you want, but it may not be the best choice for you (and just one device may not be the best choice). I use my Epix only for cross country skiing, hiking (actually, just long dog walks in places more interesting than where we typically go, no longer than a few hours), and recording tracks for photo geotagging (up to 14 hours at a time). I use an Edge 1000 for cycling. I rarely take the Epix cycling, and it’s never the primary device.
Right now I’ve got my Casio Pathfinder, which I love, a Garmin vivofit for steps/everyday workouts, an Edge 500, and then my phone with AllTrails for hikes. The problem in CO was that the phone on it’s own would be dead by the end of the day, but when I had the juice pack on it, it’s so bulky and not the easiest to get out of my pocket. I’ll definitely give the Fenix 5x a try when i start seeing it around.
Thanks again for the suggestions!
I use my Fenix 3HR for my interval running training and I’m training on PACE e.g. 4:30/km. In winter times and running on open streets my Fenix is quite accurate. Right now the trees are filling with leafs and my pace isn’t that accurate anymore. My old Forerunner 610 is in that case much better.
One of the reasons to buy the 5x is the GPS accuracy before HR accuracy so I’m curious how the Fenix 5x performs in this case.
I moved up from the F3 to the F5X just a few days ago and did my first cycling with the F5X. I used GPS + Glonass and it was right on except one spot where I veer off of the bike trail and go across and open field most of the time, The F5X got it right on my out bound ride, but put me on the bike trail on my return ride(when I took the open field instead of the trail). I think the heavy leaves on the trees confused the GPS/Glonass signal, because on one edge of the field is sparsely covered of trees and the other way has heavy coverage of trees before entering the field. That was the only mistake it made. Next ride I’m going to try UltraTrac, just to save battery life, since I don’t vary my routes that much or that often. I’m sure riding a bike at 13-16 mph also gives the F5X tracking/GPS more of a challenge than a running or jogging pace. I’d say the F5X is at least as good as the F3 based on several days of playing with the GPS and tracking in the car and with one cycle ride under its belt, plus the maps are awesome.
UPDATE: Just finished my first UltraTrac ride with the F5X. But before I get into that let me add something I left out in my first response. When I had a problem with GPS tracking because of heavy foliage, there was another effect I forgot to mention, before I come to one side of the field, I’m riding on the bottom of a 70′-80′ cliff along with heavy foliage, which means probably no GPS tracking at all for about 3/4 of a mile. The cliff side would knock out approximately 1/2 of the view of the satellites available for tracking since it covers 1/2 of the vertical sky view and heavy foliage probably takes care of most of the rest of satellite views. All that said the UltraTrac actually works as well in some respects as the GPS + Glonass on the F5X, which is really a surprise, but with different results. When I used UltraTrac on my F3hr it was totally lost and would read 25%-35% less mileage than my actually route(a route I’ve ridden 100’s of times over the years and know the mileage and time). With the F5X running G+G the mileage was exact, but the route missed one of my turns off the trail, across the open field on one leg of the route. With the F5X on UltraTrac the mileage was down about 7-8% of the actual route distance, but for some reason it seemed to follow the course all the way on the mapping of the route. That doesn’t make sense to me how it can follow my course, yet miss part of the distance traveled. I assume is has something to do with the calculation in the UltraTrac formula. I assume it just follows the bike trail that is on the map until it determines otherwise, so when it loses me with the overhead blockage of satellites, it just assume I’m on that bike trail, but it still doesn’t get the distance exactly right. Evidently, it doesn’t measure distance on the map, only distances when I’m in motion and then it has to calculate an estimate of that since it cannot track me the whole distance. Interesting results, but I’ll need more rides to confirm my theory.
I’m thinking of moving on from just running to swimming and cycling, and I was thinking of getting a multisport watch. I already do a fair bit of hiking so the fenix looked like a good option. I was wondering, should I bite the bullet and get a fenix 5, or should I save my money and go with the 3HR? And also, is the sapphire model of either worth it? does it really extend the life of the unit?
Sapphire screens are more scratch resistant (although still possible to shatter them by dropping on a sharp object), but for normal use the bezel usually provides sufficient protection. If you are regularly hiking through heavy scrub, scrambling on talus or rockclimbing where scratch potential is very high, then sapphire makes a lot of sense.
For ordinary running and cycling, sapphire should not be required. That said, buying a phone screen protector and cutting it to size seems like a smart way of protecting a $600 watch.
Thanks for the in-deph review, super detailed as always. I assume there will be a quick release kit for all three models? Most triathletes use the unit as a bike-computer as well although all the fenix 5 models now have optical HR, I still prefer the HRM-tri strap. Has this just not been released yet? I can’t see it being compatible with any of the older unit quick release kits due to the different strap withs?
Thank you for your very helpful review DC.
Does/can the 5X have/do live power curve estimating/averaging, if you do not have a power meter?
Just pre-ordered mine – really looking forward to it’s arrival.
Thanks again, GP
Is anyone else getting ridiculous calories burned readings mine are off the scale but not all the time for instance I commuted to work today under 10 mins and one way was 337 and the other was 76 (realistic) was barely moving. Then tonight done hour and a half not mega intense it’s thrown out over 2,000. Come on this isn’t right is it? I’ve disconnected it from MyFitnessPal pal as it’s not helping me balance at all. As an aside and support for how ridiculous the kj from my Powermeter do not corroborate the readings even ballpark.
No never changed my birth date in there but checked it anyway as well as gender. I also checked I hadn’t put my weight at 860 kg ? Just had a thought though… every time I check these things the lifetime athlete flag has been unchecked so just recently I selected again that I am a lifetime athlete. I’m not sure what that flag does but is this having a baring? my real confusion however is that in the same day on the same ride (opposite direction) the calculation for calories appears correct on one ride and not the other, luckily so far off that it’s immediately obvious.
I thought my calories burned (as viewed in MyFitnessPal) were quite high. that when I learned that while garmin shows a calories burned thus far during the day, MFP will calculate the total end of day calories burned and display that number. Then it does some other math. I read about that here:
I had a garmin 235, i run, ride and swim, obviously i run & swim with the watch(connect iq app for swim and i used trainer road on my iphone for trainer sessions…..so my swims and runs end up on garmin connect>>>strava and trainer road syncs with strava therefore i can see my fitness freshness on strava
however now i have a fenix 5 it will be tell me all the training load info as you describe above but unless i use it to record my indoor rides these wont affect the training load info, and if i use my fenix 5 for the session i’ll end up with two uploads to strava…duplicate activity
does this make sense and is there a way around it?
i’m guessing stop trainer road syncing to strava and record the activity with the watch there fore getting accurate training load and let garmin connect do all the syncing and get accurate strava metrics and no duplicates
I originally had a Garmin 910 and used the feature whereby we could insert co-ordinates and navigate with an arrow to them (for surfski races). When I upgraded to the 920, it seems that option was lost. You could only save a location and had to actually visit it first. Do you know if you can insert co-ordinates and run the arrow like set up on the 5X?
I’ve been for a few swims with the Fenix 5 and noticed that garmin connect consistently displays lap pace on the top graph that is faster than the actual pace per the detailed splits. It seems this also happens on my friend’s fenix 3. Is this an error or does the watch try to strip out the push/glide phase for the graph?
I’ve also set up an alert for each lap and noticed that it vibrates really late into each lap (eg quite a few strokes in) – where does the watch actually measure a lap from? Is it the end of the push off? Or is the alert just late?
Thank you for your in depth reviews, they have been very helpful! I recently acquired the new Fenix 5, and I’m very excited about it!
One thing I can’t quite figure out is how to do two different sports without saving in between (not multisport). Let’s say I want to ride my bike to the gym and ride home, and another day I ride then run, and another day I run then ride. I don’t want to create a multisport for every possible combination, what if I decide to do something different on the fly? With my 910, I could just change the sport and it would save them together. Is that option not available on the Fenix 5?
Thank you for all your hard work!
i have the fenix 5 sapphire on pre order and i currently use the fenix 3HR.. i run in a lot of river valleys here in Oregon and tend to have inaccurate GPS results… also my cadence has become increasingly important to me..
so my question is.. is there a benefit of using the garmin foot pod along with the HRM run (which i currently use)?
My experience is that the HRM Tri (same accelerometer as HRM Run) has very good and immediate cadence data to the unit. The big difference in my experience is that in the past my pace from the foot pod was very accurate and immediate. Without the foot pod I could not rely on the pace data even with very strong GPS coverage, average pace was ok though. The foot pod accelerometer had very good stride length accuracy and therefore the pace was very accurate. It seems the HRM Tri or Run rely on the GPS data for stride or distance information and only measures acceleration in the vertical plane.
If you want accurate and immediate pace information there will definitely be a benefit in using the foot pod as well.
if i understood it correctly in the new Garmin pod video, Ray shares the cadence doesnt come from HRM, but the wrist unit. I think it mentioned its a common misconception. I might have misheard him, but if its true, then not sure its likely that anything but the footpod would help with stable cadence/pace
Cadence can never come from HRM, as in heartrate data. It is measured by a Garmin HRM sensor, a cheststrap accessory. A typical F5 user won’t have that.
If F5 is measuring it then it’s not a result of HRM. And not too accurate either cause why else is there a new footpod introduced?
A) Wrist itself (in the watch)
B) HRM-TRI or HRM-RUN straps
C) Footpod (ANT+ or BLE)
D) RD Pod
Cadence is pretty accurate in all of those. However, if you hold your wrist up for extended periods of time (such as while holding a camera), it can and will impact wrist measurement. It doesn’t have much of a tangible effect for anything else.
Pace can come from the following sources:
A) GPS
B) Wrist based accellerometer pace
C) Footpod (ANT+ or BLE)
Pace cannot come from:
A) HRM-TRI or HRM-RUN or HRM-Anything
B) RD Pod
My general rule of thumb is that wrist based cadence is perfectly fine for virtually everything. Wrist-based pace is usually fine in tunnels and such at your normal running paces. I find that if doing interval worksouts on a treadmill and at the extremes of your running paces (high or low), that you’ll see some deviation on wrist-based pace indoors w/o GPS.
Is de strap doing anything? I thought it was just the sensor. And that there was something else but what? in the strap (reason why you also have to moisten one side of it)
Pace is the speed? Not good to hear that HRM-run doesn’t do this.
Maybe you should also add the running dynamics. For what they’re worth……
Has anyone been able to connect the Strava Live Segments to their F5x yet? I tried the other day and either it doesn’t work, or I’m doing it wrong. Any help? Thanks!
I bought a Fenix 5 and took it for a test run with my super cheap TomTom on the other wrist.
Does anyone know what’s wrong with the Fenix here? (It’s the orange line as you can probably immediately see): link to i.imgur.com
It’s leaving up to 7 second gaps between the GPS sample points, giving this very low resolution track that completely misses small curves. I didn’t use Ultratrak mode.
The TomTom is taking a sample every 1 second and obviously looks smoother and more accurate. (And this surely can’t be smoothing done after the fact, because it wouldn’t have captured the S shaped curves).
Never mind, apparently by default it does ‘smart’ recording which I assume produces that mess. I’ve switched it to 1-second recording now, and will try again tomorrow.
I received an update from Clever Training on my Fenix 5 February pre-order last night stating that Garmin is experiencing “unexpected production delays” and that further units are only expected end April. Are you aware of any problems with the current units or any other reason for these delays? Thanks!
I just got a ship notice from REI for my 5X.
I’ve been having a loud internal dialog about if I still wanted the 5X vs. a regular 5 or even the FR935.
I thought I still had at least a few more weeks to come to a solid decision, but no.. the 5X should be at the house when I get home today. Man, damn 1st world problems.
Any idea if the WiFi now meets none US specs. The F3 has a problem in Asia because Asian specs allows channel 12 and 13 and presumably the F3 was built to US specs. Or at least the one I bought from an official dealer in Thailand was. Even in Asia many people just use the restricted US spec routers but most cable companies now use routers that support the full range of WiFi channels. If your Router selects channels 12 or 13 it wont connect to the F3. It may be that the new WiFi chip now understands regions. Garmin Thailand Wont actually acknowledge the problem with the F3 so i cant see the point in asking them about the F5.
Just bought this, overall impressed. However, I had a great feature on my Vivoactive HR where I could enable phone call notifications only when exercising. On the Fenix 5, it seems to be only call or all notifications. If I could just disable call notifications I’d be happy, but it doesn’t seem to have this functionality. Do you happen to know if greater configuration of notifications is planned or if it’s actually there and I’ve just missed it?
Ray,
Still waiting on the battery test?
Also, do you have any info on why Garmin changed the battery life spec sheet on their site? F5 went from 100-60 and 5x went from 75-35? There is no way the 5x only gets 35 hours in Ultra-trac mode
Sorry, just got slammed this week trying to get everything out (and last week with the FR935 too). I should be able to place them atop the roof tomorrow for the weekend after I get final comparative shots for my Suunto Spartan Sport Wrist HR review.
It’s also on my list to find out what the deal is with the downward revised battery numbers.
about revised battery life numbers
this is from Asia manual, even lower
How told Asia Garmin representative on call, they use different battery inside watch for asia, which sound insane for me
fēnix 5 Battery Life
Mode
Up to 2 weeks
Smartwatch mode with activity tracking and 24/7 wrist-based heart rate monitoring
Up to 21 hours
GPS mode with wrist- based heart rate
Up to 44 hours
UltraTrac GPS mode with gyro-based dead reckoning
after this weird call, I sent a letter to Garmin Asia, and call them again, after they eventually replied
this looks more reasonable
“For your information, the average battery life of Fenix 5 is in between 21 – 24 hours. US version stated 24 hours was based in theoretically statistic while Asian version stated 21 hours is based on actual field test. But both version share same hardware battery. As for UltraTac mode, it can last up to 60 hours with WHR off but only can reach to 44 hours with WHR on. “
Personally, I would prefer it to the 5. The length of the straps seems too small and that was my hesitation. One guy did post photos on this F5 preview on this website of how it fit him. Garmin did not choose to offer the 5S in two different length straps. I also don’t know if I can handle the size of the 5 as I am a tennis player.
I have tried the 5 and 5s in a shop, but couldn’t really decide straight away.
I’m a tall man of almost 2m, rather slim and my wrists measure 18cm.
The 5s certainly fits – the band is short, it has only 1 loop but it fits easily around my wrist. A caveat is that if somebody wants to wear it above e.g. a neoprene suit this might become tight.
The 5 is slightly bigger, and the band is certainly much longer. It has 2 loops and when I close it around my wrist the tip of the band almost goes back to the watch itself. The couple of millimeters extra in band width give it a perception of being more “solid”.
I am inclined to get the 5S because of the smaller size. One thing that kept me from deciding on the spot was that the 5 is a actually bit more “balanced” in its proportions. The 5S is smaller but basically the same depth/height, so it appears to “stick out” more, if you understand what I mean.
@ your concern of too small: I am wearing a Submariner as my day-to-day watch, and it’s the same size as the 5S.
I also like the size and look of the 5s better than the 5 or 5x, because I will wear it for all occasions 24/7. What made my decision not to get the 5s was battery life at only 8 days in watch mode. My suspicion is these durable well made watches will only last as long as their batteries, which would be expensive and cost adverse to replace if not under warranty. I’ve been working with and testing lithium batteries as a hobbyist and with my son (graduate degree in electrical engineering) for over 10 years. There are numerous things that will shorten the life of a battery, but number one is number of recharges, usually 500-1000 for lithium, depending on quality of battery and an array of other factors. So in theory the 5s is going to have almost one-half the useful life of the 5 or 5x based purely on long term battery life and it cost the same price. Based on that I chose the 5x for both long term battery life and TOPO maps.
Men are absolutely getting the 5s. I did. A Rolex Submariner is 40mm, which is a plenty substantial watch for a man. I actually think the 42mm of the 5S is still a big bigger than I’d like ideally. In any event, I think the 5s looks much, much better for daily wear than did the 3. If I swap the band out for the 5s during the day, it looks fine with a suit.
The only downside I see is that it has such a skinny bezel. I wish it were the same size but with a beefier bezel. It wouldn’t take up any screen real estate because there’s already that black border.
I have the F5S with sapphire screen and black band. Great looking watch with impeccable build quality. My only criticism from a design point of view is that the lugs protrude out a fair way, making the watch look quite tall and slightly out of proportion with the relatively small watch face. I also think the band is slightly short even for my skinny wrist, and could do with being slightly wider to offer more support whilst running. Out of the 5S/5/5X this is the only watch I considered as the others would be too heavy for sports.
How does the use of sensors affect the battery?
Fenix 5 (1s) will last 24 hours
But how much can hold a battery with a sensor attached or a few
Tempe, footpod, RD pod, HR strap, STRYD?
Number of sensors increases battery consumption?
It would depend on if in UltraTrac mode or not. In UltraTrac it would, but not likely 24hrs with 1s GPS.
Note that generally speaking there’s no impact difference between 1 sensor and 5 sensors. There does however tend to be a slight impact on battery for Connect IQ apps/data fields (more for apps).
I’ve checked in the past on a number of other watches, there’s virtually no impact. In fact, I’ve even done some tests that show you can easily get upwards of 100+ hours recording time in GPS-off mode with the sensors on the entire time. And that was years ago – it’s far better now.
The reason is that the chipset is already powered up, so adding sensor load is such a trivial amount that it doesn’t even rank compared to powering up the display and GPS.
Hi,
Between the three models and the forerunner 935. Which one have better or more accurate GPS?
Will a plastic bezel offer better GPS signal than a metal bezel? And will the small metal bezel of the 5S offer a better GPS signal than the other models including the FR 935?
Can anyone confirm if I collected this info correctly?
approximates:
3 (saphire): 51mm case and 198g with metal band
5s: 42mm case and 125g with metal band
5: 47mm case and 156g with metal band
Chronos: 49mm case and 184g with metal band, 103g with titanium band
The only thing I can confirm for sure is my F5x weighs 148g with a titanium band and my F3hr weighed approximately 138g with a titanium band. The Chronos at 103g with titanium band sounds a little light, because my titanium band weights about 50g. The Chronos does come with a titanium “hybrid” band, which is a little different than the regular titanium, but I think 103g is probably a little low for Chronos with titanium.
I live in South Africa and am considering buying a Fenix 5x from the U.K. Whic I assume will have built in European mapping. How easy is it to cahna and put on South African mapping?
Updated to 2.9 last night and 3 of my sensors were lost including just the Bluetooth connection to the stages, Jabra elite headphones but most surprisingly my Garmin HR strap. The first 2 have found and connected but my Fenix 5 won’t even find the Garmin strap to add it to my sensors. I am one hour into ride so as you imagine it should connect. As usual the edge 1000 connected it instantly as usual. I think it might be time for mine to go back as it will think I’ve had a day off tomorrow and past 2 weeks learning willl be out the window. Unless anyone can help with this issue ??
Any help gratefully received and thanks to replies to my previous queries, Vince.
One thing I miss from my TomTom is the ability to set a distance (albeit it was a pita to do) and get an alert at 50% and 90% so for example if I was doing a 20km run I’d get an alert at 10km and 18km. I wonder if a ConnectIQ app could do that ?
Here’s a 5s with a leather strap. It’s a one piece, which makes it easy to swap for silicone when I work out, but it means I lose 24/7 monitoring, which I don’t care about. I suppose you could get a super long one piece strap and fold it back on itself if you wanted to get HR.
I like that type of band, one piece snap around the wrist type. I wore a band like that in high school and college while competing in middle distance races and cross country, in those days there was no wrist HR. I wore a combo watch with stop watch combo and it worked great for workouts and competition. Out of all the scores of watches I’ve owned over the decades that was probably my favorite watch band. BTW, where could I find that band today? Thanks.
This is the type of band I was talking about. It’s a metal clamp type cuff band inside and a leather exterior and it just snaps around your wrist. It makes it easy to take off and put on and it never feel off. But of course you lose HR.
I did some testing with recording in UltraTrac both in “Smart” and “1s Recording” and I can’t tell any difference in the detail (mapping) or otherwise. I did see differences between GPS+Glonass and Ultra Trac in (map) detail, but not within Ultra Trac with different recording selection. There could be a subtle difference, but I couldn’t tell it on information I tested. I suspect the Ultra Trac overrides the recording selection.
Where is the GPS setting to change from smart to 1s? I’m not seeing it anywhere. I only see where you can change from gps to gps/glonass within the activity settings.
Got my Fenix 5X this week and both outdoor runs I’ve done were well over the 10-minutes required to trigger a VO2 max reading, however nothing is showing up. I thought the wrist HRM never flipped to the chest strap on the first run, so I turned that off for the second run and everything recorded great off the chest HRM, yet no reading after running for over an hour. Any ideas or suggestions on how to maybe fix this? Garmin customer support is closed on the weekend, so I’m not able to contact them until Monday. Thanks!
Hi Josh, It’s weird, but it finally started showing up after I recorded a quick, 24 minute walk with my dogs. Who knows why it didn’t record on my run earlier that morning, but it looks like it’s finally good to go. I’m hoping the training load data starts populating tomorrow or Wednesday as I received the watch last Tuesday. I’ll update once I see what happens.
Hi Ray – thanks so much for all of your reviews. I’m an over-analyzer so it just feeds the fire :) I have a 235 that I have been satisfied with. I use it for running, and general working out (HIIT, spin, etc.) knowing that the HR might not be totally accurate but it and the step/calorie burn ballpark are adequate for my needs. And of course, pace for runs.
The only reason I would upgrade to the 5s is for wearability. I feel a little bit awkward wearing the 235 to > casual dress events, and it looks like the 5s (maybe due to bevel) has a much more appropriate face for a woman’s wrist and generally better aesthetics.
I realize comparing the forerunner and Fenix are kind of two different beasts, but really is there any way to justify a $300 upgrade to the Fenix 5s? As in – is there anything on the Fenix that would be a noticeable improvement for my usage that I can use in my justification argument to my husband? Thanks.
ok Ray….
I did some battery test this weekend and these are my results…They are not good…
23:30 for 1sec recording with OHR on BT off(good test, what it should be)
28hr for Ultra-trac recording with OHR on and BT off ( 28hrs? are you kidding me, how is it only 4 more hours when the GPS is only on every 60 sec instead of 1 sec?)
That is unreal. You stated in your “hands on” that the watch was supposed to do atleast 50 but more likley 75 hours. Now Garmin has even adjusted their website of 50 down to 35hrs. Something is going on here and its not good.
Also, to clarify – with the 1s and OHR on, what was the recording scenario? Meaning, were you inside at any point by chance? Or was the OHR on your wrist the whole time?
The reason I ask is that if you were inside for a portion of that, that would significantly impact GPS battery life. When you go inside the unit attempts to compensate for what it believes is poorer sky view conditions, by increasing power to the GPS.
The scenario was this.
-Charge the device to 100%
-Go outside and select an activity with 1sec recording.
-Make sure it got GPS lock and set it in the spot for view of the sky.
-When that was done (22:30hrs in the watch was at 4%) I brought the watch back inside and charged it back up to 100%
-Repeated the steps but instead changed the activity (hike) and verified the GPS recording was on Ultra-trac.
The watch was never inside except to charge back up to 100%. Also the watch was never on my wrist. I am going to do another test, with OHR off for Ultra-trac but still pretty disappointing for Ultra-trac battery life.
So your saying it should have lasted longer with the gyro working or not ? Either way 28 hours in ultra Trac is awful by any calculation. It makes zero sense why it only lasted a few hours longer than 1sec. My old Suunto ambit 3 peak goes from 20hrs on 1 sec and 200hrs in 6p sec. Now I’m not saying the Fenix 5 should get 200 hours but it makes zero sense why it last 2 weeks in watch mode but only a few hours longer in 60 sec mode compared to 1sec.
with gyro it will last shorter
I posted here already but can do it again
Garmin revised battery life for Fenix 5 and Fenix 5X
it was
Fenix 5 (US manual and Garmin website)
GPS/HR mode: Up to 24 hours
UltraTrac™ mode: Up to 75 hours without wrist heart rate
now it’s
GPS/HR mode: Up to 24 hours
UltraTrac™ mode: Up to 60 hours without wrist heart rate
For Fenix 5X
it was:
GPS/HR mode: Up to 20 hours
UltraTrac™ mode: Up to 50 hours without wrist heart rate
Now:
GPS/HR mode: Up to 20 hours
UltraTrac™ mode: Up to 35 hours without wrist heart rate
BUT
Asian version manual and website stated different numbers and it even lower
Now it’s:
fēnix 5 Battery Life
Up to 21 hours
GPS mode with wrist- based heart rate
Up to 44 hours
UltraTrac GPS mode with gyro-based dead reckoning
Fenix 5X
now:
Battery Life
Up to 20 hours
GPS mode with wrist-based heart rate
Up to 30 hours
UltraTrac GPS mode with gyro-based dead reckoning
I sent letter to Garmin, and here their reply:
Thank you for contact us at Garmin Corp. I am happy to assist you today.
For your information, the average battery life of Fenix 5 is in between 21 – 24 hours. US version stated 24 hours was based in theoretically statistic while Asian version stated 21 hours is based on actual field test. But both version share same hardware battery. As for UltraTac mode, it can last up to 60 hours with WHR off but only can reach to 44 hours with WHR on.
if fenix5 going from 60 to 44
for 5X from 35 to 25.5 if tested with moving (gyro) and real hand (whr on)
probably 5X using a lot power by them self, and gps 1 sec or 60 sec, doesn’t change a lot for battery life
Still doesn’t sense why GPS on every 60 sec should be that close to 1 sec, on top of having 2 week battery life on watch mode with everything else on.
Basically the gyro and Ulta Trac mode is useless. There is no reason to use it over 1 sec unless Garmin team figures out hour to get ultra Trac up to atleast 50hrs
Hmm…maybe to ask the obvious: But does the UltraTrac track if you dig into it actually do the recording properly? Or is there perhaps a bug that it’s sticking on 1s recording?
All of my units are currently on the roof…
(And here’s to hoping the GoPro doesn’t fall off of said roof or have a pigeon take, since that’s the only thing I couldn’t tie down due to the rotating thingy I stuck on the bottom of it…)
Fwiw – here’s the results of the regular battery test (got the units off the roof this morning)
5S: 14:23:29 (claim is 14hrs)
5: 23:36:06 (claim is 24hrs)
5X: 24:41:31 (claim is 20hrs)
I’ll detail more in a section in the review. Specs for all of them were identical: OHR on, GLONASS off, 1-second GPS on, Bluetooth off. All Sapphire models, but WiFi isn’t enabled in sport mode. No ANT+ sensors connected to them. All on current production firmware.
I’ll probably try an UltraTrac mode test in California later this week, but since I fly tomorrow morning I won’t have time to put them back on the roof and let them finish.
Starting in San Francisco (but only for 24 very packed hours), and then down the coast to Monterrey for Sea Otter, then eventually down the coast further to LA, and finally San Diego. About three weeks in total.
If you’ve got the time while you’re in San Diego I’d love to take you out for a trail run in the local mountains. It’d be good terrain for UltraTrac testing.
I appreciate your dedication to this. I’ve been searching up and down for actual field tests on the watch for battery life, and you are the first person to report in actual numbers.
Are you sure OHR was really on?
while watch on wrist it’s all the time blinking/lighting, if take it off it will stop blinking after a couple sec
Do u think while it just lying on the roof without real measuring heart rate is it real test with OHR on?
No, of course it’ll turn off the OHR here and there (it also samples frequently as well). It’s not perfect, the test has many flaws – but it does get as close to a ‘best case’ scenario as possible. A high watermark if you will.
My test Fenix 5 Sapphire
Watch was 100% charged at 6pm Sunday (9 apr), wifi and bt off, I ran 7 times, overall time 8hr45m GPS +hrm on,
+1 hr gym GPS off
wearing it on hand in watch mode 1 night (8hr), and 21hr at day time hrm on
rest of the time in a watch mode on a shelf
and for now left 5%
overall:
8hr45m GPS+ HRM on
+1 hr gym GPS off
8 days watch mode
used wifi manually for transfer 8 times
Pretty close to Asian manual numbers
This test is no test under real conditions. I think you know that. During the normal use, you have several button presses, scrolling through the data pages…, maybe intensive use of the map page with routing (5x)…
Hi Ray, I live in Vietnam and cannot order here on Internet due to some custom issues so I had a friend get a F5X from HK for me. However he could not get the metal band version and would like to order the metal band to be delivered to France where I’m going soon. Do you have an affiliate link to order the metal band in France? I’d like to support (a bit) as I enjoy your reviews :-)
Unfortunately I think only Garmin themselves is stocking the metal band as an accessory outside the US (I’m there might be a few retailers here and there), but I haven’t seen it on Amazon.fr or Clever Training Europe. Sorry!!!
But the placement of the port on the underside of the watch means you would either have to drill a hole through your wrist, or take the watch off your wrist to charge it.
For an ultra running, many that I know dont mind holding something for awhile, or putting on the hydration pack. As to charging, here is crud charging rate data I took today (from AC) so usb charge is likely a little different.
I was curious, so in an unscientific way, I wanted to see how quickly the F5x charges. Before starting my watch was at 24% charge.
At 15min intervals, this was the progression, when F5x was connected directly to the wall AC.
My recharging numbers were about the same. In contrast, as a hobbyist who has worked with lithium batteries for about 15 years, I’ve noticed that lithium battery life actually improves after about 5-8 recharges on a new lithium battery. Improvement can be anywhere from 15% to 30% longer battery life depending on the battery quality and the application. It’s important not to ever let the battery go down to 0% or even under 10% if possible, it will kill both the longevity and endurance of the battery.
DLuna : Interesting, so it’s better not to ever let the battery go down to 0% or even under 10%. In another post of a user in this blog I read that the life of a lithium battery depends on the number of cycle of recharge. After reading that post, I begun to let the battery of my armband optical heart rate monitor (Scosche Rhythm+) and the battery of my watch Garmin FR35 completely discharge, so I recharged the Scosche and the FR35 just once in a week.
Do you think that I was doing a wrong thing and it’s better to recharge every two or three days, ad example when the battery is 50%? Or even better after every single run (as I usually do with my Garmin Foreronner 610 that a has a short battery life)?
I’ve never had a long activity with the F5x, or started an activity when the battery was low. But the F3 would power itself off once it reached some minimal level. Meaning, that is to say, that the F3 would not let you run the battery to 0%. My assumption was that the F5 series did the same (in fact that should be common practice for all lithium battery in any device these days)
The Fenix5 will kick you out of a workout at 5% battery. You can then use the watch without GPS down to 0% battery.
The point of companies doing that is to ensure there isn’t a workout data loss situation in a file during an unexpected power-off due to loss of battery juice.
There are an array of factors that determine longevity of a batteries life. Number of charges is limited to between 500-1000 over the life of a lithium battery, which is the number one factor in a batteries life. If you allow the battery to go down to less than 10% then you’ll probably get closer to 500 recharges. The most stable status for a battery when stored for weeks or months without use is between 30% – 70%, which means it’s happiest in hibernation in that range. So in theory if you keep the battery between 30-70% for about half of its life(while in use) which happens with normal use above 10% charge, then it would last closer to 1000 recharges. Some studies show that if you only charge it up to 85-90%, then you would get even more recharges than charging to 100%. In other words, try and keep it in the 30%-70% range for as much of its life as possible without discharging it completely. Hope I explained that comprehensively.
Hey Ray. Love your reviews. Did you ever manage to finish the skiing video? Also any details on the ski data reported on the Garmin app? Saw some of the data on strava but is very basic in comparison to what a skitracks app would give you on the phone.
Keep up the great work.
Jim.
The splits tab will note the ‘runs’, automatically. Though unfortunately Garmin Connect doesn’t have any logic to re-word some of the UI elements online. Which is too bad, such minor tweaks would really help.
Now i’ve used my Garmin Fenix 5X for about a week. I’m seeing the same issue as i did with my old Garmin Fenix 3. The Max speed of a workout “spikes”.
I.e If i look at the summery of one of the last two workouts the MAX speed is 4.07 min / km and the average speed is 6.09 min/km.
Today I ran with my Fenix 5x on my left arm and 735XT on my right arm. The above mentioned issue happend again with the Fenix 5x. There were no such issue with the 735xt.
That I haven’t tried. :-) Since most of my runs have lots of left and right turns I hadn’t even considered it. :-) I’ll put 735XT on my left wrist and the Fenix 5x on my right for my next run.
This is not silly at all. In fact, it’s been the only way for me to get optical HR working for quite a time.
After losing 20 kg of my initial weight, my wrist is quite skinny. However, my dominant hand seems to have a few more muscles than my non-dominant hand, so the wrist of my dominant hand works better.
My ranking of oHR sensors is the following:
1. Polar A360 – the best by far, works on either wrist, but not good for running for quite a number of reasons so it went back :-(
2. Fitbit Charge 2 – Good for resting HR on my non-dominant wrist, but only works consistently for running on my dominant wrist.
3. Vivoactive HR – Takes quite a time to lock signal (30-50 seconds) and then quite a time to settle to the right HR (5-10 min), but works then. Takes significantly less time to give a good signal on my dominant wrist.
Also tried earlier:
– Mio Link – when I had 10 kg more – never really worked (although device had a good track record in most reviews).
– Charge HR – worked well when I had 10 kg more but was unusable after losing weight.
I think oHR is varying wildly between users and is highly individual.
This is a huge problem for manufacturers because at the moment users have no possibility to test devices without buying a new device and manufacturers have a high risk of returned devices and frustrated users.
You should be able to use the newest Suunto ones that are legit Bluetooth Smart, for simple HR. It cannot transfer recorded HR from the Suunto straps (you’d need the HRM-TRI/HRM-SWIM for that).
Note that the older Suunto straps are actually private-ANT, and not AN+T, so those won’t work at all.
Thanks Ray. So the Suunto Bluetooth HR strap will work for running, but not swimming? (Since swimming requires recording and transfer after the workout?)
First of all I love your reviews and appreciate all the work that must go into them.
Do you happen to know if the VO2max calculation takes into account climbing hills? I train almost exclusively on hills, climbing about 2k feet of elevation each session. My VO2max reading on my current Fenix 3 seems low and I can’t figure out if it’s not taking into account the fact that I’m climbing hills or if I’m just out of shape. I’m thinking it’s just looking at the time it takes to cover a given distance and how much energy I’m expending to do that.
I’m wondering if perhaps the Fenix 5 changed the way this figure is calculated. I read on First Beat’s website but wasn’t able to find anything addressing hill training.
OK. thanks for the info. It is bad to hear but good to know. It is a bit of a shame that something in theory works, but in practice no.
That must be the standard issue with BT really not being able to perfectly mate with watches, just like Ray was mentionning with power meters…
In any case thanks for the feedback!
Just an fyi. The fenix 5x doesn’t do well with changing up strokes in the middle of a lap. I know you mentioned that stopping in the middle of a lap during a pool swim caused inaccuracy … But it turns out so fits switching strokes during your lap. This is despite being an outdoor pool which you would think would help if the watch also uses GPS? During a pool swim. It’s disappointing particularly given that swim team often requires stroke changes during laps for swimming drills. The watch is amazing when you swim a single stroke though!
Yes, I thought so. I wonder if more similar strokes would be better? Swam breast/free, maybe fly/free would cause less physical change that would result in more accurate readings? time will tell
Received by 5X from BH Photo last week. Watch seems to be working as advertised. Haven’t really been able to test it thoroughly since I’m recovering from a fairly severe bike crash. The one thing that’s really strange is difficulty connecting via USB to my 2015 Macbook Pro Retina (latest OS Sierra). The Mac Finder just will not recognize that the watch is connected though the the Mac’s system report shows it present. So far I’d say my success in connecting is about 1 in 10. Accidentally found that turning off the Mac’s bluetooth increases frequency of a successful connection. Tried connecting to a Windows based machine and having no connection problems. Might add that I have an Epix and F3HR which connect fine to the Macbook. Did talk to the folks at Garmin and we really can’t come up with an answer. I’m putting this out just to see if anyone else is having an issue connecting to a Mac.
Have you tried reaching out to Apple directly? They might refer you right back to Garmin but they’ll likely be able to identify if the issue is on their end or Garmin’s. I’ve called them, was able to speak to a real person almost immediately who was very knowledgeable and spent a good half hour with me trying to resolve my issue. Worth a shot.
Having been a life-long Suunto guy, I finally gave up on the intermittent Ambit 3 bluetooth sync issues and decided to switch to Fenix 5X. This review was a big factor in doing so, it made me think that Garmin got their act together and their GPS and WHR actually worked in real life.
What a joke.
In the past week I’ve spent more time trying to get this watch to sync, to track my run without claiming 125 mph runs, to measure heart rate with any degree of actual accuracy, or to just bloody well even boot up (yes the dreaded triangle) thann I’ve spent on my suunto issues in the whole of the preceding life time…. not to mention the idiotic menu system, the moronic garmin express, how it kills android battery, how the website fails at even the most basic functions…
So – advice to those looking to leave their slightly afflicted Ambit 3’s behind – grass ain’t greener on the other side – it’s just artificial turf.
You see, people who write elaborate and exhaustive reviews that seem to avoid talking about the major issues with garmin’s software that render these devices largely useless (just sign up on garmin forums and you’ll see) do so because they ultimately need to make a living..
I dont write long review. My F5x is syncing just fine. I almost never use Garmin Connect, once one in a blue moon after I setup to auto upload to strava. Garmin express. one time again to setup wifi. No comment on the menu system, except I prefer it to prior iterations. OHRM seems on pair with most others on the market. Garmin Forums? well by nature of the forum, people go there to ask questions or understand issues. Happy folks dont just post for no reason. Read plenty of short and long reviews on the Suunto Spartan ultra.. but opted to stay away. seems light years away. Maybe not.. but that was perception. Maybe you have a bum watch, or maybe not. If you like your Ambit 3. great.
I can very well understand your anger! All the time wasted. No one ‘on the other side’ ever realizes how terrible that is. Especially when you’ve done something after proper research and considering.
I agree reviews, even DCR’s, tend to not mention all negative aspects. For a part because these aspects haven’t been encountered but it’s an illusion to think the relations with the ‘suppliers’ never play a role.
Garmin already for a few years now isn’t the company anymore that it once was. It starts with having too many products and goes down to all parts of their operation.
It’s not only them. Look at Tacx…….. There’s not even manuals online anymore.
We have to hope for the younger companies I think.
(BTW: too bad to see you had problems with Ambit. I’m considering to fly to that device, since the ideal external display for the phone still isn’t on the market. Was it only BT syncing? Cause I’m used to that already! (Fenix (older model) to be returned for repair but which I never wanna see back))
If you seldom use something………. I can mention 5-10 GC things that don’t work. Some of them for months already. Garmin maybe doesn’t even know. I tell them and they come back with stupid answers (what type of device are you using?? !!!!) Not to speak about how little possibilities it has)
OHM maybe relatively OK (when you’re lucky) but absolutely?
Forum users with problems can basically be divided into 2 groups: the ones that failed to RTFM and real users. Average people just use a small part of device’s possibilities, whatever kind of.
Suunto shouldn’t have reacted on F5 introduction. Buy they also have shareholders………..
The problem with the original post is that it’s all high-level without actually being specific.
Which specific Garmin Connect “basic fields” are missing?
You said your Suunto unit had problems with your Android phone and syncing, and now the Garmin unit does too. Maybe it’s your phone?
Killing battery life? Also, sounds like it’s your phone.
Have you called Garmin about the boot-up issue? If so, what’d they say? Or were you trying to load OSM/other maps on it and perhaps have a bad map?
Folks complain about somehow missing details here in my review, but then gloss over the details themselves in their criticisms.
And while we’re at it…Raul, it took me 3 seconds to find the Tacx manuals. Here:
I can give some hints on GC:
Disappeared:
* search name field (in Activities)
* hide filters button (Activities)
Not shown:
* runcadence graph (reg details), while av. value is listed, but no max. (reg details), not in cadence column (Activities) (Wahoo RPM)
* power values (in export splits) (see screenshot, in Dutch sorry)
* all newer items in cycling splits overview not exported. (same screenshot)
Incomprehensible:
* moving time always lower than time while user was moving all the time, having no autopause active. The total of the column is equal to……..that of the time column (???) (Activities)
* sum strokes in cycling activities. What use? (Activities)
* best Segments result won’t appear in list (Segments) (screenshot)
* graphics don’t scale according to values, have a ridiculous range (what’s the use of going until -100 m. in the altitude graph?)
There’s more but the report already became longer than I wanted…. I don’t get paid for this.
This is the website of the world leader of sportcomputers! Some of these phenomenons are going on for months. It looks like the site is managed by trainees. The kind that fixes 1 thing (or tries to) but meanwhile creates a new malfunction.
Ahh Ray, I don’t consider a Quick Start as a manual. Tacx neither, the subtitle is ‘assembling Neo Smart’. The info even isn’t clear, which forced them to release an additional doc. No info on updating, to name just something. For which you don’t receive any notification; the investigating why the machine wasn’t functioning properly was a waste of precious time.
I was more referring to TTS4. Also on that I spent many many hours to find things out. (ever tried to re-ride an own reg?) Time that I would rather have spent on core stability, exploring cycling apps or sleeping! The available manuals are from 2013! They’ve decided to produce only Youtube video’s. At least I bought my Neo for $ 750…..
DCRM – you are embarrassing yourself, I totally understand that you need to make a living out of this website, but surely you must realise that it’s loyal following that trusts your advice, and not the odd click-throughs to amazon that will ultimately matter to your commercial success?
Surely you must realise that people like me and Raul aren’t just going to flame Garmin for no reason other than genuine frustration with a product that’s so clearly half-baked?? We do have day jobs…
So it’s because I have a day job so I’m only going to recount the so-desired “specifics” that jump to my memory in the next 5 minutes:
1) Dreaded triangle happened within the first 25m – suspected cause was the strava live segments sync to GC (as supported by many posts to be the cause) – and don’t blame strave, this entirely a Garmin feature. Full hard reset (yes, where you have to stand on one foot and touch your nose while pressing and releasing buttons in a moronic sequence) got me back in business… but I dare not try live segments again (yep, another 5x promise in the bin)
2) Sync issues… where do I begin.. issues with Garmin express (ie with a cable) – just shows a red message every once in a while, no explanation of what happened, just that it failed. Issues with bluetooth synching with the android are DAILY and unfixable without a cable, my Suunto was occasional and fixable through phone restart- maybe it’s the phone.. but it’s the same phone.. sync audit shows a “timeout” of 90+ seconds to download a file… only cleareable through synching with a cable.. synching over wifi.. have no idea if that even attempts to work as I’ve seen no evidence of such
3) GPS – i won’t even bother, suffice to say it’s just random.. comes out of the box with “Ultra” enabled (Ultra=Ultra-bad), so expect schizo zigzags, then even when glonass and 1s tracking enabled, will just randomly loose track and back to the zigzags…
4) Battery life – very obviously related to the failed synchs – but when it gets into that loop of failed synchs, I can actually feel the phone getting hotter (no, it’s not a galaxy)
5) Heart rate – tried it while running outside, on a treadmill, on a stationary bike… about the only time it tracks “well” is when I’m doing little to nothing…. Other than that it will go super-eratic (ie 120 – 180 and back repeatedly) or just tell me I’m resting when I’m in the red zone… I get it, WHR isn’t perfect – but this is WAAY worse than expected.
6) Idiotic UI… maybe personal, but who rationally thinks that menu and up should be the same button? i mean you press menu and the next click scrolls it up??? how about navigate VS run? why not navigate WHILE run?
Honestly, not that suunto is perfect, and it sounds like spartan is fraught with issues, but man… getting a garmin is like buying a chinese fake of what they actually advertise..
I dont have any sync issues. None. GPS is at least as good as F3, and that was always perfectly fine for my short runs, and my ultra (not ultra trak, dont need it. 18hrs for 1hr usb recharge is fine for me). OHRM, I’m still getting a handle on. during treadmill, rowing machine, and eliptical, it was spot on. at least compared to my taking my own pulse and grabbing the HR. Strength training, it was off, garmin forums have theories about OHRM and strength training. UI? I’m running through trail. I dont spend any time using the UI. and once done, its no issue. Apple vs Andriod PC vs Mac. ask a 1000 people and get a 1000 different replies on every UI known to man. it works anything else I dont personally care. Strava segments? Not a feature I care about. Considering its new on most garmin, I dont know if its working for any. If you dont like the F5. If the day comes I dont like the F5, I’ll return it. At present I must be amongst the 100 of thousands are quite satisfied.
re Ambit 3 – it’s just BT synching, cable synching is rock solid.
The issues are intermittent, I’ve had them both on iphone and the android, so I suspect it’s Ambit and not the phone like DCRM alleges.
They are normally cleared with a reboot of the phone (i know) – but that seems to somehow reset the connection on the ambit.
Other than that it’s a very solid thing, I’ve done a 22h ultra with 1s tracking on 1 battery, and it has survived all sorts of crashes and wipeouts, software is simple by comparison, but works. I was thinking of selling it when i got fenix, but i’ll hold on to it now, only using the 5x as more of a gadget, hoping the software will get fixed…
Ted W – “GPS at least as good as F3” – F3 was well known to be pretty bad compared to Suunto… so that explains… if you going to make statements re: OHRM, then please don’t compare them to “hand-sensors” on treadmills.. one generally compares WHR to chest straps as that’s the biggest selling point… as for UI, granted, it’s largely personal, but there’s a difference between ratoinal and irrational… suunto lasts longer and can be re-charged WITHOUT drilling holes through your wrist, and doesn’t crash during that time and still shows the results…
Point about Strava segments is that it’s illustrative of the kind of half-baked quality you can expect from the product.. why is it ok for something new not to work for anyone?? what kind of logic is that? would you like your tesla to start half the time? or worse stop only half of the time because it’s new??
i’m well aware of my option to return the F5, I am just making sure people of this popular blog realise that there DEFINITELY is a quality issue with garmin software (at least)
while not at all scientific, use this quick n’ dirty method to judge the noise level – google “fenix 5 issues” and get a hit count… then do the same for “suunto ambit 3 issues” – the ratio is 5X (hah) and then consider the fact that suunto ambit has been on the market for 5 years..
As I said: owners without complaints don’t put the device to the test.
Relative judging is not something I’ll ever do. (OK, on Chinese stuff)
I’m using my 310 again! And never went off the 810. That syncs in a couple of seconds while the Fenix I had used minutes (for a shorter reg)
I’m not going to respond to every point, because honestly it just seems like your throwing out random stuff. I don’t disagree there’s issues (see my bugs section), plus others I’ve seen in the comments, but I don’t think they are representative of everything. Certainly your Strava boot-up issue is something that a handful of people saw on some segments, but most others haven’t (I’ve got 30-40 segments loaded in mine, no issues). I believe Garmin figured it out in the latest firmware update.
That said, I’ve never heard of someone complain about a long-press for menu. Never once. So I think you’re out in left field there. And I don’t understand why you put it in UltraTrac since you knew that’d be bad GPS, and then went onto complain about bad GPS?
As for Raul – he actually doesn’t have a unit to my knowledge. So basically, it’s stirring the pot here. He’s posted 29 times on this Fenix 5 thread alone, and not once actually with respect to offering a solution or a question – but rather just to poke other owners/etc… He’s welcome to do that, but it doesn’t go unnoticed. Whether or not he has a day job as you presume, I don’t know. We all have jobs – my job is to look at comments and figure out either A) If I can help fix the issues or B) If they’re not making much sense….or C) If they’re just here to stir the pot without any technical backing.
I will always be about ‘prove it’. You can see that below with someone that came with a legit issue on Apple Health, and backed it up with legit data. I was able to repro it, pass it on, and Garmin is already working on it. That all within just a few hours?
I do the same thing when it’s a Suunto issue or even an Apple or GoPro issue.
“while not at all scientific, use this quick n’ dirty method to judge the noise level – google “fenix 5 issues” and get a hit count… then do the same for “suunto ambit 3 issues” – the ratio is 5X (hah) and then consider the fact that suunto ambit has been on the market for 5 years..”
Not really, Google doesn’t work that way. Plus, if you search that way and explicitly seperate “Fenix 5” and “Suunto Ambit 3”, then you’ll see that you actually get more results from the Suunto Ambit. But who’s counting.
I don’t like very much Garmin Connect, I think that it’s too complicated and that it has a lot of things that are not useful. Even the simple things, like graphs, are not so clear (they are too small). I think that Garmin could improve this website a lot, but ok, it’s free, so we can live with it, better than nothing. If we had to pay for Garmin Connect, probably Garmin would care more about it.
But I think that the hardware of the watches has improved a lot with time: battery life, water resistence, weight, ease of reading during running, ease of use, wearability, size range, software stability.
Random? I agree, the way this is thing is failing is rather random… Since yesterday it has been unable to sync via bluetooth – I’ve done everything short of hard reset at this point – if you’d like to help, be my guest, sync audit output is below. I’ve de-installed/re-installed the app, un/re-paired the watch, etc.. It syncs using cable, but fails completely using the app.
regarding stuff I randomly threw out: Ultratrac is the default setting on 5X, I didn’t set it – Garmin did, and by your own admission, it’s pretty terrible
what concerns me is how you’re willing to put your credibility at risk by resisting the obvious truth: Garmin software is buggy, the GPS is inferior, your readers should know this, and Garmin should improve the quality of their software. You seem to have no issues slamming Suunto spartan (perhaps deservedly) yet not Garmin?
Here’s the sync audit log:
—GCM App Version—
3.16.1
—Timestamp—
Tue, Apr 11 2017 @ 3:28 PM
—Garmin Device Info—
[device information] unit id: 3944824354, bluetooth friendly name: fenix 5x, product number: 2604, software version: 290, device name: fenix, device model name: 5x
—Sync Info—
******************** SYNC RESULT ********************
Upload Status=FAILED (Unable to download file [2] from the remote device: Data Transfer Timed Out)
Download Status=NOT_STARTED
Time Sync Status=SUCCESSFUL
Overall Sync Status=FAILED
Origin=5037_0
*****************************************************
UPLOAD:
LISTED { listed=1977ms }
– 2 (80/ACTIVITY): EXTRACTING FAILED [Unable to download file [2] from the remote device: Data Transfer Timed Out] { extracting=106969ms }
– 48: not processed
– 44: not processed
– 1: not processed
– 49: not processed
– 50: not processed
– 47: not processed
– 46: not processed
– 40: not processed
– 41: not processed
– 51: not processed
– 52: not processed
– 53: not processed
– 54: not processed
– 55: not processed
– 56: not processed
– 57: not processed
– 58: not processed
– 59: not processed
– 60: not processed
– 61: not processed
– 62: not processed
– 63: not processed
– 64: not processed
– 65: not processed
– 66: not processed
– 67: not processed
– 68: not processed
– 69: not processed
– 70: not processed
– 71: not processed
– 72: not processed
– 73: not processed
-job: busy all day. No TV (except for things like Paris-Roubaix last 100 k, while on the stationary), no social life, no books nothing.
-no owner: like many posters
-stir in the pot: if that means what I think: someone should trigger things. I’m the opposite of the grey mass. Find it unbelievable how ‘uncritical’ people are, nowadays generation?? Don’t know better?
-29 posts: haha. It’s all about digits. Apart from a few sarcastic ones they are ‘substantial’. Not about colours, sizes etc. But I’m done.
-doesn’t go unnoticed: ??
-your task: you shouldn’t put time/energy in that! Garmin read this forum, being glad it’s there. There’s brands that even respond directly in forums. Makes them a lot sympathetic….
Byebye!
“what concerns me is how you’re willing to put your credibility at risk by resisting the obvious truth: Garmin software is buggy, the GPS is inferior, your readers should know this, and Garmin should improve the quality of their software. You seem to have no issues slamming Suunto spartan (perhaps deservedly) yet not Garmin?”
I’m not sure what I’m resisting. I’m simply asking you to show data for your claims. It’s really pretty straight forward. If you say it has bad GPS in a regular tracking mode – then show it. If you say it has bad GPS in UltraTrac, then nobody will disagree with you (including me). It’s really rather simple.
My point is your making claims as if every unit out there is having the issues your seeing. I’m simply saying they aren’t. There’s some 800 comments here, and the issues your talking about people aren’t seeing (except one person saw the same thing on a specific Strava segment of his, as noted).
“regarding stuff I randomly threw out: Ultratrac is the default setting on 5X, I didn’t set it – Garmin did, and by your own admission, it’s pretty terrible”
It’s not the default on running or cycling or most other modes. I haven’t hard reset my unit , so perhaps it is on hiking or some other mode. But to be clear, it’s equally horrible on Suunto in their long-tracking mode.
I’m pretty sure folks find it useful that I respond to comments here. I’d save a heck of a lot of time if I didn’t (3-4 hours a day of savings time).
I think people are as critical as ever before, which is great to be critical of claims. There’s nothing about generations here. But when one crosses into doubting everything and making claims without data, then isn’t that the opposite of what you want?
I guess I don’t really get the idea of posting lots of stuff that’s simply inserting doubt into peoples minds without any backing. It’d be one thing if one has a unit (as Max does) and is having issues and can show it (like his Android log). Or the person below with the Apple Health issue. Or the other person below with the LiveTrack oddity. Those are great things to track down. But coming on and just inserting doubt on every topic every day without substance…I don’t really get?
would love to show you the data if the thing actually synch’d… but as it is, not synching anymore….
you’re right people are talking about all manner of issues and not just mine – while your own list of “bugs” is very disturbingly superficial
and i’m not speaking for every device, i only got 1 – but even a cursory glance on the web tells you there are significant issues with garmin’s software quality.. even your own loyalists admit as much by suggesting you shouldn’t use “new” features
anyway, it’s been tiresome and wasteful, you won’t hear from me, much like i won’t hear back from garmin who have thus far offered no help, (yes, they got all my logs and data… )
but suffice to say, you’ve lost all credibility in my eyes with your condescending responses – quite clearly, your commercial imperatives leave your fairness askew
My list of bugs is bugs I saw that I found. I don’t make up bugs to appease people. I can’t fake Strava segments to make things appear/break – I’d say trying on 30-40 segments on three continents is reasonable I can’t possibly find every combination of things that one person does one way, and others another way. Similarly, I find bugs that others don’t find due to the way I use it. I’ve included every run/ride/swim/etc in my review. Folks are free to analyze my data how they see fit. The road goes both ways.
Just like fairness goes both ways. I’m fair to both consumers and companies. If a company says something can can’t back it up, then I call them out for it (like seen in the HR accuracy section here for cycling). And if someone says something they can’t back up, the same goes. I’ve never really understood why it has to be a double-standard that we can’t question claims on both sides. After all, that’s exactly what Raul asked for in this very thread. Or perhaps after years of doing this I’ve seen so many cases (on a daily basis) of folks simply making up things or outright lying about what happened. So maybe I’m biased towards asking for supporting evidence for anything – be it company or consumer.
As for your data, you can simply plug it into USB to get the same data off to share (it’s in the Activity folder). If you find me simply asking for data to back claims or to help troubleshoot condescending, I apologize.
Max and Raul, I sympathize with your sentiments about Garmin. I have lost many workouts due to corrupted FIT files. Recently it happened to a friend of mine on a ride he had been training for months at!
Thankfully, it has not happened to me yet at an important event…
(for evidence, just go on strava and search for #garminfail)
You sound like the kind of users who just don’t want to be helped, everything is the end of the world but when people try and help you you do nothing to help yourselves. I currently have a dodgy iPhone 7 but rather than bellyaching on a non official site I collected evidence via video and reproducible steps and spoke to Apple about it. They are replacing it as we speak but I realise it’s not all iPhones that are defective and if it were I’d ask for a refund and walk away.
Some people just want drama but the vast majority of readers trust the reviews here, I personally think the Fenix 5 review was a bit light in places compared to Rays usual standards but I don’t ever think he is hiding anything or changing stuff for commercial gain.
Last I read, F3 GPS is still regarded as better than any recent Suunto. Some want GPS accuracy that is military grade on a consumer handheld device. I suspect those people will never be satisfied. Not sure what handheld treadmill sensors you are talking about. I’m talking about my own finger taking my own pulse. Something doctors and nurses to Thousands of times a day around the globe. Pretty reliable. If i measure my pulse at 150 and the F5 says 150, I’d says its darn close. If during strength training my Garmin reads 98bpm and I read my pulse 120+bpm, I would say something is off. I dont care to talk about Ambit 3 or 910xt or anything else that 3 to 5 years old. If you love your Ambit 3 and its larger external antenna in the band. GREAT! I prefer the color display and mapping on the F5x. and I guess my unit is different since I’ve not had any of the issues you’ve encountered. And for the price, that stinks for you, and others with those issues. During my time with the F2, F3, I’ve done a large number of 50k, 50m, 100k, 100miler. In all those, I’ve had maybe 3 lockups. Not fun. But I’m still alive, and the world didnt end. So I look forward to giving the F5x equal chance to prove itself. After Plantars recovery, my next ultra is in June.. so Ill have to wait a bit to test the F5x.
@depicus – and you sound like you work for garmin or just just a DCRM fanboy, or you just looking to flame… or all of the above – i didn’t come here to solve my problem, i don’t need DCRM or your “good boy” examples of how you video your iphone problems… (if you think it’s ok to shell out $700 on a device that then needs you to create a video documentary of your problems, just so that you get it replaced… you go for it, you stud)
the point of the this site is to provide consumer advice -> the advice should be complete to cover quality issues -> i simply raised a point that DCRM’s *very* short list of bugs sounds more like a fake-out because perhaps garmin sends him free devices and he sells bunch of them through the links… drama? sure, it pi$$es me off that the guy who takes up the first three search results on garmin fenix review is refusing to accept what the rest of the web shows clearly – and frankly I just hope that whoever’s thinking about buying one of these reads it and makes up their mind on a more complete data set.
btw – i do give DCRM credit for putting in the work to get the data together – so to show my appreciation I will do a run today with ambit 3 on my right wrist + HRM strap, and fenix 5 on my left wrist, a phone in my backpocket, jabra HRM headhpones in my ears – all tracking data (yep, will look ridiculous) and post comparative data, whatever it shows, (and whenever my fenix 5 will actually synch again)
Well Max if you didn’t come here to solve a problem then why did you bother ? I don’t think you quite understand how the interweb works. This site doesn’t owe you anything and doesn’t have to list bugs if it didn’t want to but thankfully this site does list bugs than the majority of users are seeing. Things aren’t always perfect that’s why we have warranty and yes it’s frustrating when your device doesn’t work as expected but if you’re not willing to help yourself then why would you expect others to.
let me try again… I bothered because it bothers me that the guy who’s supposed to be a pre-eminent reviewer of these things (certainly most voluminous) seems to be out of synch with a) my experience of the product and b) the experience of many others (who can be seen both here and on other forums) – so I post here out of the desire to warn others not to make the mistake I made – just because DCRM says its a great product with only “minor” bugs – it ain’t so.
i’ve helped myself plenty, i’ve gotten the watch to finally synch – (4 hard resets later) and know I know the hoops i have to jump through next time it starts to flake out… but that’s the point – people who are expecting quality out of a $700 watch must be ware – Garmin certainly doesn’t advertise their issues, so who can be trusted to highlight them? or is this site just a long commercial for Garmin? If so – it should state so at the top, there are actually rules governing this sort of thing. I’m also intrigues by how DCRM hasn’t once denied Garmin’s support of his site that might distort his perspective… why is that?
I was busy focusing on your issue, rather than responding to all your made-up stuff.
No, Garmin doesn’t pay me. No, I don’t keep the devices. In fact they are with me at present boarding a flight to go back to Garmin. Heck, I’m even covering all my own travel costs to speak at the Connect IQ Developer conference (my ticket within the US alone was more than $1,100 to make the schedule work…plus hotel/etc…).
This is with 1s, GPS+GLONASS enabled tracking on Garmin
and 1s normal GPS om Ambit
and who knows what Pixel was doing…
Frankly, it speaks for itself – Garmin clearly has “freak out” moments, rendering it far less reliable than Ambit 3, and not what you want out of a top-tier device. I remember you slamming Spartan… yet you just won’t admit that Fenix 5X is even worse. It’s interesting.
I was speaking to your made up accusations about being paid by Garmin.
As for your data, congrats, you made a bad track. I can do that for every GPS device out there (including the Fenix5 as shown in the review).
But, that doesn’t represent what the vast majority of users are seeing, either here or even on the forums. Perhaps your device is defective, or perhaps there’s something to do with the environment…or whatever.
The point myself and others are trying to make to you is that you assume your issues are widespread. They clearly aren’t.
There’s just no pleasing you, is there… – you ask for data, for proof, I give it to you and now you tell me I “made” a bad track and that “vast” majority don’t have problems… cursory count of posts in response to this review reveals that most are talking about issues, not praising the device – and interestingly, most of the issues are not the ones you short-listed. (emphasis on short), I was going to post the heart rate data comparison which is shocking, but why bother – you’ll just toss that to the side as well… “nothing to see here”, eh?
So keep up the good work, defend the defective, let the sales continue, and if unhappy buyers post here – discredit them, tell them they’re especially unlucky, and that the rest of the web complaints are equally unlucky.
I’m not sure I discredited you anywhere. I first asked for details, which took you a lot of teeth-pulling to get. After which you posted a single run.
I then simply said the majority of users aren’t seeing what you’re seeing on that single track. And most comments here are more questions on how things work, or understanding how to figure out something. Discussion about those having an issue tends to go longer within a thread, since usually it’s about figuring out what said issue is and a possible resolution.
But as pointed out earlier – nothing really pleases you, even solution suggestions. I suggested perhaps your unit is defective, and perhaps you should call Garmin to get it swapped out. Or maybe swap out your Pixel, since that definitely sounds defective. I’m guessing it’s widespread.
As for your HR data, I looked at it too – and none of the three units you used matched (not even close), so…which one is right?
Seems there is no pleasing you either Max, why not just return the unit if you are not happy, and I suspect you never will be for some reason. You cannot complain about a problem then do nothing about it. Yes people have problems but grown-ups do something about it instead of repeatedly posting nonsense on a site – what are you expecting, some magic fairy to come and fix your “problems”.
“your condescending responses – quite clearly, your commercial imperatives leave your fairness askew”
Wow. Just wow. Ray is doing a very well job at being polite and helpful, and you classify this as condescending, when all your posts here were “wah wah, I miss my Suntoo”?
Got a Fenix 5 last week. Running, biking, short and long rides, syncing via wifi, via bluetooth, pairing with multiple sensors, sleep tracking, OHR, all work just fine. If you have that many problems, I rather think it’s a problem with your setup, because I don’t think I got a special Fenix 5 unit.
Leaving aside the heated and angry debate going on here, and looking constructively instead at the GPS track data instead – I see that the Ambit track looks very good indeed, which isn’t surprising considering the huge antenna bulge it has (I also have an Ambit 3 peak which I really like). Also, it is in a very challenging area for GPS I would think – I used to live just there, in Monticello on Kennedy Rd, … lots of dense foliage on the trees and many high rises in the lower parts of the track. You are also in the “shadow” of “the Peak” which is probably blocking out several satellites too.
The Fenix track does look poor though and the Pixel also. Do you have any friends with other running watches? And, if so, what are their experiences running in that area?
Maybe you should just return the Fenix and give something else a try? The Foreunner 935 seems to be doing very well, with no compaints about GPS problems at all in the forums and people saying it gives better tracks than the Fenix 5. Something to consider, that’s all.
I don’t want to get involved in your argument with Ray, but I would like to say that I think we can trust him when he says he receives no financial support from Garmin. I have no reason to believe otherwise, and I appreciate his solid work and willingness to run around Paris looking like a complete nerd for our sakes ! :-) Keep up the good work Ray!
I will jump in to the conversation that I have been following quite closely for the last couple of days.
First of all, it’s time to take it easy gents!
Now up to you Max, I understand your frustrations with your issues and I have faced the same GPS issues you were facing. And actually mine are a lot worse than yours. At first, I thought I had a faulty watch so I got it replaced but the same problems resurfaced. So guess what I did, I returned the watch…end of story. I will probably get the Forerunner 935 or a Suunto instead.
Ray is a well respected person in the industry. I believe that people who buy Garmin watches are less swayed by the marketing hype otherwise they would have bought an apple watch. And these people wait for Ray’s reviews before making a purchase. Just look at the forums and people who state, “I will wait for Ray to make his review before taking the dive.”
However, I’m in position to judge whether Ray is getting support for Garmin or not, but judging solely from his reviews he is trying to be as exhaustive as possible. However, he can not test in all the conditions. I have been searching for weeks to see if there were others that were facing the same issues that I was. I looked at the Garmin forums, I searched on Google. Max, you are the first one that I saw with these issues. I honestly feel that we were simply out of luck on this one. I know I’m running in a very difficult environment for GPS signals. I’m running in an area with tall glass buildings. I have posted my issues for you to see and this is by far not the worst one. I’ve seen 5km being added to a 7km run.
The Garmin fenix 5 was my first GPS watch, initially I used an iphone or samsung phone and never looked at the GPS tracks closely. But when I saw these issues with the Garmin watch, I started researching. I started learning a bit more about how GPS functions. And then I realized one thing, even the phones were struggling in these areas. My first 2 kilometers, I was always appeared to be running at a faster pace when I was running a warm up pace. Well guess what the phones were struggling in these parts and they have assisted GPS as well to help. A garmin without WIFI assisted GPS will struggle a lot more in these circumstances.
Now to you Ray, I’m in no position to ask anything of you. What you’re doing is already a great job but if you ask I can give some recommendations that can help and avoid these issues. Because, initially I thought something in your review was wrong before I did my research.
I don’t need your help, I’ll take care of my problems myself – all I ever wanted was to highlight to your significant following that your reviews are, despite being voluminous, are clearly biased or at least less thorough than they appear, often in the most fundamental parts of what a sports watch supposed to be.
If go back to the original post (all of 3 days ago..), if you read your review, you get a number of *misleading* conclusions:
on Wrist-based HR:
YOU > “So overall – I’d say things are pretty good”
ME> THIS IS INVERSE OF THE TRUTH, it works sometimes, but NOT most of the time.
on GPS:
YOU> “So overall, it’s not too shabby.”
ME> Pretty damn shabby if you ask me. And anyone else who looks at these tracks. What shocks me is that you bemoan spartan, but I suspect this thing is much worse than spartan. (And btw, in the tracks, I don’t know how you can say with any integrity that you don’t see my point.)
You asked me for data, and at the very next opportunity, ie – next day, I posted data, if you call that “pulling of teeth”… talk about impossible to please!
it’s ok, as I could not return the damn thing (shop wouldn’t take it back), I’ll keep coming back and posting more data, I’ll get the device replaced and post results after that here, which will probably prove what other thorough testers have been saying – GPS subpar, WRH unusable, software – buggy – a low quality device that should not be bought by anyone for that price (no wonder all your strava pics feature suunto… ;)
p.s. // As for the rest of your cheerleeders, you guys just relax, no need to get abusive in defense of your object of adoration, it’s a conversation, Ray can take care of himself.
@Steve, @Youssef – I tried to return the watch.. they wouldn’t take it back!
@Yussef – have a look at link to fellrnr.com – it’s not just you and me – the GPS on this thing is pretty horrible. I wish I had read that one.. but I instead I trusted DCRM too much.
But yes, ok, you guys are right, this has become personal, I never meant to start a flame.. was just annoyed at my $700 brick (honestly!) that doesn’t do any of the things I bought it for well. (wrh, gps, synch)
but since I’m stuck with it (unless ray wants to buy it?) I will only post data and no commentary from now on.
You clearly didn’t read the fellrnr article and just cherrypicked the part that suited your view. He was using Smart, GLONAS off – come on really….
And I find it hard to believe you could not return the watch or even pick up the phone and call Garmin and maybe get a replacement. Seems you may not be telling the truth or trying to hard, not sure which.
Great review but one point I’m not sure I understand, can I use the Garmin Connect app on my phone to plan a route and send it to the 5X or can I only do that from a laptop/PC?
Will the battery test include wifi/sapphire model versus non-wifi/glass? I’m wondering if the Wifi/Sapphire models have a bit lower battery life if the wifi and bluetooth aren’t the same module and there’s an extra component to power at times. If they’re the same module, it makes me wonder if a software upgrade later might allow a paid upgrade path to wifi in the non-sapphire models.
But I wouldn’t expect any battery life change. The WiFi piece isn’t ever powered on until the end of an activity once you hit save, and then only for about 5 minutes if I remember correctly.
OOOOoooooh. This makes so much more sense now. I’ve had my 920xt for 2+ years and never understood why some small portion of my workouts didn’t sync. It’s the ones where I’m not ending at home, or getting home within five-ish minutes of having saved the workout! Duh. Understanding how the wifi works, I should now be able to more deterministically get more of my workouts autosync’d. And that sells me on upgrading to a wifi model if I get a Fenix 5, because I love that I don’t have to use the data cable anymore like on the older 910xt yet with the 920xt the BlueTooth/iPhone app has been just clunky enough that I’d be an unhappy customer if that app was always in between me and my data. Wifi to the Garmin Connect website (and Strava and other connected sites) and life is simple and good. If Garmin have a place for feature requests, bug reports, or especially focus group that feeds into the UX/UI/UCD team for the iPhone app, I could easily bend their ear for an hour or more. Based on today’s comments on this article, it sounds like I’m not the only one less than happy with that app, but wifi frees you from that dependency for the most part.
With the FR920XT, I believe you can force sync via WiFi by holding one of the left buttons down. I don’t have one handy in front of me at the moment connected to WiFi, but it’s somewhere in there.
Handy if you come home/back later and want to sync then.
Yes!! Just searched this out and long menu button press pops a menu including at the top of the list “connect to wifi” on the 920xt. I’m assuming that’ll be the same when I get my Fenix 5. THANK YOU for the tip!!
Searching the pdf manual for “wifi” and “wi-fi” I only got two irrelevant hits in the past. But re-skimming it around the areas for the menu button, this menu long press option is actually clearly documented. Something about how the PDF is rendered is causing text search to not work.
F5x firmware v2.90. I’ve got v2.50 installed. And I admit to expecting a notification on my watch about a software update being available. The F3 would do that. i have wifi enabled. Should I be getting notifications about the new update? or are some upates ..only.. thru garmin express?
I bought the Fenix 5 because a sports shop around here had a -30% off of everything, so why not? I was looking for a sports watch that I can wear everyday, that has an included barometer for hiking, great battery life, etc.
And I was looking for a sports watch that fully works with my iPhone 7 Plus because I aggregate and store all my health data there to have it readily available. And in this area, Garmin completely drops the ball. Garmin says that Garmin Connect Mobile is compatible to Apple Health / HealthKit: link to support.garmin.com
Well, Garmin is blatantly lying, because it does not: Active Energy, Resting Energy, Flights Climbed & Walking + Running Distance are written to Apple Health / HealthKit only to be deleted from there again the day after – which is insane.
Karen from Garmin Customer Support lied straight to my face via chat: “how the data displays in Apple Health is not under our control.” and “Our app does not have the control to remove data from Health.” – off course, Garmin Connect Mobile does. What is made available to Apple Health / HealthKit is shown there and what is removed/deleted from there, isn’t. In addition their support forums are full of threads about problems with Garmin Connect Mobile and Apple Health, yet the people at Garmin are “unaware of any issues between Connect Mobile and Apple Health.” (Twitter)
I don’t know any other company that releases such great hardware on one hand, such broken software on the other and gives such a shit about customers and even lies straight to them. A company like this won’t see a single € from me and the Fenix will be returned to the retailer, because it can’t be used the way it’s advertised.
What’s somewhat interesting to me is that I can roughly see what I think you’re referring to (Active Energy shows for today, but not previous days). But what’s curious to me is if there’s some other bug there – because Strava is writing that data in for older days, but that’s the only other service (aside from the phone itself). I should have other service pumping in data too.
I know in the past it didn’t used to do that – since I’ve got screenshots in older posts going back some number of days showing it working just fine. The thing I’m not super clear about though is that if it’s a but on the GCM side or one on the Apple side. It appeared to have ‘died’ on/about Mar 31st. Since then, I don’t see ‘older’ data. Which likely would have coincided with the version dropped on/about the FR935 release.
Ray, I’m sure you see my e-mail, so feel free to get in touch if you like – should work for iMessage as well ;-)
GCM’s Apple Health integration is somewhat broken, so I try to detail it further
1) I just deleted all Garmin Connect Mobile data from Apple Health, uninstalled the app, reinstalled it and gave it enough time so sync its stuff.
Garmin says that it sync data to Apple Health 14 days prior to setting things up. This is true for values for Steps, Trainings, Sleep Analysis and Heart Rate. Values for Activity Energy, Rest Energy, Flights Climbed as well as Walking and Running Distance (remember these 4 data categories!) are only shown for the current day – the day Garmin Connect Mobile was installed and setup to sync with Apple Health.
2) From previous tests I can confirm and have proof for this behavior: Values for Steps, Trainings, Sleep Analysis and Heart Rate are written constantly to Apple Health and stay there – just as they should. Values for Activity Energy, Rest Energy, Flights Climbed as well as Walking and Running Distance (same 4 data categories like in 1) are only saved to Apple Health for the current day, but deleted/removed on the next.
It seems to me that GCM only keeps/syncs/downloads data for values for Activity Energy, Rest Energy, Flights Climbed as well as Walking and Running Distance for the current day, then removes it from local cache / Apple Health and never again syncs/downloads them again.
Ray, if you use GCM on an iPhone with Apple Health do the following: Open Health, select Sources, Connect, Data, Activity Energy – you’ll see, that there are only values for the current day. Now go back once and select Steps: All previous data is there, see?
There are other annoying things in GCMs HealthKit integration, but the above is a complete showstopper, dealbreaker and in my opinion a clear violation of Apple Store Review Guideline 5.1.3 (ii): I would say that deleting user data is “wrong data”.
And this problem is way older; found this thread from mid January on their forums: link to forums.garmin.com
Most annoying is Garmin’s arrogant and idiotic “There’s nothing wrong.”, “Things work as they should.”, “We don’t know of any problems.”…
Yeah, I was speaking to those specific categories with a Garmin source in seeing near-term data previous to today disappearing as well. Yet, data previous to April 1st actually is there from those categories from a Garmin source being there. Meaning, I think it was working fine until April 1st (or perhaps March 31st, hard to decide exactly).
As for support, I wouldn’t overthink that too much. It’s a low-level support person that may very well be seeing something for the very first time. Nobody else has brought it up till now, and if it just happened in the last 10 days, then that’s likely why (not sure if January was an isolated incident, a user incident, or a brief blip).
I wouldn’t say that it’s a violation of the user terms. There’s actually good reason why a company might want to be able to clear out bad/incorrect/ data. Obviously, it’s mistakenly doing so (or something is), but saying it’s a violation is a bit strong.
Either way, it’s on my to-do today to forward over. As for other apps, I’m oddly seeing Withings missing in rest energy. But I haven’t investigated that too closely.
Are you sure, that you have values from Activity Energy, Rest Energy, Flights Climbed as well as Walking and Running Distance previous to end of March / beginning of April in Apple Health?
Would you mind sending me a screenshot (‘old entries’) of the following screens: 1) Apple Health – Sources – Data – Rest Energy – rift between ‘old’ and new entries. 2) Apple Health – Sources – Data – Rest Energy – any ‘old entry’. Maybe things can be pinpointed to a certain version of GCM?
Withings works fine for me and writes Rest / Activity Energy to Apple Health – but only a couple days back. But Withings seems to unable to read GCM daily aggregated step count from Apple Health, where other apps have no problem with…
Attached showing Mar 31st for Flights Climbed. Though oddly I’m missing other entries too in there, kinda a blend. I wore a Garmin floor-capable watch every day since Jan 3rd or so, so certainly I’d have that data.
In any event, Garmin is digging into it now. I sent them over a note along with a link to this specific portion of the thread. I’m on a production GCM iOS app version (whatever is current in the app store).
So, I guess we can agree, that things are fundamentally flawed and/or broken and don’t work as intended and/or advertised by Garmin.
Could you by any chance also ask, why they don’t write data to Distance (Cycling) and Distance (Swimming)? I can’t get my head around this “design decision” (Garmin Support on Facebook).
I have been suffering this same Garmin/HealthKit issue since January when I got my first garmin device for many years. It is not a new HealthKit issue like you think and Garmin still refuse to accept it’s anything to do with them.
Did you ever get a resolution to this issue? Active/Resting Energt is still only maintained for one day for me. I actually have a call with Apple to see what their response is.
Hmm, I’m a bit worried about the battery life.. In another review (wearable) I’ve read the following:
“We managed around 14 hours of fully GPS tracked hiking in our testing, but when we tried to put the watch into UltraTrac mode, we got exactly the same level of battery drain. -clearly something is awry. Garmin says you should get 60 hours of UltraTrac – so for multi-day hikers, the jury is still temporarily still out.”
Above is in line with other comments on this page that battery life isn’t close to the promised specifications. I want to use the watch mostly for running and hiking so this is a major concern for me. Are there any people who already used the watch in UltraTac mode and give feedback on battery life?
Ultratrack may not be perfect but if its the same battery life as when its turned off then sounds like a bug. Now does Garmin know about this bug? Ah, the problem of people complaining on forums where those who could look into and fix bugs will never find out about the problem.
Ray, maybe you should see how Garmin finds out about bugs (support desk only? forums?….) and how to best tell them of a problem? (best meaning lowest burden on us, their end users)
Just finished my second Ultra-trac test. This time with OHR off. It barley got 34hrs. Thats only a 10 hour bump from 1sec and OHR on.
So far results
GPS 1sec OHR on BT off = 23hrs
GPS Ultra-trac OHR on BT off = 28hrs
GPS Ultra-trac OHR off BT off = 34hrs
Something is def going on. I for one purchased the watch for the Ultra-trac mode because I go on multi-day hiking trips and I dont want to charge it every night.
Generally speaking, forums are the worst way to send in bugs. The very best way to send in bugs on the Fenix lineup is to validate said bug is still present on the latest Fenix beta (if available), and then send in to the e-mail listed there. Seen at top here: link to garmin.com
Second best is to contact support via phone/e-mail (I prefer phone). Third best is Twitter.
But really, the best way for a legit and ideally reproducible bug on the latest version is that e-mail. As with all things tech, being thorough and offering specific evidence (i.e. photos/data/etc…) is best. If one sends in a but that just says “Watch stopped tracking”, that’ll likely just get deleted.
But if you send in a but that says “I was 4 hours into a ride with a PowerTap P1 power meter using Bluetooth Smart and optical HR enabled. No other sensors, but my phone in live tracking mode, with GLONASS enabled and when I crossed over this Strava segment (Segment named XYZ, link to Strava segment) the unit reset. Attached is my device.fit file, my activity.fit file, and the ERR.log file. Also, when it restarted, it did not give me the option to ‘resume activity’. This is the first time I’ve seen this.”
Then, you’ll likely get not only a follow-up answer, but probably a fix – and usually even within the next firmware update. A typical watch firmware update (from Garmin or Suunto or Polar) may list 5-8 big ticket fixes on it publicly, but in reality it’ll have 30-50 fixes in it.
Remember, techies trying to solve the issue don’t care about excessive commentary or why this means you hate/love Garmin or the product in question. They just want to fix the issue. Keep it to the point, clear, and helpful. Put yourself in their shoes if you were trying to fix something. It’s not really the place for a dissertation.
(Obvious note: The above example text is not a real bug, it’s a made-up bug, but it roughly on the same level of detail as I provide. Though, I usually provide a lot more detail.)
Might be useful to have that in the bugs/quirks section of the review. Think of how many bugs could be fixed if people reported them so they knew to fix them instead of just complaining to people who can’t do anything about it
Agree mostly, but keep in mind that I was looking for confirmation if this is a real bug. It would hold me from buying the watch. When multiple users experience the same problem it’s a real bug instead of wrongly using the product. I’m sure garmin keeps track of some forums btw
Ray, thank you fo this great review, I choose to buy the watch after reading it…
Today I tried to set up the autolock function for triathlon swim section, enabling it into the activity menu, but it doesn’t seem to work.
Could you give me explanation on how to use it?
It will be fantastic not having to bother of buttons pressure during the chaotic swim starts…
The way it works is that after each sport change, the watch automatically locks itself. To unlock it, you’ll need to long-hold a button, and then you can switch to the next sport. So basically, it adds a long-hold vs just a single tap on the lap to switch sports.
Bug, bug, bug. Reveived my Fenix 5 today. Played around with menus a bit… and now no way to sync up watch with iPhone. Culprit seems to be Livetrack but it’s impossible to deactivate it without being in sync and even after resetting watch to defaults, Livetrack shows up on watch screen and sync up fails. Running out of ideas. Will try Garmin express. Disappointing.
Well. So here is the deal… I am an engineer and I cannot figure out how to get out of this bug. Already wasted 2 hours on this. Tried factory reset on the watch but as soon as I try to pair again with iPhone, LiveTrack starts and sync up process fails. How do we deactivate buggy livetrack? From the app only? Is it only accessible when the watch is paired? Will try to find time and contact Garmin support tomorrow. Like I said, disappointing. At this “arrogant” price point, I was expecting more robustness.
Just to clarify – was iPhone sync working and then it died once LiveTrack started, or?
I haven’t seen any issues with iPhone sync in general. On the flipside, it’s been a month or so since I tried LiveTrack on the F5. I use LiveTrack on the Edge 820 almost every every day with the same phone, fwiw, and that does still survive.
You can disable the automated live track option (if you had enabled it) on the app under device settings. It’s a manual configuration, as it doesn’t turn on automatically.
Hi Ray. Yes, I had absolutely no problem pairing my phone with the watch at first. I set up Wifi, Connect IQ apps, played with lots of functions (including activating LiveTrack)… until the watch stopped syncing up with my phone. So I ended up unpairing the watch to reinitiate the pairing process. Then, everytime I tried to pair, at the very end, of the process I would see the watch try to launch LiveTrack and the phone would say pairing process aborted or something like that. I may be wrong but it seems the LiveTrack menu only appears when a compatible watch is paired. And since I unpaired the watch I could not deactivate the function anymore. What is surprising is that even after a factory reset (powering with lap button pressed), the watch was still trying to initiate LiveTrack during the pairing process. That I did not understand. And at my third attempt at factory reset, the pairing process went through. Go figure!
Anyway, I am redownloading all the ConnectIQ apps I need again and set up all the screens again. I will keep LiveTrack active to give it a shot again and hopefully the watch will remain in a stable state. If problem comes back, I will document it better and probably make a video out of it and file a ticket.
I had an issue with Livetrack tonight as well. It worked fine yesterday, but today it would not end the session and would not let me sync my run via BT.
Finished my run and tried to sync, got a message saying it needed to end Livetrack session which I said yes to. Then I got the message ending session failed and could try again. I did that several times to no avail. I ended the session through the App on my iphone 7 and disconnected the phone and watch BT connection several times and restarted the app to reconnect. I was able to reconnect, but not sync (same message). Turned watch off and on disconnected phone and watch then repaired. Still no luck on sync. Decided to drive home and play with it at home. On the drive home I tried to turn off Livetrack on the watch itself and got the same message that it failed and asked if I wanted to try again. At that point I tried starting another activity (run) while I was still driving home. I let it run for a few stop lights then ended the activity and discarded the activity. When I pulled up to my house I checked Facebook to see if I could see the link from the Livetrack and it said the session had expired, so I tried to sync again and it finally went through.
I have a 5X with SW 2.9 and Connect app version 3.16 Livetrack was set for auto start with email and FB activity was a run
Not sure if it is normal, but Livetrack notification (saying it was active) on watch came up about .5 miles into my run and it only sent the link to one of the two email addresses I had listed.
Garmin has dramatically afterwards changed the battery life in the ultra trac mode, now they should really provide an angled charging cable for charging on the wrist during use!
For the 5x now downwards “up to 35 hrs” (the manual still says “up to 50hrs”…).
A few folks over at /r/garmin were musing over the inadequacies of Garmin’s mobile app nowadays (subjectively ugly, complex to use, does not adhere to platform guidelines, etc…). It was also given a scathing review by the mainstream website the verge recently
Hi Ray thanks as ever for all this info. I have a question I’d hoped someone on the Garmin forum would have responded to but no luck.
As I mentioned in previous posts I don’t seem to get a great signal on Fenix 5 (Ant+ and BT) and to be honest I think I preferred the bigger Fenix 3 who’s Ant+/BT signals were absolutely solid.
In honesty I’m looking to justify swapping my Fenix 5 for the 5X and there’s 2 Qs that will help me.
1. Does the 5X have a better antenna (or whatever it takes) than the Fenix 5 in terms of receiving signal from Ant+ and also to my phone (BT). Maybe not even a better antenna but is there evidence of it performing better in that regard.
2. I wouldn’t necessarily use the maps but am interested to know if the hardware / processor is better as a result of having to (ahem) process them and consequently it would likely then feel a little slicker to use.
These are the 2 questions I cannot find answers to anywhere in the universe, if anyone has a view then I’d be grateful to hear it, I read every comment on here (granted I brush over the angry people’s somewhat)
Thanks for the great review, DCR, as always. Question about the FirstBeat on F5 models. I have been sifting through the comments so my apologies if this has been asked already.
If I record an activity on a different Garmin device, such as F3HR, will that transfer over to the F5 using the TrueUp through GC and be utilized in the training load calculations for FirstBeat? Or will all of the activities for FirstBeat calculations need to be done on the F5 only?
I have exactly the same question, would be great if the date from an Edge bike computer linked up via TrueUp. Anybody know whether this works/is planned?
I have a Fenix 5S and seeing issues syncing with GC on an iPhone 6. My previous watch was an FR235 and I experienced no issues.
Sync rarely occurs automatically and live track doesn’t stop automatically. I’m guessing there is a link. Tomorrow I will try with live track off.
The watch is connected, receives notifications etc but refuses to sync. Sometimes I can force syncs if I turn off the phone an restart it but even this doesn’t always work.
I currently own a Fenix 3 HR. I wear the watch 24/7 and when the optical HR sensor kicks in in a dark room during sleep it is quite bright due to some sensor light. Since the Fenix 5 measures every second: is this sensor light visible in dark rooms and is it annoying?
If I move about and the watch is loose, I can see flickers of the sensor. But since the bump is small, I have to try and actively move my hand to see that.
In other words, doesn’t bother me at all in dark rooms.
I went from a F3hr to a F5x and the hr sensor lighting is not near as bright in the night, while sleeping, on the F5x because it does set closer to the skin and there isn’t as much illumination escaping between the watch(F5x) and the skin as with the F3hr. My wife complained about it with a couple of my fitness trackers with hr through the years, including the F3hr, but now I haven’t heard any complaints about the blinding(stimulating) light coming from my F5x in the middle of the night. lol
Ray, Thank you for your dedicated work. No review is perfect, but I find yours to be the best by far (actual workouts, complete comparisons, clear and funny writing style). Juste un petit conseil: ne te prends pas trop la tête avec certaines chaînes des commentaires; vaux mieux pas donner à manger le trll ;)
@inaki – hah, everyone who questions Ray’s reviews is a troll now? keep feeding yourself that
@depcious – read carefully the review of F3 and you’ll see that it fared not much better, 1s / glonass and all… (also found an interesting comment he makes about the relationship between free gear and review quality… seems I’m not alone in this suspicion either!)
Yes Max I remember the poor GPS performance on the F3 and it was written about on this site but that doesn’t detract, much as you’d want it to, from the fact fellrnrs methodology is flawed. If you are trying to get the best gps track then why not turn on the two things which will get you better gps tracks. And only when asked in the comments does he mention this fact !!!
As for reviewers getting “better” kit – no shit sherlock I’d be shocked if they didn’t. If I worked for Garmin or Suunto I’d have somebody test every part of the review devices I sent out so I didn’t get slammed in a review.
And because I’m sure you’re interested as you mentioned as much before I’m getting my iPhone replaced under warranty because the GPS was so poor it overstated runs by about 10%. It wasn’t difficult and I didn’t need to moan that every iPhone 7 was shit and broken. I, as a grown up, could appreciate that sometimes these things happen and just because it happened to me (and others) doesn’t mean everything is shit.
I’ve been using the Fenix 5 for a couple of days now. Unfortunately, I cannot make the OHR sensor providing me with useful information. The HR reading is completly off the chart. I tried everything – I even shaved off the hair under the watch. It didn’t help.
Check out the picture attached. I did 10min uphill intervalls and the HR does not correlate with the effort at all.
sorry mate, join the club, it’s useless for real exercise, look at the graph vs chest strap, i could understand some deviation under stress, but it’s actually dangerous – it just straight up lies to you…
(but beware – crowd here don’t like you questioning reviews here…)
I actually got a new watch already but the issue remained the same.
Btw, the altitude information is in meter not feet. And one Intervall lasted for about 10min as well as the subsequent recovery phase. There were no sharp pick-ups in pace or effort.
High intensity intervals, especially in hills, are the most difficult for optical heart rate. Before analyzing how to troubleshoot this difficult workout, can you tell us how your fenix5 behaves in an easy steady run (for example 30 minutes in a flat area with a constant pace or with a constant heart rate, for example 140 beats per minute)? If in a flat easy run it functions well, it’s a good start point.
General tips for optical HR (regardless of vendor), roughly in order of importance:
1) Ensure it’s snug (it doesn’t need to be crazy tight, just shouldn’t wiggle)
2) Ensure it’s not on wrist bone. Ideally it’s about 2-3cm up from it (towards elbow)
3) If both of those are done, consider changing wrists. I’ve definitely seen many cases where a watch works on one wrist, but not the other.
4) Try it out on the inside of your wrist, that’s technically a far better area for optical HR measurement, since it’s not as ‘hard’, so it’s easier to get a lock. Some actually prefer wearing their watches running this way anyway.
5) Also, this probably goes without saying, but ensure you have a lock (HR icon not blinking) before starting the run. If you run before that, it’s hopeless honestly.
6) Ensure you don’t have two watches side by side, with optical measurement that will impact the blood flow and often changes results (I actually just saw this in a quick fun test I did this weekend).
7) With respect to hill intervals, usually going up is no issue, since cadence is low enough it doesn’t get confused. Sometimes during recovery (going downhill), you can get oddities if the watch is loose.
For the vast majority of sensors these days, arm-hair isn’t an issue. Neither is darker skin. Sometimes it impacts things, but I haven’t seen that be the case for most people on the major sensors in a few years.
I just picked up a Fenix 5 Sapphire and it struggles to get a HR on my skin tone. I also got a vivosmart 3 earlier in the week and that struggles also. Both only seem to work on the inside of my wrist. Disappointing that for what ever reason this year Polar(a370) & Garmin(in my experience) released products that have serious issues on people of color.
I have a Fenix 5 Sapphire which I bought Tuesday. Love it so far. One question though – I found the broadcast HR feature, but wondered if I am also able to do an activity with the watch while broadcasting the HR?
Assuming the software is the same as the 935, the answer is yes. Go to the heart rate widget settings. Under “Heart Rate Options,” there is an option for, “Broadcast During Activity.” It will broadcast as a HRM during any activity. I’ve been using it to broadcast to my Wahoo Bolt during rides, and it works perfectly. It definitely drains the battery more quickly, but not in an outrageous way.
You hinted that there might be the technical possibility to implement Galileo GNSS in an future update. Do you actually, personally, think that this is going to happen someday for the F5?
I am trying to decide between the Fenix 5s and 5x. I want this for every day wear and for backpacking. I’m not a runner. I’ve read you can download map routes to the 5s and also read you can’t. I like the smaller size, but also like the mapping on the 5x. Need to know how useful the mapping is on the 5s or if I am better off with a handheld gps unit or the 5x. I have never owned any garmin before. I just received the 5s saphire in mail yesterday but don’t want to open it if the 5x is the better choice.
I thought the look and size of the F5s was more to my liking as well, but I chose the F5x instead for 2 reasons. First the TOPO maps are awesome, I like to know what’s around me not just where I am in a breadcrumb path, if I want to find a or body of water or something else near by, it shows up very nicely on the maps. The second reason I chose the F5x was for battery life, which also translates into long term usability of the watch. Since the F5s only last about 8 days on a charge verses the F5x at 12 days, you’re talking 150% more time per charge. Lithium batteries can only last 500-1000 charges for it’s life, so the usable life of the F5x will be 150% longer than the F5s based on battery longevity. I’ve had dozens of rechargeable products over the years and in 90% of those products it’s the battery that goes dead (not chargeable or won’t hold a charge) before anything else. So I put my money on the F5x.
You mean the battery will last 50% longer or the battery will last 150% the length of the 5S/5? My 920 is still going strong so I see it as an excuse to but the next generation when it comes out
But more seriously, what is the map for? Follow and record a hike? 5X is good. Browsing the map to find things? probably not so good
8\12 =1.50, so depending on how you word it it can be 50% more or 150% of the F5s, as I remember it being stated in math class. Within the map app there is a search function that can search for different categories of destinations: restaurants, gas, hotels, landmarks, etc. As long as you have good eye sight or have your glasses with you, it is very readable and you can zoom in and out and move up, down, left and right on the map. It’s quite functional for it’s small size.
They were talking about backpacking. Most of the time when hiking its the scrolling around the map to find things and see where a trail leads that is important. Yes the 5X can do it but not as easily as other units.
Personally I’m hoping the Edge 1000 gets replaced at Sea Otter and the replacement has a hiking mode as that size screen with a better way to interact with the screen would be much better for hiking
Were you suggesting that a hand held GPS such as the Sea Otter Edge 1000 would be a better choice for a backpacking GPS than the Fenix 5X? I am trying to avoid having to carry and charge multiple electronics on a 7 day Teton Mountain backpacking trip. It would be nice to have storm alerts, ABC, and know the true distance to the next camping zone. My other use for the Fenix model would be daily wear and activity tracking, but not for training and all that other golf stuff.
Big advantages of a handheld: much bigger, better screen, better antenna, many handheld models can be run off of normal AA batteries, so you don’t have to carry any electronics at all to keep it powered. Big disadvantage: you have to carry it somewhere. You can’t just strap it to your wrist (well you can, but you wouldn’t want to). Generally that’s not too bad, since you can clip it to a belt or a strap. Garmin already makes “Sea Otter Edge 1000″‘s, they have several lines of handhelds, and a lot of them pair with ANT+ sensors.
Hey Ray! Do you know if the Fenix 5S allows you to pause an activity, start and finish a new activity, and then return to the paused activity. For example, I’d like to be able to bike to work, pause that bike, go for a run after work, and then bike home and have only 2 activity entries, not 3. Thanks in advance for the info! =)
Hi Julia.
Unfortunately not. I do the same sort of thing. After a ride to work I select Resume Later but when I want to start a new activity the only option is Resume.
The only workaround is to use a different device to track your rides, I have used a Garmin Edge 800. But this method screws up the Recovery Advice and other metrics.
I just save each portion of the day and it actually looks much better on Garmin Connect and gives better results.
Hope this helps.
Good health.
Ray,
Sorry if this has been addressed before – I’ve seen a metal fenix 3 strap – I think you said this would be good for my 5x. Is that correct – thanks :)
The F3 bands do fit the F5x. I transferred my F3hr titanium band to my F5x and it fits perfectly. The metal band will be much heavier than the other options, but it will work.
I do my runs around Monceau park and so far I found my iPhone better at GPS tracking then the F5. Which is a bummer because I was expecting the opposite.
– Fenix 5 link to connect.garmin.com
– iPhone 6s (via Runkeeper) link to connect.garmin.com
You can see it gets very zigzaggy, especially around Lisbonne street.
Maybe cellular helps, I don’t know. Have you tested smartphones with F5?
That’s pretty ugly.
What’s your GPS settings on the 5? I just got my 5x and took it on a short run yesterday. I found it did okay with 1s and gps only (it thought it was set for both, but I just checked the run settings. I personally think that should be a global setting).
There was a short section where I was immediately adjacent to a building (one story) where it wandered off more than what I think was acceptable, and in a couple of turns at the beginning where it was putting me on the wrong side of the road more or less. I’m comparing to an iPhone 5s using Runmeter. The comparator tool I’m using says the 5x had 1206 points and the 5s 229 points. Nearly a thousand less data points. I don’t know how the exports work though, if any smoothing is done pre-export or if it’s complete raw data, etc.
Tomorrow I plan to do a longer trail run, we’ll see how it does. Still early spring here so no canopy in the trees yet, should be as easy as it gets for GPS on the trail.
So my first trail test on the 5x went pretty well. The course was just over 4mi, compared to an iPhone 5s there was a .11mi difference between the two viewing from 5x watch face/GC (4.15mi) and on the phone app (4.26mi, Runmeter). Nothing jumps out to me on either track as being significantly off. My gut tells me the phone was the better track, but both are acceptable.
Here is where I think things get interesting. I export out the .gpx file from my phone and the .gpx file from GC, upload to a comparitor app to overlay the tracks and the distances match (the app doesn’t accept .fit). Furthermore, if I upload the 5x .fit file to Strava distance matches the watch (4.15mi), if I upload the .gpx from GC it then matches roughly the phones distance (4.27mi).
in km:
6.676km using .fit
6.880km using .gpx
I don’t see a difference in the map tracks between the two, but I haven’t overlaid them.
It seems as though they must use different algorithms, but not sure what to make of it.
Why are there different distances for the same run and device for .gpx and the .fit file?
Attached is the comparison using .gpx files. I’ll create another post to show the .fit distance from GC.
To summarize, depending on whether I choose the .fit or .gpx as the export file of choice for the same activity there is a noticeable difference in the calculated distance. Why?
Good thought Paul, but no auto pause on either unit.
To add, I have the option on the runmeter phone app for either gpx or tcx file for export. I get the same resulting track and distance for either format.
On GC, the tcx file distance matches the fit file, which are both less than the gpx file distance.
It’s obvious what’s happening is that sometimes you’re being told what the device says, and sometimes you’re being told what the GPS track says when the distance is recomputed from the track. I’ll bet if you look at the GPX file it doesn’t have a header or trailer entry for total distance, while TCX and FIT do. Garmin Connect believes whatever the device tells it, while other sites (Strava I think) always recompute the distance from the track and ignore the device. I asked about Auto Pause because that’s one way that can happen, the device mistakenly thinks you’re stopped while your still moving and so you actually add distance while the device doesn’t accumulate distance because it thinks you’re stopped. The track (unless you’re on a unusually twisty track) will give the right distance while the device won’t. If you don’t have auto pause on, though, it’s probably just yet another new device bug on the Garmin side.
Hi Scott, I am experiencing exactly the same issues. The watch reports the wrong distance in the FIT files, but if you export it to a TCX or GPX file you get the correct distance. Why am I saying its wrong, well the TCX from fenix 5 files are nearly exactly the same as the fit files from my 520, and fenix3, as well as those of fellow cyclists on the same route. I get the same errors with running files , but the discrepancy is less. It is as if the watch is calculating the wrong distance in the fit file (like a rounding error). The differences is consistently shorter, between 3-8%. I have made sure that its per second recording, and all the settings are exactly the same for all the devices. I am on all the latest versions on all devices. I did log a call with Garmin but have not had any feedback as yet. Have you had any success in resolving your issue?
Thanks for all the efforts you put in to the reviews Ray! Really enjoy reading both reviews and the more ”social” blog parts! If you ever end up in Sweden – send me a mail and I will be happy to show you around and to train with you.
With that said – here is a suggestion. Why don’t you add a testing method for the in depth reviews – run or/and bike the same route several times with all the tested devices (e.g. like fellrnr does) just to see how they behave. Then everybody can judge by themselves what they think is acceptable in terms of accuracy and consistency. All testing methods have pros and cons but I believe that this would add a dimension to the in depth reviews.
If you need assistance in running the same route I am pretty sure that you will find people willing to assist you. If you decide to take me up on the suggestion send me a mail and I will get down to Paris to assist in running the same route for a weekend. :-)
You could create a segment/segments and then we all could go there and run/bike the same route to test our devices and also compete with each other. :-) The DCR testing route.
As far as I know (haven’t tried downloading someone else’s track from Strava), no one is stopping you from doing that. Everyone who’s listed on a segment has a GPS device and a track. Choose an existing segment with lots of traffic, download all of the tracks, build a database and do whatever tests you like on it.
As for testing on just one track, suppose brand X has algorithms that are superior in cases of multipath reflections off buildings, but are lousy everywhere else, where brand Y works superbly everywhere else but is inferior in cities. If Ray tested on just one track in the city, it would falsely show that brand X is better than brand Y, where as if he tested in a variety of places and conditions as he does now, the assessment would be far more realistic. These devices aren’t used just on one track, so testing on one track can lead to false impressions.
If I had to choose inly one testing method I would go with Rays current set up so – Paul S – You are right and I agree. It would be misleading with a one route test. However, my point is to ADD a standard route test to what he does today.
I guess it would be possible to find a route with both buildings, open space and some trees – pretty much as many of us usually run.
A bit like the standard European Driving Cycle. Everybody knows that it is close to impossible to reach the same fuel consumption in real life driving but still it adds something to have a standard cycle used for testing of all new cars.
I would like to sound creative and not negative towards todays methodology and certainly not as negative as some of the guys/comments above but rather the other way around.
I guess it would extend the idea to other places than France/Paris. Ray could ask some guys to test in different parts o the world – running standard routes in different places with different devices. If asked I would consider to be the Scandinavian guy. :-)
In most cases, the challenge is more logistical than desirability.
With unlimited units and time (and people) I could devise many interesting tests. But units actually is really the limiting factor, at least early on in a product cycle. I usually only have 1-2 copies of each unit, and if it’s two copies, one is often a beta/pre-prod device where I wouldn’t want to base accuracy portions of the review on it.
The other problem is that in watching other people do standardized accuracy tests, most screw it up (I mean that in the nicest possible way). Rarely on purpose, but just on accident. Forgetting to switch from smart recording to 1-second. Or not having GLONASS in equal settings on all units. Or just using the wrong software. Or forgetting to start with full satellite, etc… Putting units directly next to each other (bad), and so on…
Much of that could be resolved via checklists and so forth, but it’s tricky to get others on the same page. I keep meaning to finish a ‘how I do accuracy testing’ post for both GPS and power meters. There’s a lot of nuances that aren’t necessarily apparent to the casual observer, while I suspect many commentators here pick-up on them quickly or already know them. Someday…
I agree it might be logistically difficult to get a broader sample of GPS readings for a better overall performance picture of the watches.
However, for oHR readings it would be sufficient to find one or two people in your circle who struggles to get good readings and post their results too. I think many people (including me) have/had unrealistic expectations of oHR based on the graphs you post(ed) in your reviews, because the technology seems to work very well on your wrists.
Hello,
First of all, thank you very much for the reviews ! So much details ! ? I have a Fenix 5S (a recent gift !) and I have a few long hikes planned. I tried different settings to try and find the best options to save battery life and ensure it would last for the entire hike which could be up to 11 hours. The specs say it would last 14hours with wrist HR and normal GPS but on recent runs I found that it was using up to 10-15% of battery per hour. I tried to use a chest HR instead of wrist HR but it got worse… I tried ultratac but it failed miserably (better at battery but no GPS position for several hours!!!). I turned off the phone connection. What would be your recommendation to get a good GPS route and still save batteries? Thanks a lot ! Laurence
You should actually try running it 11 hours and see what happens. The battery indicator isn’t linear (you can’t extrapolate) and isn’t always correct. I have 2 Garmin watches, the original Fenix and an Epix, and both have no problems going 11 hours. (But of course, neither has optical HR). Garmin specs are usually wrong, but the indicator may be misleading you, too.
First, you’re the best! The best site out there for real reviews!
Question – I’ve been using the Fenix 5x for the past 2 weeks or so and wonder if anyone else has run into this problem. It will notify me I’m approaching a starve segment while running or biking and if I don’t continue on the segment it continue to re-route me to the segment. If I then go to the navigation menu and stop navigation to stop the re-routing to the segment I feel like it then stop notifying me of upcoming segments. What should I do if I don’t state on the segment?
Interesting. My experience is if I deviate from approaching the segment I immediately get a notification that I’m off segment. It will sometimes remind me that I’m approaching but after I’m about 200 ft and counting from the segment start i don’t get that reminder anymore. So hat translates into a notification of approaching segment and then if I don’t take that turn I might get one or two more reminders and then that’s it. A little annoying but not awful. I have the F5. I thought it would only notify me of starred segments in strava, but it’s showing me all of them. I haven’t found a setting to only show starred either.
I just noticed after a run this weekend that when the “approaching segment” notification countdown comes up, it has the option to press the down button to dismiss. I used that several times and it was perfect for when you’re approaching a segment but not going to take it. Or if you just don’t want to see stats for that particular segment. Hope that helps!
Been using the fenix 5 at the pool this week. Working perfectly at counting the laps. No single lap missed. I also really like the optional 3s second countdown before each interval that I believe was not present on the 735XT. Also set an alert every 4 lengths to help me keep track of where I am in the set without looking at the watch and I am happy to see that it resets at each interval. Well done!
Now, it’s the first time I own a watch with a barometer and I noticed what I believe is a bug but please let me know if I am wrong. Here it is: Everytime I get out of the pool, the barometer is ~70 mbar higher and altitude ~500 m higher. This is normal since the watch was immersed but what I do not get is that it stays in this state after I get out of the pool (even hours afterwards) until I recalibrate the altitude (manually or via GPS) in which case both the altimeter and barometer goes back to normal values. I do not understand why the pressure changes when calibrating altitude. That does not look right at all. What’s other people experience with other watches?
I know there are some Ant+ issues with Shimano Di2. However I just upgraded from a Fenix 3 and I cannot connect the Fenix 5 to either of my Shimano Di2’s…. Both bikes have the most current d-fly’s, the cylindrical Ant+/Bluetooth version. I was able to connect all other sensors (and I have tons) to the Fenix 5, but neither bike. The bikes connect to my Edge 1000 no problem. Does anyone know if this is a known issue?
I am a proud new owner of Garmin Fenix 5. Your article really helped me decide.
Yesterday I did roughly 11,000 steps but today syncing wirelessly or wired steps show roughly 7000 steps. I tried garmin express and I tried garmin connect. Same results. Watch shows yesterday at 10k steps. Any advice here?
Yes and I also created a garmin ticket. I see other forum posts where step counts are off by 25% since 2015 in many cases. Nobody posted the solution so I’m still on the hunt here.
Great price and good spot, if you are looking to catch the best price on Amazon I can recommend https://uk.camelcamelcamel.com to get price alerts before things like this sell out.
As Ray mentioned in his review, the Stryd apparently has trouble keeping the connection with the Fenix 5. i.e. frequent drop-outs. Read on Garmin Forum that other people also have this problem. With the 5X apparently things are fine…
To be clear, I was referring to the Quick Release kit for Triathlon (for wrist and for bike handlebar/zerobar), NOT just the bike mount part #010-11029-00.
I’ve asked this question as well. If it is in fact the case that the Quick Release Kit for the FR935 (010-11251-0S) will work with the Fenix 5 (22mm bands) then the Fenix 5X and 5S still needs some kind of quick release.
I’ve ordered the Fenix 5 upgrading from the FR920XT, but the quick release kit is a deal breaker, no way I’ll do ironman without the quarter turn system from swim to bike and then to run.
I’ve posted this on the Garmin forum and I’m hoping someone here might be able to help me. My watch crashes when I do the commands below —
Start button
–> Navigate
–> Courses
–> Select a course
–> Do course (but do not “start” course with the “start button”)
–> Press the down button a few times to scroll through the data fields
Hold the menu button
–> Navigate settings
–> Data screens
–> Down button a few times
Back button repeatedly until I got back to the watch face
Down button a few times to scroll through the widgets and then the back button to go back to the watch face
This usually results in the watch face showing the second hand moving as normal but the buttons cease to do anything. If it doesn’t crash by that point, I can open the “save location” app and exit it, then open the “walk app” and exit it, then repeat the above with the navigation app, wait five minutes and it’ll always crash shortly after.
I’ve already reset the watch once.
The watch does not seem to crash if I load a round-trip course or I set the watch to create a course based on a given location. The crashing only seems to occur with imported courses.
I’ve been waiting since around June of last year to get my first garmin watch. I’ve had the original TomTom cardio HR for a couple years. I was hesitant on the fenix 3HR because I felt like the form factor was a couple years old already since it didn’t change from the F3. When garmin announced the F5 and F5X I started again one over which model to buy. I ended up going with the F5 for the more compact package and after a couple weeks I absolutely love it. My brother bought the F5X and I totally have map envy, the maps for trail running or hiking are really really cool. But for 95% of my use cases I don’t need maps so I went smaller. If they figure out how to put maps in the F5 casing next year I’ll probably upgrade again, but for now it’s fantastic. I love the sleep tracking data, steps, all day HR, Strava love segments are so awesome I’m totally chasing some KOMs, I’ve had great swims with it and I look forward to mountain biking with it and skiing next winter. I got the sapphire glass black on black and before I bought it I was bummed I couldn’t get the silver gray bezel without buying the expensive metal hand. But now that I have it the black on black is super cool. It reminds me of a military tactical watch or something. The styling is awesome. It looks super close to “normal” for a bigger sized watch, whereas with my brothers F5X I feel like it just looks and feels slightly uncomfortably big. But the maps are awesome if you want them.
Is anyone on the fence about the F5 vs. the 935? I have ruled out the F5S due to the short straps that I do not believe would fit my wrists. The F5 has that look of a real watch and looks great. For me, the weight is the concern. I tried the F3 HR and it was too much for me. The F5 is smaller, but not by much. The 935 has it all, but looks a bit plasticky though. Did you have the same concern over the bulk of the F5 and how did you decide on it?
John, I have the Fenix 5, and I’m facing a similar question of F5 vs 935. I ordered a 935 and will be comparing the two. I love the look of the Fenix 5, the weight is noticeable, but not a deal breaker for me. What I’m more concerned with are the GPS tracks and pace accuracy and consistency of the 2 watches. My Fenix 5 is not giving bad data (GPS track and pace), but it’s not as good as I was expecting (coming from the 920).
Based on the 935 and Fenix 5 forums, early reviews seems to indicate the 935 performing in terms of GPS track accuracy and pace stability, and I’ll be putting the units head to head here in the coming days.
There is another point to consider, the software that runs on the devices. Currently the 935 is a plastic F5 but it is unknown if that will continue. If the F5 follows the pattern of the F3 there will be features added in down the line that the F5 doesn’t have now. Will those features also be added to the 935? Its unknown.
Thanks for the feedback Chris. Eli also raises a good point. F5 will likely receive all of the updates as that is the crown jewel of the Garmin lineup.
Ray, thanks as always for the exceptionally in-depth review. I’ve had the Fenix 5, which I am hoping can replace both my Vivoactive and Edge 520, for about 6 days now, during which I’ve worn it basically 24/7 and for an HIIT treadmill workout, an intensive spin class, a 10-mile hilly trail run, and a 42 mile road bike ride. I’m having some difficulties with the ORH. In addition to some of the expected issue flagged in Ray’s various reviews of Garmin OHR watches, such as difficulties tracking sharp intervals and some issues with road cycling, I’m finding random spikiness and unreasonably high readings in what should be less challenging situations. This morning I recorded my normal morning walk to work as an activity and uploaded to Strava. This was a downhill walk at a pretty constant pace. I have a pretty low RHR, and I believe that my HR during this walk is typically in the 70-90 range. The HR graph shows several sharp spikes, into the 120’s with gradual declines. There is no way my HR ever got that high and the shape of the graph is entirely implausible.
Any thoughts about what could be causing this or how it might be addressed?
I have exactly the same issue! I’ve had the Fenix 5 (Sapphire edition) for almost 2 weeks now and everytime I go out for a run HR wrist is showing approx 30+ beats. Yesterday decided to go to the local Garmin vendor and they informed me to wait for 3-4 weeks more cause Garmin might issue updates which might solve the problem. They guided me to run with the chest strap for now. I used my old HR chest monitor this morning and Fenix 5 mapped out correctly my HR data.
One of the main reasons I bought the Fenix 5 was cause of its optical wrist HR!!
Currently several people return their Fenix 5 in order to replace it with a 935 because of GPS issues (very erratic instance pace and sick-zack GPS routes).
Saying that I still own my Fenix 5 saphir and I’m ok with the GPS.It has it flaws (compared to other GPS watches that I own [several Garmins and a Suunto Ambit2]) But for distance and basic tracking it’s still ok for me.
So if GPS is an issue for you, maybe something to consider.
I can only speak from my experience with the F5x. The GPS is about average in my estimation, but I take a route that gives GPS some challenges, no matter the product. About a mile of my route being at the base of an 80 foot cliff, which leaves 1/2 of satellite views blinded. Another 3 to 4 miles is under heavy vegetation(tree foliage). In GPS + Glonass sometimes I get a zip-zag on the mappoing, but the mileage is always right on. With UltraTrac, the mileage is off by 7-8%, but with the challenging satellite views. The HR monitor is the best I’ve experienced for wrist based HR. I’ve owned about half a dozen wrist HR monitors, in including the F3hr and the F5x works well for my wrist as long as I have it snug enough. Some others have had issues, but that ‘s common as I understand it with different skin types, wrist size and shapes and so forth. The best thing to do is buy it from a place with an easy return policy so you can at least try it out for yourself.
I’m using the Fenix 5 since the release day and I really like it.
In particular I’m really satisfied with the new Training Load function that seems to pair well with my traning program.
The only problem is that I don’t like to use the Fenix as my main bike instrument. I prefer a bike computer which is easy to mangae during bike runs expecially if you are on a triathlon bike.
Donig so I loose all the Training Load informations of my bike rides and so my profile isn’t as complete as it could be.
I know I can use both the Fenix and the Edge 820 at the same time but I already know I will usually forget of pushing the buttons on both!
I’m wondering why Garmin hasn’t already implemented a function to use both instruments in a kind of syncro mode, so that you could have both instruments display the same data and set laps just pressing the button on one of the two instruments.
At the end they already has the Varia Visor that is doing quite the same…
I have been using Garmin 235 and thinking about moving to Fenix 3 HR or 5. Just wonder for heart rate accuracy is there any improvements (especially Spikes) of Fenix 5 over Fenix 3 as the comparison with Fenix 3 using heart rate strap? If none, I will be moving up to Fenix 3 HR instead for better value.
I had the same thought as you but the Fenix 3HR hasn’t dropped as much in price yet as the Fenix 3 plain (which can be had for as low as 270$ refurbished these days).
Additionally, despite its young age, Garmin stopped software development for the Fenix 3HR (and FR630). This means the Fenix 3HR will probably never be compatible with newer gear like the RD Pod, nor will it ever support IQ2.x+ apps.
That convinced me to pony up a little more for the F5.
I do have to say that oHR just doesn’t work for me (haven’t had a single run without issues), while for many other people apparently it’s great. I read a post by a guy on the Garmin forum saying upon complaining a dealer told him to sit tight for a firmware release that is coming which supposedly would improve oHR on the F5, no idea if there’s any truth in that.
I haven’t’ used the 235, but I have used an HR strap with several devices and also owned a F3hr and how have a F5x. I can give you a comparison between those. Of course, the HR strap is the most accurate of the three, although it’s not perfect either, especially during warm ups at first picking up on HR. The F3hr has only about 75-80 % the accuracy of the HR strap and does suffer from spikes on HR data from time to time. The F5x is about 95% accurate and I haven’t had a problem with spikes showing up on HR data. The F5x is not as sensitive in my experience with how it sets on your wrist as the F3hr was. It doesn’t seem to lose consistency when there isn’t a good wrist connection. If there is no connection at all, it just leaves the data blank, it doesn’t try and fill in the blanks. The only time I’ve had it leave data blank is when the band is too loose or I take the watch off my wrist. The F5x is about as accurate and consistent as you’re going to get with a wrist HR monitor. For my purposes, it’s about as good as it gets, but I try not to be a perfectionist either, even though I want good consistent data.
I’m seeing heart rate spikes and, in particular, heart rate getting exceptionally high towards the end of runs. I’ve seen some professional reviews where they were sent new hardware than then provided better oHR results and others recommending waiting for firmware.
Any good advice on whether to push Garmin for a new device or just wait?
Question for those with Cycling Power Meter:
When setting up power meter sensor, is there option to enable auto calibration prompt (as would be in Edge series?) This is one feature solely lacking in Fenix 3HR right now and very annoying to go through hoops of menu. Might be tipping point for me to upgrade… (another reason being size)
Hi Ray.
I created a 120 mile course on Garmin Connect and sent it to my Fenix 5.
I selected do course. It then said 50 course point max. exceeded. Final 83 points will not be shown.
When creating courses I usually have the settings set to keep on roads.
I didn’t know of this limitation. Do you have any tips besides splitting my ride into multiple courses.
Fortunately I had the same course loaded onto my Edge 800.
I notified 2 problems:
1) there is not possibility to activate /deactivate data pages. Once you create a page you have to keep it for each training session (you cannot deactivate it) you can only delete it if you do not wont the page for a specific session.
2) F5 does not pair with power meter Stages (Ultegra)
Ouch on not pairing up. Have you tried resetting stages? I’ve had stages having that with Garmin 520 while back when I had it too. Not sure if you have other power meter that pairs up… but if you do, can you tell me if you have option to enable calibration prompt for power meter?
Hi. Had an interesting issue this morning on my 1 week old Fenix5X and wondered if anyone else had seen it. I woke up and watch all seemed fine. 4 hour HR was showing a pretty normal looking track while I had been asleep. I synched it with garmin connect after I woke up and Garmin didn’t have any sleep data and it seems to show that my HR locked at a 105 at 9:30pm last night and just shows a flat line right through and “bizarrely” is currently showing a flat line all the way through until almost 4pm today (it is currently 6:55am). I have synched multiple times but nothing changes. I did a basic restart on the watch (not a full reset) and when it came back up the 4 hour HR graph was empty (not sure if this is normal behavior or not as I have never restarted it before). It is synching to my phone however because it seems to have already synched into the future the data is not overwriting it seems. One thing that implies it has some idea what the data really was is that the HR range stated in the connect app screen is “45-105” but all it shows is a flat line at 105.
No sleep data synched and it seems like all the real activity data is lost…or it is at garmin and something has gone wrong on connect.
Screenshot of my gamin connect app for today (at 6:55am) is attached. As you can see it is saying that it already has data until almost 4pm…
Anyone else seen this? Any ideas? Is there a better to way to handle when this happens so you don’t lose the data? Perhaps I shouldn’t have restarted the watch?
Is there any way to delete the activity tracking data from Garmin connect? I can’t seem to find a way to do this for activity tracking.
My Fenix 5 arrived today. I’m surprised. There is no watchface wich includes the hour of the day and the heart rate. Is it too simple, there are the two datas i need the most of the time. Do i miss something ?
I recently bought fenix 5 as an upgrade from my previous 920XT. I am interested in additional Firstbeat feature called Performance Condition. Do you think this feature also takes elevation into its algorithm? I cannot find any explanation on this, so I don’t know for sure wheather it may yield into incorrect calculation if we use it for uphill running for instance (indicate we are more somewhat “exhausted’ compared to flat terrain run)
Here you can find more information about the Real-Time Performance Condition: link to firstbeat.com…e-performance/. The analysis is based on the heart rate variability and this analysis has the same technology as the VO2max analysis. Like mentioned in the text it takes also internal and external workload into account. Increase or decrease in altitude are considered as external workload, thus the analysis is taking also these into account.
Dear Ray,
Many thanks for your work – I love those reviews … great help in the battle raging in my head (and heart) at the moment – whether to replace my Suunto Ambit by the Garmin Fenix 5 Saphire or the Suunto Spartan Wrist HR.
I very much would like to get rid of my heart rate belt (for most activities), and the bottom line for me seems to be that the Garmin product has advantages when it comes to overall features (not so important to me) and GPS accuracy (quite important), whereas the Suunto probably offers the most valid heart rate measurement (the reason to retire my Ambit in the first place).
Now for my question: I possibly found something that is not covered in your review … :-) Don’t think me ungrateful, but may be you have information on this that would also be of interest to others.
When the glass of my FR305XT shattered after intensive contact with Austrian rock and I asked Garmin for repairs, they offered a new FR305 at a reduced price. I am no friend of this throw-away mentality, and, in contrast, I was able to get a full range of repairs from Suunto: Glass/bezel, wristband, battery. All on short notice and at reasonable prices, also for older products like a 2001 Suunto Vector. I like that.
Do you have any information on the support for the Fenix 5 (3) with regard to battery, bezel etc.?
Many thanks again … Pleas keep it up!
I’ve wondered too if this device line is meant to be more serviceable given the screws on the front and back. If so, that’s a very nice plus versus the Forerunner NNNxt line.
I upgraded from Forerunner 235 to Fenix 5 — essentially to get more battery life: I don’t do a lot of workout, but I walk a lot to stay reasonably healthy, typically 20-35 km in cities and in the country side in the course of a 12-14 hour day. In between: lots of breaks in cafes, etc., while reading, taking photos, etc.
—
So far, I’m disappointed! In many ways, the Forerunner 235 worked better, and I don’t understand some of the Garmin design choices…
* With Forerunner 235, I could pause the GPS logging, and after some 2 minutes, the watch went into hibernation and turned off GPS. When I resumed, the logging continued on the same leg.
* With Fenix 5 (I have set up the Fenix 5 with activity “Walking” while the Forerunner 235 was set up with “Running”), the clock does *not* go into hibernation — at least not for quite some time!
* With Fenix 5, after some time (5 minutes, or is it more?), instead the paused watch starts to count down towards Auto Save! Why? This is insane (to me!), I want to decide myself when to save the activity. What is worse, if I allow for auto save to complete, when I resume, a totally new, independent activity starts.
* If I touch the up-down arrows during count down to auto save, auto save stops. But it seems like the log is terminated and a new log is initiated — even though the km (or mile, if you will) counter is not reset. And after 30 minutes or so, count down to auto save starts again…
* When I pause, I can choose Resume Later. But this also creates a new log — just like the above case.
* When I import a walk into Connect which has been “resumed later” or where I have stopped/delayed auto save by hitting the up-down keys, it seems like the total length of the activity is shown, but the map only shows the *first* leg, i.e., until I paused the watch.
* Because there is no real hibernation (like after 2 minutes for the Forerunner 235), the Fenix 5 “burns” battery, and it certainly does not last as long as I have expected.
Questions:
1. Is my problem due to my choice of “walking” instead of “running” as activity? If not,…
2. Is there a way to change settings so that I can get rid of this stupid “auto save”?
3. Is there a way to change settings so that I can pause the activity, and resume in a proper way while keeping the same log — so that I can view the track of the *entire* activity in Connect?
4. Is there a way to change settings so that the watch can hibernate the GPS system after, say, 2 minutes — just like it works on the Forerunner 235? And not after 1 hour or so…
To me, the possibility to see the entire track in the map is a big motivating factor for my walks.
I understand that I’m not a typical/important type of customer for the Fenix 5, but still — the choices by Garmin makes no sense to me.
Thanks for the detailed review. Just a question. Have you ever tried out Polar’s training load function? If so where can I find the review? Can you do a quick compare between the two?
I am just getting to know with my new Fenix 5.
Could anyone help me please to find the menu item from Ray’s review showing: “Also, the Fenix 5 can record HRV data from an HR strap to the activity files” It is the image # 107.
Im really wantingto get the fenix 5 but i cant decide on wether to get the 5 or the 5x, could anyone hear give me any more advice on here whos got one, as i cant seem to get y hands on a 5x yet to compare them.
thanks in advance
I got the F5x and the decision for me was really between the F5s and the F5x, since the F5 and the F5x are only 4mm and 10g in size difference, I’d just as well have the Topo maps of the F5x with that small amount of difference. The other thing that swayed me was the F5x uses the same size bands as the F3hr, which I owned also and had a titanium band that I transferred to the F5x(see picture). The reason I was deciding between the F5s and the F5x is about a smaller stylish look of the F5s for everyday wear, which was my plan in replacing my 30+ year old well made watch that I wore everyday. But I decided to go for function of the F5x over the style of the F5s mainly because the battery life was so much different as well as screen size with no increase in pixel density. So it came down to function over style in my case. For me personally the size difference between the F5 and the F5x was minimal, for the availability of the Topo maps.
Thank you for that reply, most helpful, I think as soon as I can get hold of one I’ll go for the 5x and try to find a metal strap for it. And I must apologise for the poor spelling in my post I didn’t read it through properly.
For a different perspective: I found that the size difference between the F5 and F5x felt rather substantial on the wrist. While for me (rather thin wrists) the F5 pushes the limit of what seems like an acceptably sized everyday watch, but the F5x is definitely beyond it. I originally intended to get the F5s, but after trying on the F5 decided that it actually looks pretty good and therefore opted for the slightly better screen resolution and longer battery life of the F5. Of course, if you need mapping, the 5x is the only choice.
Anyone knows what’s the battery capacity of the fenix 5? I can’t it anywhere. If it’s only 300 mah like the Fenix 3 HR, I’m now worried about the battery life that much because during a multi-day hike I can recharge it more than ten times with my usb powerbank.
I looked for that everywhere as well and could not find any mention or confirmation of battery size. My guess is it’s the same 300 mah as the F3. From what I gather, Garmin is hoping to get more out of the 300 mah with more efficient firmware and software applications. I assume that will be an ongoing process.
Actual battery capacity is pretty much irrelevant because capacity combined with draw is what determines life. If the electronics in the F5 are more efficient than the F3, then you don’t need a larger battery.
Assuming that Garmin measures battery life consistently across devices, the comparative life numbers are all you need.
As I recall, it seems there is a detail adjustment you can make on the Topo maps for the most detail, average detail and less detail. I’m not sure if that effects that data on the POI, but it’s worth a try.
Thanks for this great review! I really thinking about 5 & 5X choice. In fact, I’m not really sure about 5X mapping capabilities are so stunning to spend so much.
Hi. I had the same thought before going for the 5. It’s smaller, nearly flush hr (makes a comfort difference). Better screen. But best thing for me is the running first beat status. It’s great. Also, future proofed through connect iq2.2 (which fenix doesn’t have). One I haven to tried is training peaks Integration for better structured workouts.
Before buying the F5 I looked into this too.
I think the Fenix 3HR hasn’t come down enough in price to justify it as a worthy alternative, consider that refurbished F3s (without wrist HR) can be had for 270$ these days.
Another thing to consider is that software development for Fenix 3HR has basically stopped. New watch Apps/faces/data fields in IQ2.x+ are not supported and newer accessories like the RD Pod don’t work on the F3HR either. I’d pony up a little extra for the F5.
Anyone seeing this issue with Stages connecting to their Fenix 5 with Bluetooth? …
Because my Stages Power Meter (running latest firmware) ANT+ signal is so weak with my new Fenix 5S I find ANT+ unusable with nearly 95%+ dropouts when in riding position. If this is the fault of Stages for a weak signal or Fenix 5S for having a less sensitive antenna compared to my past Garmin products I don’t know. I haven’t had a problem connecting the ANT+ to my Garmin Edge 820 and the Bluetooth to my Fenix 5S however. When both devices record the same ride the recorded power and cadence values in the respective devices look nearly identical however when viewing the ride in Garmin Connect the ride with my Fenix 5S (using Bluetooth) shows accurate values recorded for cadence/rpm but then an average cadence value nearly DOUBLE the real cadence value. This is causing the estimated calorie burn to also more than double. Also I have attempted to calibrate my Stages before a ride and your iPhone app shows the calibration as “899” the Edge 820 shows the calibration as “900” and my Fenix 5S shows the calibration as “899” using ANT+ (which is then unusable if I ride) or “0” if I use Bluetooth. Despite this the actual recorded values for Power look nearly identical between ANT+ and Bluetooth? Is this normal?
Here are two examples using a leisure ride where I wasn’t trying to put out big power values…
Fenix 5S using 2.90 firmware
Stages using 2.0.82 firmware
Hey David I was having exactly those issues and whilst general opinion was the problem was the stages it turned out it was a mixture of stages and Fenix, I had the Fenix 3 before it and that was perfect. I also disconnected Garmin Connect from myfitnesspal due to the ridiculous kcalories it was churning out.
I never did get the Fenix 5 to connect to the Stages using Ant+ and BT was also hit and miss in the end I sent my watch back to Wiggle as unfit for purpose.
I then bought the Fenix 5X as I was curious that the bigger Fenix 3 worked fine, lo and behold I haven’t had any issues with the 5X (if you don’t count the GPS issues – see link)
That makes me nervous Vince. So question… when you say your Fenix 5X works with Stages are you talking ANT+ or Bluetooth? If you are talking about ANT+ perhaps it’s because the larger 5X has a better Fenix 3 style antenna that picks up the ANT+ signal better … BUT if even Stages Bluetooth is properly parsing cadence and the 5/5S isn’t… woah. I’m hoping this is a firmware/software error in way Garmin is parsing the left only data via Bluetooth but if it’s hardware that would *suck*.
Also a sign of hope for a fix… although the watch and Garmin Conmect are doubling the true average cadence and calories when paired to Strava the file is parsed correctly and shows the proper cadence and calories. I truly think this is a software or firmware issue so the real question is does Garmin or Stages have the ability to quickly fix this since it’s a bit niche.
GOOD NEWS… the 2.96 firmware beta APPEARS TO HAVE FIXED THIS. Cadence average and calories are identical/near identical on ANT+ vs. BTLE on a very, very short test ride this morning using my two devices (Edge 820 & Fenix 5S). This fix wasn’t listed in beta notes but there was an update to the ANT/BTLE stack in the beta. There is still a tendancy to “smooth” or be less responsive to change via BTLE so you see some lag when you stop pedaling etc. but the differences vs. ANT+ are fairly minimal. I didn’t check to see if there is still an issue with calibration via BTLE reading an odd offset, as my wattage is a bit difference BTLE vs. ANT.
This is probably a dumb question but with the 5x – I can create a “Round Trip” course and it let’s me select my activity type – but if I create and upload a course, how do I do that course as a “Run”? I’ve tried several different ways and they all come back as “Other” for Activity Type.
I figured it out – it’s weird but you have to start the timer for running – stop the timer and then go into navigation and select a course – seems totally backwards – but that worked.
Is there a way to turn off POI symbols on the 5X ?
Where I live, there are so many POI’s and because of their symbols , I can’t see the roads, streets anymore as the roads are fully covered with POI symbols.
I have some questions about the 5x and it’s maps/route creation.
1. The review says I can select a POI near me and it will create a route to it, but can I program it to create a route to my home from another location? Or would I need to select a POI near my home? If so, does the POI need to be within a certain range for it to be selected? (eg. my home is 10km away but it only shows POI’s within a 1km/5km range).
2. When it creates a route, does it use popular Garmin/Strava segments or is it more a random choice of roads/paths/trails?
3. I’ve noticed when creating routes on Garmin Connect, it doesn’t have all the trails (Hong Kong), but Strava does. Are the maps similar to those on Garmin Connect or are the TOPO maps different to this and have more details?
4. The review said you can select a direction you want the route to go, but can you select an elevation as well?
5. For people that have used this feature, do you really think it is worth it?
I like the tests and the results. I’m still using a 310XT and love it to bits (Even its glitchy connectivity and sometimes slow startups!!) Its a reliable machine and has served me well over the years running, cycling, swimming, surfing, windsurfing and snowboarding. Ihave fitted the quick release strap which means it mounts nice on the bike!!
So, my question is now I am thinking of upgrading do I go for a Fenix3HR at reduced price or shell out the extra on a 5? and if so which one?? I’m keen to get the better downloading via phone but think I will get that either way. I think i’d also use the Optical HR quite a lot but both do that too if you buy the right options. Arguably the Fenix3HR looks better bang for your buck with the 5 adding some functionality that I probably wont miss if i’ve not had before??
It’s several days that my Fenix 5 barometer shows only —-.-.
Is it that normal? If not, does anybody knows how I can I fix it? I have tried an altimeter calibration but that doesn’t change the barometer setting…
I wanted to buy one of these from Garmin’s website – but their website says it’s not available yet.
But people are obviously buying them; they’re advertised as available on Amazon and at REI (tho’ REI says they only have them at their New York store and at one store in Alaska – go figure).
Why would Amazon and REI have them, but not Garmin themselves?
Garmin.com orders for whatever reason have always been behind everyone else. In theory it’s to keep the playing field more even for retailers. It’s been this way for years.
I tried to order one from REI, but it immediately went to “Back Ordered”.
I called REI, and they told me that that was because they only had stock in their Alaska store, and since the device contains a battery, it has to be shipped ground. And they don’t ship ground from Alaska. So complex.
I’ll wait awhile until they are more generally available I guess.
Regarding the GPS signal strength: you can read out the GPS signal strength every second in a datafield. I did this and included it in my datafield (YARF) in two ways:
1. You can visualize the signal strength live during your workout by activating it in the YARF’s settings. By doing so, the signal strength is shown live as a ring similar to garmin’s initial GPS fix.
2. Independently of the setting above the GPS strength is written to the fit file and can be analyzed in Garmin Connect afterwards.
The read signal strength is one out of 5 values:
QUALITY_NOT_AVAILABLE = 0 -> the ring is gray
GPS is not available
QUALITY_LAST_KNOWN = 1 -> the ring is blue
The Location is based on the last known GPS fix.
QUALITY_POOR = 2 -> the ring is red
The Location was calculated with a poor GPS fix. Only a 2-D GPS fix is available, likely due to a limited number of tracked satellites.
QUALITY_USABLE = 3 -> the ring is yellow
The Location was calculated with a usable GPS fix. A 3-D GPS fix is available, with marginal HDOP (horizontal dilution of precision)
QUALITY_GOOD = 4 -> the ring is red
The Location was calculated with a good GPS fix. A 3-D GPS fix is available, with good-to-excellent HDOP.
Notes:
– I don’t own a Fenix 5, 5X nor a FR935. Therefore I need your feedback what is working and what not. You can help me to get one by spending me a beer or so (see the links in the app’s description)
– The contributing to the fit file is very buggy from garmin’s side. Please give me feedback whether the contributing was successful (successful is, if you can see a graph in your workout on Garmin’s Connect site.
– Furthermore I am interested in those graphs regarding GPS signal strength of a Fenix 5.
The app can be found here (it’s the link to the german’s website. I hope the english speaking guys are redirected to the proper website): link to apps.garmin.com
A question: can you purchase and install maps of EU countries from Garmin that will work on the US version of the Fenix 5X? I’m going to Italy and would like to use the GPS while there. I think I remember that in one of your earlier reviews, you were using the 5X while in Paris. Was that an EU version of the watch? Thanks for your thoughts.
Les Cutler
I haven’t done it myself, but from the research I’ve done on the F5x, I’m sure that will work just fine. On my F5x, using Garmin Connect, there is an option to download several different types of maps or to search for other maps that may not be shown at the moment. The Garmin 5 series is built for international use, not so much like the audio/video industry or cell phone industry that limits usage by international regions. I’m sure you’ll be good on that one.
Does the F5 alert you of coming turns when following a course? My 735xt did, but I tried following a loaded course yesterday and was only notified when I was on/off route.
If you click on each intersection/turn when you draw the course in Garmin Connect, then it will warn you ahead of each turn. The distance of each warning is dependent on speed – I find the F5 warns me earlier when descending fast then when climbing slowly.
Yes it does and it’s without flaws. I’ve been running using the built in navigation of F5 – it warns you 30-40meters before and at each turn. The navigation screen mimics what you’d get on dwatch (which I also have and loved its performance on my FR235 and Fenix 3, for 10bucks/year it’s a no brainer).
One very minor point – I prefer (by a very small margin) the visual appearance of the Fenix 5 with its navigation though – it’s clearer, arrows/numbers are bigger & easier to see without having to stop.
During a run I press, or press and hold, the middle left button. I can then change the settings for “run” but I can’t see how I could change to for example biking.
When you have Garmin TRI belt connected to F5 can you read HR from it on Garmin Edge 1000 at the same time? I prefer to have Edge 1000 on bike while racing triathlons (I would like it to display HR and power) – but I would like fenix to capture whole race (swim, bike – with power from p1, run with power from stryd)…
I really enjoyed your in-depth review of the Fenix 5 series. I’m in the market for a new multisport watch, primarily for triathlons, but also for a variety of activities, as well as regular daily activity tracking. My current watch is the Forerunner 910xt but I’m now leaning towards the Fenix 5x. Did you find the Fenix 5x to be a comperable triathlon/multisport watch to the Forerunner 920xt?
I do own the F5x and I think it’s a very subjective thing as to whether it would be too heavy and cumbersome for a triathlon or marathon type event. Even though I really like it for activities in the one hour range, personally I might be given to go with something like the 920 or 935 for a longer activity carrying that load on one wrist. If you can find a lighter snap on band like the titanium band, you could easier switch wrist during activities when the watch gets a little bothersome, which I’ve done a few times, especially if I’m wearing it 24/7 for any length of time.
Keep in mind that the F5X is the same size as the Fenix3, which up until January of this year was very much favored as a triathlon watch by many. So, as DLuna points out, it’s a size thing.
That said, for myself, I preferred the smaller size watches (i.e. FR735XT and now FR935). But again, totally a feel thing and nothing to do with technology or logic.
I Have just bought a Forerunner 935, been using the 910 xt since release, considered the 5 or 5x, in the end I went for something lighter, depends if you want maps, for the difference in price between the 935 and 5x you could buy a decent second hand gps with maps of the size you could use, could be wrong, but the price for the 5x well all of them is crazy. one thing that is disappointing with my 935 is the data fields, the size of the numbers coming from a 910 it’s too small, a big screen, but they have not done a great job with it, bigger display on the same size screen allowing bigger numbers, then it would of been a winner, the fenix 5 is pretty much the same I think.
For cycling; if I buy/use the Fenix 5 (considering purchase- I currently use and Edge 800) with a heart rate strap but no power meter (so no VO2 max estimate calculated), which of the training load metrics will work /not work.
I am particular interested in training load, status and recovery hours.
Can you use fenix 5 in triathlons without no problems? With TRI belt, Powertap P1 during bike leg and Stryd during run (IQ field)? Does it pick up those as at the start P1 is in depo probably saving energy and Stryd somewhere on the shoe saving energy too :)
Hello Ray – Have you heard anything from Garmin about the Stry connectivity issues with the F5? Do you think this is software or hardware related? Ant+ connectivity is definitely a problem.
I think the problem lies in the antenna range
I did a little experiment by putting Garmin on the lower leg. Great STRYD signal without dropouts.
I’m also experiencing problem with dropouts of P1 power pedals signal
Don’t know is it software solveable…
If it’s not i will be very disappointed
(the watch – Garmin 5 Sapphire)
Any updates from you Ray, or anyone else, on battery life of the 5X in use? Specifically in a long event such as ironman or ultra? I specifically want to know how far it goes with GPS on 1s sampling (I won’t be using wrist-based OHR because it is too unreliable for me, but I will use Scoshe Rhythm on my arm, which works great). It would be great if this would get all the way through a 50mi or 100km trail ultra under canopy for a slow runner (that would be me :) )..
This is really helpful to know. I (and some others on the Garmin forum) are experiencing running dynamics data dropouts with the Fenix 5 and HRM TRI and RUN.
I spent more than an hour with Garmin support yesterday but they denied having hardware issues and blamed the dropouts on me adjusting the heart rate monitor (which was not the case). Easily one of the worst support experiences I have had with any company.
Stryd has confirmed on the Garmin forums that the Fenix 5 has issues with all ANT+ sensors and I note that they no longer list the Fenix 5/5S as compatible devices on their website. Others have had problems even with Garmin’s own sensors (HRM TRI/RUN).
Do you know how widespread the problem is and whether Garmin will own up to it? I returned my Fenix 5 due to poor reception (thinking it was a faulty unit) and I am awaiting a new unit but I am concerned that I am just wasting my time. Garmin support had denied any issues when I contacted them.
I (and assume many others!) would appreciate your views on the matter.
Yup, Garmin is aware of it (they have been for a really long time).
That said, I wouldn’t necessarily assume either party is directly to blame. From talking to both parties it’s sort of a ‘takes two to tango’ type of thing. Both companies are basically optimizing their signal strength in order to save battery. Usually that works out – but in this case it’s causing the issues seen on the 5/5S, as that has a slightly different design there.
Both companies confirmed to me (in person and via e-mail) while at the Connect IQ Summit that they are working to find a solution. It remains unclear to me how much leverage or space either company has though to make that happen. Both companies could likely make small tweaks to signal strength, but again, to what detriment?
Add me to the list of customers experiencing major drop-out issues with the 5S and power meters. Has been driving me crazy, almost a relief to find this thread and see I am not alone.
In the household we own road and triathlon bikes, two Tacx Neo, two pairs of P1’s, Edge 520, Edge 820, three 920XT’s and the most recent acquisition, a Fenix 5S.
The 5S is hopelessly unreliable with the P1’s and sketchy with the Neo.
All other combinations of the P1’s, bike and head units work fine. This one is definitely on Garmin. They screwed up with the 5S. Absolutely love the watch otherwise, but if it can’t track my power numbers correctly it’s useless as a bike and triathlon watch.
Ray, really appreciate if you can keep us updated on any progress (or lack of it) on this issue.
I haven’t heard of anything new there unfortunately. :(
I know they were looking at ways to address it, but of course it’s a tricky balance with battery life. I didn’t use the 5S as much outdoors cycling (mostly 5/5X), though did most trainer rides with it (blend of Quarq, P1, and Neo), and didn’t see any issues on final hardware. Likely though elements of environmental/position that may help.
Please keep in mind, that it is not F5-Stryd Problem, but a general F5 Ant+ reception problem.
I experienced problems with Favero BePro power meter (however, seems to be quite ok in last few workouts, however I switched BePro to max transmit power)… Unfortunately, as Garmin does not beep anymore, when a sensor is disconnected, its difficult to identify on garmin connect, whether it is a dropout or just pause in pedaling.
Hi Ray, have you had news on this issue from Garmin? Garmin either denies the existence of the issue or promises a future software update (depending on support person) but after months the ANT+ reception is still unacceptably poor for a flagship product and we do not have any resolution in site. There is a very long thread in the Garmin Fenix 5/5S forum where owners have tested and confirmed the ANT issues (but unfortunately no solutions other than returning the units).
Nothing new. I had a chat with some 3rd party folks last night about the issue, but am circling back to Garmin today on it again.
Having chatted with the other folks I’m a bit more clear on the exact cause for it. Of course, it’s something I saw early on too (as noted in the review) with certain devices. In my case I can’t use Stryd with mine. And more recently I ran into an issue with the Power2Max NG.
It sucks.
There sounds like there’s some informed 3rd party thoughts on how to address it via firmware update, but whether those thoughts are technically viable (for a number of reasons) isn’t clear. If they made the suggested firmware change it could (likely would) impact aspects like battery. Else it would take a hardware change to resolve it.
Anyway, I’m getting clarify on that piece from Garmin and whether that suggestion is valid. If it’s not valid, I’d assume that’s the end of the road, short of a manufacturing change.
A quiet manufacturing/related change wouldn’t be out of the norm. It’s why folks getting replacement Fenix 3HR’s for the issue that surfaced last winter for some aren’t having issues (or, shouldn’t be anyway). They made some backend manufacturing tweaks that resolves that.
Count me in as another one with power meter dropouts. I’m using the Watteam POWERBEAT which works perfectly with the Edge 520 but is essentially useless with the Fenix 5. As with others, I wanted to use the Fenix 5 for the data collection to get access to all of the Firstbeat metrics and to have a single point of collection throughout the day.
These problems are documented by many owners at the Garmin forum here:
Garmin needs to get their act together on this – this is their flagship product and it’s pretty useless for serious athletes or anyone who runs in a city (GPS sensitivity really lousy too).
The signal strength of the 5 is abysmal.. Disconnects from my phone when my phone is less than a metre away (granted I may have my arm against my body.. But 30cm away?
Power drop outs from my Power Tap render the data rubbish. The average power is in the ball park but for intervals, the power is way off (segments in strava really highlighted this for me, I was doing repeats of a hill (only a one minute effort) power reading on one occasion was 213w for Fenix 5 and 420w for the 510.. That is a crazy difference..
The Fenix 5 gives you stats like Vo2 but if the data is is using to do these calculations is garbage, then the stats are garbage. The Fenix 5 is a fail for athletes who train with power on their bikes.
Hey Ray,
Just got my fenix 5s and am loving it. I was pleased to see that it would run Garmins sailing apps. Do you know if it syncs with the nema 2000 boat sensor data like the Quatrix watch line does?
Thanks for the thorough review! As always.
Question that I could not determine if it was answered in your review.
What are the actual differences in the size of the ‘digital’ face between 5s/5/5x?
It looks as if the bevel seems significantly larger on the 5x, accounting for much of the size difference, but the the digital face is not significantly different.
Thanks in advnace
Hi guys.
I am returning my Suunto SSWHR. Thus, I will be buying Garmin. I was thinking about Fenix 3 Sapphire HR, but there is a F5 now… Soooooo… Could you advice me on this?
I’m basically “happy” with features of F3HR, but I love that F5 (regular) is smaller in size. They are the same price (I’m talking about regular version, non-Sapphire). So, does F5 have all the functions of F3HR – except WiFi?
Also, in Suunto I sync my data via Bluetooth and I’m OK with speed. Does WiFi in Garmin is only for faster sync?
The F5 has everything the F3HR has except WiFi (depending on versions). WiFi does sync faster, but I think for most people the BT sync on the Fenix5 is fast enough that you don’t really notice it. It just happens quietly in the background in usually 20-40 seconds.
I figured the multisport on the fly-option out.:) Now I have another question: Does Activity class still matter or is the watch smart enough to know me without it?
By the way, I do love this watch. What could be of nterest for us over 40 with tired eyes is the screen. With the FR 735XT I didn’t see much of the data fields while on the run. Now I do.
I’ve done a minimal comparison of my new Fenix 5 (sapphire/wifi; f/w 2.90) versus my prior 920xt (f/w 9.20):
I had the 920xt connected to chest HRM to compare with Fenix5’s wrist OHR. As others have noted OHR was a little slow to “latch on” at the start of an exercise, but I don’t usually look at my HR in the first minute so..meh. OHR also as others have noted sometimes overshot a peek when the real HR is coming down where a chest HRM accurately measures that immediately.
I compares on an indoor bike spin and a short outdoor suburban run.
On the bike spin the speed/cadence cut out a few times. I had this happen alao early on in the 910xt and 920xt lifetimes, but didn’t later after firmware updates. I haven’t tried the newer Fenix 5 beta firmware. Production firmware update bricked my 910xt back in the day and I had to send it in for replacement, and I do software and have a specialization in device software update so….I’m generally conservative on taking beta firmware if I don’t have a board header and flashing tool to unbrick a device. I’m hoping to see the drop outs go away as some others have reported with the as-yet-to-be formally released Fenix 5 firmware.
On the run I wore both on my right arm. I’ve been very happy with the 920xt and wondered if the metal on the Fenix5 would be a detriment, but no appreciable difference between the two. Sometimes the 920xt tracked closer to where I truly was and sometimes the Fenix5 was. Both GPS tracks were accurate within my expectation. The OHR heart rate again was what’s to be expected versus a chest strap. I still like the chest strap for the run dynamics aspect, but for a simple run I’m quite happy to have HR without having to wear the chest strap.
One final note: the device does not know you’re in the water. So I spent two hours in the pool today without formally tracking my activity, and wanted to see what the OHR recorded during that time. It had a HR the entire time and based on a few quick manual pulse counts, was reasonably accurate. It would be nice if Garmin let you turn on the OHR during a pool or open water swim.
Great Review!!! I have a fenix 3 and use it for kitesurfing following a course created on the watch from waypoint to waypoint, the thing is that whenever it marks i’m of course which is very often the field “distance to next waypoint” stops marking the distance to that next wypt instead of adding more distance to it or decreasing it which is a real downside. I tried the same on a 5s and it does the exact same thing. Before buying one, I was wondering if on a 5X it would do the same, or if it actually would mark the distance to the next wypt on the course even if at times i’m of it. Thanks a lot for your answer because that would be the only reason for me to buy a new watch and put out that kind of money.
Do you know how to do something similar for the 5x? BTW, ideally, I would like to “add” vs. replace. But if you have to replace, what files should be backed up?
If anybody is interested…. I finally figured it out. It is super simple. You just add the files to the Garmin directory with any filename and the watch picks them up. This way you can add as many countries or regions as you want/can. I downloaded the UAE from link to garmin.openstreetmap.nl named it uae22042017.img (as 22-Apr-2017) is the version of the file and voila! Worked like a charm. Will be adding others.
Adrian: thanks for that comment… I’m also in the Emirates, and had used Rays instructions for loading up maps on my Edge 1000… didn’t want to splash out for the Fenix 5x while unsure if it could be similarly loaded. Glad to see your confirmation! John
I know that you wrote: “There’s virtually no risk of these popping off in an open water swim or the like, because the lever is below the band against your wrist.”, but I still wonder, how does it work in practice? You made a great test video of how the charging cable fits the watch. What about a “stress test” of the quick fit band in a triathlon-like openwater start, with other people kicking or pulling your wrist? :) Is the QuickFit comparably secure to e.g. 920XT without QR?
Yeah, the thing is the lock simply isn’t accessible. The only way it could fail is if someone actually snapped the wrist strap itself – which is pretty much the same case as any watch.
That said, I’ve got a little baby that loves trying to pull/remove/eat the watch while on my wrist – and thus far she hasn’t succeeded in removing it. ;)
Hi Folks,
I often do hiking or back-country skiing where I explore unknown terrain. Currently I use my phone and different apps where I preload the local map and also the route and just follow it on the fly. This is not always easy, especially when conditions get worse as well as its simply bothering me to take the mobile phone out of the pocket every time I am not sure about my position. I am interesting only on loading (preferably open street) map for a specific area, zoom the map to a high detail and also import my own gpx/tcx and follow it. I am neither interested on poi-s nor rerouting. Would I be able to do this on Fenix 5 or any other Garmin watch as I can simply do it on my Edge 520 (link to dcrainmaker.com) ?
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Has anyone had any issues with the quickfit bands yet?
I’m leaning towards using a Nato as I don’t want to trust my £630 watch to a clip but then obviously I would lose the OHR but I would rather keep my watch than have OHR.
Thanks.
Have you run any tests or tried out strength training with the fenix 5?
Hi all…
If I wear my F5 while at the gym doing strength training but didn’t tell the watch thi was an activity (that is, I didn’t start it with the start button) I see the F5 reports the “active calories.” If I then go and manually enter the activity on Garmin Connect and specify the time I did it, will this all be smart enough to know it was the same time? Or will it double couth the calories?
Ray,
What are the chances, if any, that Garmin incorporates a way for the Fenix 5 to connect to their new Inreach devices. What I mean is, if you are using both on a long hike or in a remote place, it would be a perfect solution to have the two devices linked via BT and you could get notifications on your watch without pulling out the Inreach. It would be great to send back a list of quick replies that you already have setup too
Concur. That would be great. And to take it one step further, be able to reply via voice through the watch. But that will be the Fenix 10, maybe.
Ideally yes but obviously the Fenix 5 doesn’t have a mic. I was just speaking in terms of all the current hardware, most of it can be done already.
I think we might see that down the road, but the feeling I got was that right now the inReach stuff is more in the ‘let’s get the tech integration from the acquisition sorted’ realm, rather than the innovating on new stuff realm. If that makes sense.
My Fenix 3 HR charges very very long from 20 % to 100 % (> 3h). How’s about the Fenix 5?
No, under an hour. I think I did one yesterday from 10% to 50% in maybe 20-25mins? Basically, whatever time it took me to make lunch.
How did you do this whole review without doing side views to compare thickness/show them on wrists?
Because I included side views in the comparison section?
And there’s approximately 100 other photos on my wrist, plus about 30 minutes of video footage, most of it on my wrist? Heck, the swimming video’s thumbnail pic is literally a side(wrist)* shot.
Side(Wrist): The sideboob of GPS watches.
Hi Ray,
Great review. Any idea if you can turn off the navigation alerts on the 5? So just follow the breadcrumb line in peace, without being constantly told to turn right/left?
Thank you!
Tell me about it. This watch software miles behind the Fenix3. I could drag a track onto my Fenix 3 directly in Basecamp. This poor software isn’t compatible with basecamp routes or tracks. Pathetic. You have to export out of basecampimport into Garmin Connect, send to watch as a route and withstand a million turn by turn alerts. Please Garmin just make this watch work for hikers looking for at least as many features as the Fenix 3. Instead they make a million products that just look different but don’t actually differentiate.
Just learned from Garmin forums that my issue with Basecamp seems to be limited to the Mac version. Also learned a workaround: put the .gpx file in the NewFiles folder directly on the watch. So yippee – back to using Basecamp as my track/route source! Now to figure out the turn by turn alert on/off toggle…..
Isn’t this method in use for many years already? Since .fit is there?
Great review as always Ray.
I’m getting old – visual/audio poor! I have the 920XT and have trouble with feeling vibrating splits. When racing the little man – don’t know if I’m behind or ahead – can’t see that small. So is the graphics / wordage any bigger and is there a difference in size throughout the range.
I’d splash the cash if I can see the bloody thing!
Thanks Ray
Simple question and disappointingly no reply. I’m either too old, too thick, just not in the gang or a combo of all. So I’ve gone ahead and bought one (with me pension!) and it’s all your fault if I can’t see the bloody thing! Have a great day :)
You’re taking a risky gamble! Fenixes are watches so small screen. And previous models didn’t score well. (the black screen one!!!) You can always return can you?
I run with an Edge on my lower arm. One screen has just 2 data fields. BIG!!! I don’t give a shit about what’s normal……
While the text can get big within the Fenix 5 in certain displays, in general it’s going to look bigger on the FR920XT.
A fellow presbyope! The transflective colour display is pretty low contrast and I struggle to see it unless in bright sunlight or in the dark with the backlight on.
I have just bought a Polar M430 which has a much higher contrast monochrome display than my Fenix 3 HR and is a lot easier for me to see. No swim metrics as yet (though the wrist HR works well in the pool!). If they add the latter in a software update I can ditch the Fenix completely. I would then use the M430 for sports and my Suunto Ambit 3 Peak for hiking / navigation at which it excels.
I have written an app, field and widget for the long sighted on the Garmin Connect IQ site. Search under Presby! My virtual partner field is much more fun and very visible.
Ray, thanks for advice on using Bluetooth for Stages connection it wasn’t perfect there was a lot of drop out in the first ten minutes of ride but after that seemed to hold on consistently so I remain hopeful will be testing again in an hour.
I have a bug for you.. I thought I was going nuts, I keep switching off key vibes then I come to realise that at some point it has switched itself back on again. I can’t imagine this is a “quirk”.
Thanks again.
Oof!!!! That’s a familiar phenomenon for Fenix owners………
mine was doing the same. Change/check the settings on the connect desktop page
Hi! Does it have a built-in thermometer and storm alarm?
Yes, it does, both. Just note that built-in temperature sensor is affected by your body heat when you are wearing it. You can connect Tempe, anyway (although I always keep misplacing the damn thing).
It may be somewhat early to say, but after a week of use, I am very satisfied with the F5. I have no problems wearing it day and night, and it has a great set of features and flexibility. GPS accuracy is good for me – yes it does wander off a bit more than desired time to time, especially when hiking/mountaineering, but for now it is always perfectly acceptable. Of course, others may have different (realistic or unrealistic) definitions of “acceptable accuracy”.
One feature I would like to see is the ability to change sports during a current activity without creating a pre-defined multisport activity. I think some FR series watches can do this, and it is certainly available in Suunto Ambit series. Sometimes I go out hiking, see a lake and do a bit of swimming, come across a trim trail and do some strength training, then hiking again, etc. As a kind of an outdoor and adventurer watch, it would be really nice to have this.
About changing sport on the fly:
link to forums.garmin.com
Is this what you mean?
Wow, brilliant, exactly what I was looking for. Thanks, Adrian!
Ray had mentioned this capability in the article stating, “Also, you can just make-up a multisport mode on the fly by simply holding down the middle left button and changing the sport to something else.” But that is a little different than what the method described in the Garmin forum post about creating a hot key, unless the middle left button is now a hot key and has been defaulted to switch activities.
Rays said his method didn’t allow you to records laps within an individual activity (the lap button still only functions to switch activities, not record laps within activities). If the hot key method still allows you to record laps that is what I’d be looking for. Not only because it could let you capture laps (ie, turn-around on an out-and-back run leg of a triathlon) but also to prevent accidental presses of the lap button from irreversibly screwing up your multisport activity record (ie, an accidental press starting T2 when you are still in the middle of your bike leg).
It is probably just me, but I don’t see how to change sports using the middle button during an activity, for example to change from Climb to Swim. Still, the shortcut approach works perfectly.
I did a quick test, and the lap button does allow to record laps within an individual activity if you use the shortcut to change sports.
Just a side note, the F5 works fine on the right wrist with a Stages Powermeter (loaded with latest firmware)…
No drops, recorded identical power readings as my Edge!
Finally!
Hi Ray,
found out what was causing the issue – I have a wireless access point in my pain cave – a post on the Garmin forums mentioned this can interfere with ANT+ signals.
I was a little sceptical – but when I powered down the access point my 5X connected to the Kickr power immediately. Note that the 5X has no issues connecting to the Kickr Speed relay – just the Kickr Power. My F3 has no issues automatically connecting to either with the access point on or off. Weird.
Can anyone tell me what the battery life of the Fenix 5S is like compared with the Forerunner 630 in GPS only mode? Assuming the 630 is paired with a HR strap and optical HR is on for the 5S. I sometimes do bike rides that last up to 12 hours.
Bike rides with a wrist device? You don’t need to see anything ‘real time’?? 12 hrs sounds like touring…… no need for a map?
Hi there. I just got my 5x and was very excited about downloading some trail runs into maps. I tried it once and the watch totally froze up after I started the download from Garmin Connect. Had to do a hard reboot and try again…..same thing happened! Has anyone else had a similar problem trying to transfer a course from Garmin Connect to the watch?
Yes, same thing, If you load an old course or an old workout, it makes the fenix,5 crash!
For now you have to create new ones…
Hi Ray,
I’m amazed with how much effort you’ve put to prepare this exceptional review. Well done, sir!
I have one question that bugs me.
I’ve seen that you were testing the Fenix 5 HR sensor in various conditions. Have you seen the Fenix 5 HR sensor working really bad in the cold while running? Any cases of locking on cadence or showing really bad figures? 3 months in the year I run when it’s really cold (below freezing), so this part is rally crucial to me.
I’ve checked the data sets you published but in case you didn’t have multiple devices you would not post the results.
Thanks for your reply.
Is it possible to have different units in different profiles?
Example: I track my runs in miles, but i do my workouts in m/km. Right now (920) there is no easy way to toggle, other that going into the system settings and setting it globally each time I want to change. What would be ideal is if this was a per-profile (app? activity type?) setting, so that the Run app would be imperial and then I could create a custom Workout on that was metric.
I sold my beloved Fenix3 and my Fenix5 arrives later today. In the meantime I’ve been using my 10 year old Forerunner 305. I’ve been looking at the tracks and am reminded at how good the GPS is on this unit. Better than my Fenix3 and probably better than the Fenix5 (time will
tell). Of course the Fenix5 does so much more and is beautiful as a standalone watch, but for GPS accuracy the Forerunner 305 is hard to beat.
With the exception of how easy it was to fry one of those units in rain, still my favorite of all the Garmins for running.
Nice review, Ray!
Regarding the GPS accuracy, there are actually huge amount of data that could be used to dramatically reduce the statistical error. In fact, Strava (as other companies in this business) records the device name for every activity (see link to strava.github.io). Already now, there should be sufficient data to allow a very good estimation of the Fenix 5 accuracy. As soon as very popular events happens, tons of very comparable data are suddenly available (i.e. at the same location and with identical boundary conditions).
For sure, if such an “analysis tool” does not exist, it’s not because of lack of interest!
For some (obvious?) reasons, those companies are reluctant to release such “sensitive” information.
(If only their database would be fully accessible…)
P.S. However, a very “low level” visual analysis can be made by taking any race on Strava and by looking at the “flybys”. It gives already a good hint about the different device accuracies.
While you could find outliers in GPS accuracy (i.e. someone a mile over in a marathon), this older post of mine explains why it wouldn’t be of much use to use crowd-sourced data to determine GPS accuracy: link to dcrainmaker.com
Thanks Ray, it’s a very interesting post!
If someone wants to exclude races from the statistics, Strava Segments offers enough data to say a lot about GPS accuracy of different devices. I don’t expect any correlation between the use of a specific device model and the boundary conditions (like environment, weather, satellite position…), so the sum over all user data can be used without bias.
Moreover, the accuracy I was talking about it’s not the one you can naturally observe in the real effective paths followed by runners participating in a race. If the tracks remains within the street boundaries, I don’t think that anybody would complain about GPS accuracy. Take for example the most popular race in my hometown:
link to strava.com
It has the particularity of entering different environments, like the narrow streets of the old town, as well as forest and open spaces. Practically all recorded tracks show systematically lower accuracy within the old town or the forest, with paths jumping far beyond the street boundaries (especially in the old town). However, results differ a lot from device to device. Just zoom within the old town or the forest to see what I mean:
link to labs.strava.com
Key Performance Indicators as the accuracy, trueness, precision, as well as their “standard deviation”, could be extracted from data according to the different devices.
I’ve read Ray’s post about “Racing the Line” awhile ago and have referred other people to is when they’ve commented about their GPS results at a given race. I agree with the analysis…when applied to an individual athlete at a race. However, the Law of Large Numbers (link to en.wikipedia.org) suggests that if you had access to a large enough data set, you could in fact create a conclusion on relative accuracy of devices. Unless you assume systemic differences between users of different devices (all Polar users take the outside of turns and all Garmin users take the inside of the turn, or all Suunto users start their watches late), then the resulting averages between devices can be compared. Perhaps not directly compared to the official race distance for the reasons Ray outlines in his article, but certainly to each other. If one particular model’s average distance was significantly different from the other devices, it would suggest a tendency for poor accuracy for that model.
But again, it’s called the Law of LARGE Numbers for a reason…you’d need a sufficiently large number of devices in your pool of data. So individual anecdotes of poor accuracy carry little weight in my book.
Thanks Joe, that’s exactly what I meant.
There is no reason to assume a correlation between racer’s behavior and device. On the other hand, there are segments on Strava with more than 300’000 attempts! (As for example link to strava.com). There is enough statistics there to extract extremely significant results regarding device accuracy.
Moreover, once a good algorithm has been developed, nothing prevents a broad application over all segments (non-overlapping and featuring a minimal amount of attempts). We are already in the domain of Big Data and results would be extremely reliable…
(Maybe Strava already offer this information as advice to device producer under non-disclosure agreement. Who knows…)
I started reading and didn’t notice at first how ‘in depth’ the review was. Wow, what a long review! I did save it to my favorites because I need more time to read an view all of it ;)
Thanks for the review – I really appreciate this kind of in-depth testing!
My question: Do you think there is any chance that the bolder data field font of the 5 could be implemented on the Fenix 3 HR?
Thanks Michael
I assume you’re talking about readability Michael. I had the same problem with my F3. Reading some of the small data fields, especially without glasses and/or in movement. I tested every watchface app available for the F3 that had the information I wanted in non-workout mode with larger fonts: HR, time, date, altitude and battery life were the most important to me on a daily basis. The best I found for the F3 was the “Optimus HR” watchface followed by the “HRwatch” and “NoFrills”. These all have some degree of customization available to them, including font options.
Watchfaces are not my problem – the data fields when running have, in my opinion, a font which is too thin to read while moving. The font of the Fenix 5 seems to be much bolder. There is a data field with bold font for the 3HR but you can’t customize it.
But thanks for the watchface tipps, I will try them!
I have found that the Fenix 5x HR during a run seems to run much higher then using a strap. The first few runs all were averaging at least 10-20HBPM higher then I would have expected for that pace. I tested it adjacent to a F25 with a running HR strap. While the average was close, the peaks were way off. Have you seen this at all during your runs?
Just to clarify – did you wear the FR25 on the same wrist as the Fenix 5, or on the other wrist?
If the same wrist, that can actually definitely lead to problems as noted. If different wrist, then that’s more of a wrist placement type thing to start troubleshooting. :-/
The Fenix was on the left and the F25 was on the right. The Garmin Runner strap was across the chest. I have used the Scosche RHYTHM+ with similar results as the chest, thus my concern on the wrist HR from the Fenix showing higher then expected HR.
I see the pace is way smoother with the FR25 as well… Same as in my experience with the F5 so far, more jaggy and way less smooth.
I have the same results like Michael. Compared thru Running activity Garmin Vivoactive HR (on left wrist) with Fenix 5x (on right wrist). Fenix 5x is always 10-20 HBPM higher. I suppose, that the high weight of Fenix 5x is the reason. It is bouncing even tight bounded.
Thanks for the good and detailed review! Was first thinking about a 5x, but with the limited maps functionality and the bigger size (and price) I switched to a 5. So I just ordered the 5 and 5s (for the girl) from clevertraining.co.uk with the DCR codes.
What do you mean with “limited maps functionality”???
I don’t see myself preparing all routes at home. So for the mapping I will just use Google Maps on my phone. I was hoping for the Google Maps functionality like on Android Wear, but it seems limited for searching addresses and planning routes.
“Which ultimately gets to my final point here: The 5X is very cool, and generally quite responsive. And if you’ve done enough planning it works out really well. Or, if you’re just in an area where the mapping quality is good. But if you’re not, then you’ve paid an extra pile of money for something that a $1 phone app tends to do a lot better.”
Anyone know if you can read notifications in non-English alphabets on these models? Specifically, I’m interested in being able to read messages in Hebrew.
Also if that will ever be possible with a firmware update on the Fenix3 HR?
My understanding is the F5 series has added 2 languages: Arabic and Hebrew.
Any idea if the Fenix 3 HR will be updated with this functionality?
” Each time your hand goes under the water, it loses GPS signal.”
That’s a show stopper for me, until they make a small GPS pod to go in your swim cap to relay with the watch. They should even have a swim cap with a pocket for the pod in the bundle !
Given that I just pulled the plug on the fenix 5 (silver/blue), it seems only fitting that Garmin immediately releases the 935.
link to buy.garmin.com
Looking forward to a detailed comparison. At first glance, the weight reduction seems impressive.
link to dcrainmaker.com
“So what’s the FR935 all about? Well in a nutshell it’s a cheaper version of the Fenix 5, with a plastic shell as opposed to metal. Basically – it could be named the Fenix 5P – for Plastic. “
Does anyone know if the Fenix 5X will have a better antenna than the regular Fenix 5 because this would solve my issue of it not playing well with the Stages.
The reason I even ask is because the Fenix 3 had no issues before it so I wonder if the increased size of the 5X means there is room for a better antenna (or whatever the bit is that receives the signal), just a thought.
Thanks Ray and everyone helping with my queries.
Can I use a USB wall adapter to charge the Fenix 5 too? Just want to make sure so I don’t overload it. I have Anker adapters.
Hi Ray,
Thank you for the review.
Based on your experience, do you think there might be a risk that the 5X suffers the same fate as the Epix? Namely, not receiving regular firmware updates/support in the event that it proves to be less popular than the 5/5S?
Or is that risk limited by the fact that all three models might share a common firmware “core”?
Thank you!
Anyone notice the fēnix® Chronos is now a fēnix 5s
link to developer.garmin.com
(I know Ray mentioned the update to chronos, but thought I’d mention that in terms of software its a fenix 5s)
Hi! Do u know what’s happened with battery life in UltraTrack mode, today just after they realised 935, they slide battery life in specification tab (garmin website) for fenix 5 from 75 to 60 hours and 5X from 50 to 35?
from manual:
Up to 12 days
Smartwatch mode with activity tracking and 24/7 wrist- based heart rate monitoring
Up to 20 hours
GPS mode with wrist-based heart rate
Up to 50 hours
UltraTrac GPS mode with gyro-based dead reckoning
From web page (Garmin.com)
Smart mode: Up to 12 days
GPS/HR mode: Up to 20 hours
UltraTrac™ mode: Up to 35 hours without wrist heart rate
I bought one of the newer HRM tri, HR bands for use with my soon arriving F5x. I planned to use it at times, primarily for the advanced running dynamics. These you do not seem to be able to get with just the optical HRM on the F5/F5s/F5x. I saw email from CT today, and it talked about a Garmin running dynamic foot pod, something I’ve not heard about (at all)> Seems like this might be exactly something I would want. it would provide the running dynamics, but the OHRM would still be in use. Is there a different use case for this pod? I search for a review here, but didnt notice one. Is it that new?
Ok. found my own answer. I must have posted this while the 935 and POD videos were being uploaded. This pod does seem to do exactly what I want. For those interested. Here is Rays’ video on the pod.
link to youtube.com
I hear you on the usefulness/validity of the advanced running data. That said, with the CT VIP discount, I have $69 sitting in the account. so maybe I’ll just apply that, and get myself an essentially free pod.
Here’s also the full review on the RD pod as well – just posted: link to dcrainmaker.com
Hi Dcrainmaker,
First of all many thanks for the review. Thanks to you and went ahead and bought my first Garmin watch, the Fenix 5.
However, I took it out for a run today and the GPS. It made me run through a lake and through buildings. I have GPS and Glonasss activated.
I ran a 1km under a minute for example.
I’m posting a pic below.
Any help or guidance would be appreciated. I hope it’s not a faulty GPS unit.
Thanks!
For thos interested it looks like the 5s and the 5 have just as much ram available for connect iq and the 5X has way more ram to work with. With the 5x having as much or more in the case of a watch-app as the Edge 1000/820.
1000id="watch-app" memory_limit="1048576"
id="widget" memory_limit="1048576"
id="datafield" memory_limit="131072"
820
id="watch-app" memory_limit="1048576"
id="widget" memory_limit="1048576"
id="datafield" memory_limit="131072"
520
id="watch-app" memory_limit="262144"
id="widget" memory_limit="262144"
id="datafield" memory_limit="32768"
5s
id="watchface" memory_limit="65536"
id="watch-app" memory_limit="131072"
id="widget" memory_limit="65536"
id="datafield" memory_limit="32768"
5
id="watchface" memory_limit="65536"
id="watch-app" memory_limit="131072"
id="widget" memory_limit="65536"
id="datafield" memory_limit="32768"
5X
id="watchface" memory_limit="98304" prg_limit="1048576"
id="watch-app" memory_limit="1310720"
id="widget" memory_limit="1048576"
id="datafield" memory_limit="131072"
Thanks for the info. Eli. I assume that means many more options and versatility with the different app software applications. Would that apply as well to the firmware update potential and abilities, especially for the 5x?
The fr935:
Fr935
id=”watchface” memory_limit=”98304″ />
id=”watch-app” memory_limit=”131072″ />
id=”widget” memory_limit=”65536″ />
id=”datafield” memory_limit=”32768″ />
Very strange that it is the same as the 5x for the watch face and the 5/5s for everything else
All it directly tells us is the limits connect iq apps are under. The much higher limits of the 5x tells us that the 5x can probably handle more powerful apps.
Think of a data field that works great on an edge 820/1000. May not be able to be ported to the 5/5s but may run fine on the 5x
Hi there, does the Fenix 5 monitor HiiT, boot camp, weights and circuit classes ok? I currently have a Fitbit charge 2 but would like to upgrade to this but want to ensure my class workouts are still monitored over and above just HR monitoring.
Thanks
Thanks for the great review as always! I have been eagerly waiting for it to decide between the F5 and SSU. If you take OHR out of the equation, and you look at the current state of updates for the Spartan Ultra, is it a close call at all between the F5 and the Spartan Ultra, or is the F5 ahead by a sizeable margin? Note that for my personal needs (trail running, backpacking, etc) battery life and accuracy are more important for me than an exhaustive feature set. Thanks in advance for any thoughts!
Great review as always! I am curious if you happened to run tests on altimeter accuracy for the F5 vs F3 vs Suunto Ambit vs Spartan? In my experience, there is a pretty wide range in accuracy difference, especially when you start to use “fused alti” (and Garmin’s equivalent) vs manually setting reference, etc. Altitude accuracy is a critical need for my pursuits (mountaineering etc) and is in many cases more critical than GPS accuracy. Thanks in advance for your thoughts!
I’d been keen to know this too.
I do a lot of “Stair Climbs \ hill climbs”
Run up a flight of stairs.
Walk down, and the re-calibrate, repeat for 12 sets.
I;d say 50% of the time it has the correct altitude when at the bottom of the stairs / hills on the F3.
The Ambit handled it a lot better.
Hi guys.
I have a F5 and so far so good.
Problem is I don’t seem to have the built in Trail Run App.
Any ideas.
Thanks in advance.
Hi. Great review. Thanks. I like the idea of
Training Status/Load/effect metrics: split of aerobic and anaerobic training effect. Do you think we will see it in fenix 3 firmware update or is it hardware dependent and won’t be possible on fenix 3?
Hi Ray – has the bezel on the F5 Grey been improved since the F3, with regards to scratches and durability?
Ray,
did you manage to use Polar H7 with fenix 5 ?
It seems that polar can be paired with fenix 5 but no HR data is transmitted to the fenix 5.
Regards
Can anybody tell me if it is possible in The Face-It watch face app to take photos from computer, not just from mobile device?
Thanks!
Don’t know if it is possible but FaceIt for Fenix5 is limited to 16colors like Fenix3 (at the moment?)
Results are very worse than for Fenix Chronos which uses 64colors !
Don’t know if it is a bug or a limitation of Fenix5.
Trying to decide between the 5 Sapphire in Black/Black or the 5X in Slate/Black. Both $699, but the 5X gets me the maps.
How dark is the slate grey? In some pictures it appears almost black.
Also, I’ve handled the Fenix3 HR but thought it was a bit fat, does the slimness of the 5X make a noticeable difference?
Ok I have tried like 5 different sites between, Garmin Connect, Suunto, Strava, Ridewithgps, Gaia GPS, and the basecamp app but nothing will import a GPX route with the waypoints and the elevation point. This is ridiculous. For a navigational company and a navigational watch, there is no reason why it should be this difficult. Suunto movescount site is so easy, you make a route with waypoints and sync. If I wasn’t inlove with the hardware and map feature on the 5x I would move back. I am very technically inclined, I cant image a non tech person to figure this out.
Yeah, the whole creation of waypoints continues to be a mess (I talk about the lack of mobile routes option a fair bit, but this is in the same camp).
Though, on the flipside, I suspect most people that have GPX routes with waypoints and associated elevation data are probably fairly technically inclined.
Hello, does anyone have recommendation on how to perform those tasks the most efficient way possible?
Hi!
Got my Fenix 5sapphire today and one of the coolest features was that I could turn on backgroundlight based on motion. this is same feature the Fitbit has.
If I move my hand in a certain pattern, (like you do when you want to check out what time it is) the backlight turn on automatically
This worked great on Fw 2.00, but I updated to fw 2.4 and now the feature do not work anymore
I tried to toggle the setting on/off but no luck
Do anyone else got this to work on fw 2.4 ? Can I downgrade back to 2.0?
No bug. It was a user error. “Do not disturb” was activated.
So lap while paused works again now?
Hello Ray,
Thanks for the review, I enjoyed reading your review of the latest offering in the fenix series. I am using fenix 3 with Heart Rate Monitor. i use my fenix3 for CrossFit, Golf and occasional running. After reading the review, i am planning to upgrade but have few queries –
1. Does fenix5 let you create profiles for CrossFit?
2. Do you need to buy Garmin’s TruSwing Golf Sensor to record various golf swing metrics or does it work without the sensor?
3. Where can I get more detailed reviews related to Golf app on Fenix 5?
Thanks,
CP
Great review.
Can someone confirm that the Fenix 5 can do the following:
Broadcast HR to an older edge 510 via Ant+ while at the same time still receive email and text notifications from my iPhone via Bluetooth?
In all past Garmin HR units, if you are broadcasting HR, all other functions are typically shut off. Like on on Vivo HR, Fenix 3hr, etc.
Thank you for excellent review!
Small letters on the map (on display of Fenix 5x). Do not read. How to make it big?
Thanks
Nice review! Thank you!
Small letters on the map (on display of Fenix 5x). Do not read. How to make it big?
Thanks
Ray good evening,
desperately need your help as I’ve been trying for hours
I bought through your site on CT the 5X
Came with the US maps, but I’d like to add also the EU map
bought EU Cycle map, and installed it through Garmin Express
It doesn’t show on the watch, and says there are no routes where I am now i.e. Europe.
I wanna keep US because I often go there, but how to get the proper EU map is a mystery to me
thanks for your help,
Oh, well, can’t install additional Garmin maps on the 5x, and alternative methods with openstreetmaps not practical with website closed at times, like for ex this weekend…
Back to clevertraining the watch goes!
Not sure how to install them (but I can guess), or how to verify if they are all there. But when I was in Garmin express, and I saw some links about maps, it appears to me that all the maps, US, EUR, etc etc were shown as already installed. I may have miinterpreted the info, but it it led me to believe my watch came with all the maps installed. I could check if someone tells me how.
Yeah, the OSM site being ‘down’ this weekend was odd, and honestly pretty darn unusual. Sometimes it’ll be delayed a few hours in a queue, but I’ve never seen it say like it did this weekend that it’s simply offline till Monday. I suppose that’s a good reason to donate a few bucks to their site!
(It actually impacted me as well, as I needed to grab the France maps for my Edge 820, after having put Australia maps on it for back in January).
Hi Ray,
Thanks for the – as always – very thorough review.
Due to a misunderstanding with the Stryd webshop I got a US version of the 5X so, because I live in EU, I have no maps.
I suppose it will be best if I either return the watch or download maps from the OSM site?
When downloading, should I choose “generic routable” or “bicycle routable” when I mostly use the watch for running?
And another thing: on the watch there are 3 different gmapsup.img files, a gmapcycle.img (2,15 GB) and a CustomMaps folder. Where does the OpenStreet map go, please?
Thanks very much in advance.
I’d personally do bicycle, but I want to see if there are any tangible differences between the two in a hiking case.
Over the next few weeks in California it’s on my to-do list to write up a 5X-specific guide (or guide section for that other post). It’s a bit easier to do here since there’s tons of great trails right out my door…versus having to wander somewhere else.
I think I’d try both. The reason to worry about the cycling maps is that a lot of places forbid mountain bikes on certain trails. Where I live it’s rare, but there are a few trails (including the cross-Pennsylvania Mid State Trail) where mountain bikes are forbidden. So I’d worry that the cycling maps wouldn’t have these trails on them, and there’s no reason for a runner to be excluded.
What maps are loaded on the 5X originally? In the US there is the cycle maps:
link to buy.garmin.com
Which are open street maps which could limit that maps to just cycling accessible areas (Though if it is just OSM why do they charge $50). The only other maps Garmin supplies are the topo and trailhead maps but not sure what comes on the watch as the web site doesn’t say.
For downloading your own maps, are you using link to garmin.openstreetmap.nl
? Seems like the features on the maps are the same (so no cutting out trails, roads, and the like) but just changes routing priority and the way they display (the TYP file). So I’d go with bike routable.
link to wiki.openstreetmap.org
But if you just want europe maybe go with the non-lite version here: link to openfietsmap.nl
If you want to understand how TYP files can gretaly change a map even if all the data is the same:
link to avdweb.nl
BTW Ray, when you do your extended look at the 5X can you do a simple compare with the HR from it. Thinking while the hardware is the same, a higher weight watch would move more and so be worse for getting a good HR. Is that true?
I just checked with Garmin customer support to confirm that the Sapphire 5 with the black silicone band comes with a extra YELLOW band. They confirmed the additional band but said it was BLACK (so apparently you get two black bands).
The review above says you get a YELLOW band which is far more desirable.
Is Garmin customer support mistaken? Has anyone ordered this variant?
I have the black Fenix 5 sapphire. It came with one black band (installed) and one yellow band. Surprisingly (to me) I wear the yellow one a lot.
Thanks. Not surprised Ray got it right and the folks at Clever Training and Garmin Customer Support did not!
DC Rainmaker thank you for the review!!!
Ray, excellent CT experience, just placed my F5X order and it’ll be shipping out Monday!
My understanding is that an HRM strap is only required to obtain Lactate threshold and Stress Level Tests, and for everything else, Firstbeat-related metrics, the optical HR is just as good as using the HR strap in terms of Running. Is this correct? Did you see any differences between HR strap results vs using OHR for the latest set of Fistbeat running metrics? As a runner, I’m hoping to skip wearing the HRM strap, but not at the expense of sub-optimal / inconsistent Fistbeat analytics/results. Any comments? Cheers.
Hi Ray,
Is this possible Fenix3 can support “Training Load and Stress metrics” or ” aerobic and anaerobic training effect” by firmware update?
Garmin is smart, every time release new product, It must has some new fashion function.
Thanks!
No, no plans to add that in unfortunately.
Hi Ray,
Is it possible that you post a Monitor-FIT-file from a Fenix 5 for download? Before buying a Fenix 5, I would like to check if my current software can process F5 monitor files. I have been able to validate F5 Activity-FIT files, but not yet monitor files, so I’d really appreciate it.
Finally got a f5 and am already really disappointed.
Stryd ConnectIQ datafield drops out a lot making the data useless and we have already started the massive Beta game that happened with the fenix 3, including updates to the GPS software.
I have had my 735XT for almost a year and have never had to load a Beta, Stryd ConnectIQ datafield almost never drops out and GPS tracking has been good without any updates from day 1.
As an initial user feedback I would not buy the fenix 5 if you are a serious athlete and the data is important to you. If you are a casual athlete and want a good looking watch, then it is probably OK.
Will be testing GPS today against 735XT with newest released Beta for f5 and if GPS performance is subpar compared to 735, mine is going back int eh box and back to CT.
Hi Joe E,
I’m also very disappointed with the F5. I’m a first time Garmin user but the GPS is giving me a hard time.
I have got a replacement for the watch but the the same issues. I run in an area where there are high rise buildings which glass/mirrors.
I downloaded the beta and tested it again against my iphone 6. Overall did three walks. The differents is between 300 meters to almost one KM for a 3 km run. That’s off by 10 to 30%. Once the watch loses GPS lock, it just goes crazy. It takes me literally everywhere.
I’m not happy at all
OK, tested with Beta from today and distance accrual was off by 6% and had multiple GPS dropouts over the course of a 5 mile run that I have run 100s of times with many watches. Even the fenix 3 was not this bad in the beginning. In addition Stryd ConnectIQ data continues to have multiple dropouts and I had with connection with my P1 pedals.
As a training tool this watch is not reliable. Back it goes to Clever Training.
Good luck to everyone else.
Same issues here: serious drop-outs from my Powertap P1 pedals and the Stryd. The minute I grab something from my jersey pocket, for example, the signal drops completely. The file looks horrible and the averages are way off as compared to my Edge 1000 (by 30w). Just wondering if this is a hardware or a software problem?
Additional update: My Stages PM does not work at all. The F5 connects ok when hold the watch close to the cranks. But the minute I move my hands and leave them on the bar the signal drops. (Riding with my left hand hanging down is not all that comfortable and aero ;-) ). Will call Garmin tomorrow. Not cool.
Here is what Garmin will say: “Call Stages.” Then Stages will tell you “Call Garmin.”
Stages PM = weakest signal of almost all PM sold.
Garmin = increasingly putting in ever less sensitive antennas since many PM have very powerful signals, due to cost or size I don’t know why.
I’m bummed because although my Edge 820 still gets a signal from my Stages when on a bar mount I wanted reliable signal to my F5S Sapphire (whenever I get it, been 3+ months but who is counting) so that I could leverage the ability of the new F5 series to propagate training recovery information across sports (wish Garmin Connect could do this for me).
Always a step forward but another step back.
I have occasional dropouts too (P1 power pedals, stryd, wahoo speed rpm). Very annoying.
Never (…never noticed) happened on garmin 520 or polar v800 (bluetooth)
Same with Rotor 2inpower
Rotor said:
Thank you for getting in contact with us. The 2INpower signal is one of the strongest signal comparing to all of the powermeters in the market, which you can easily can proove with your Edge 1000 and the 920XT. Please make sure your 2INpower also has te
latest firmware version installed.
Garmin said:
In regards to your query, we are quite limited as to what we can assist you with here.
Garmin does not support Third Party Applications, Maps or Accessories, we can only provide help and support for official Garmin products.
I appreciate this was not the answer you were looking for however I can only apologise for any inconvenience caused.
My Fault?
Hello Ray,
Since the Fenix 5 now accepts BTsmart footpod sensor, is it possible, at least in theory, to use the Treadmill Smart Speed APP on iOS to send the pace signal so that the Fenix 5 would pick it up?
that app is normally designed to send the pace to the Zwift running application
thanks
6co
In theory, it should work. I haven’t tried the app though with it.
Hi 6co,
i just tried pairing the TSS App to my Fenix 5 and I couldn’t get it to work. I tried it as a footpod, then tried it as a speed/cadence sensor, then tried it as a “Search All” sensor, and it never worked.
Have my own Fenix 5X now for two days. Thanks for the excellent write ups and videos. I’d be lost without. Truly amazing how much info the recreationalist has available now. I used CT and VIP, thanks for that tip. Used them to get my Neo last year as well. Paired with a Stages power meter, Neo, Tickr, and Sosche.
Hi,
Seeking advise regarding the F5. I run in an area with tall buildings with mirrors/glass. Think something like Manhattan.
I just bought the F5 and it’s struggling alot in this area. It looks like the watch is teleporting all around when it loses the signal. What are my options at this stage?
1. Should I disable GPS? Can it track accurately distance without GPS?
2. Should I use a foot-pod as well as the GPS? My concern with the footpod, is that if the watch is switching to the built in accelerometer when GPS is lost, the technically the teleporations should not take place. Will the footpod overcome this obstacle? Technically, if the watch was switching over, then I shouldn’t get these teleportations at all. The watch should have some checks in place to determine whether the data is legitimate or not. For example, there should be an alarm bell when you’re running the 1KM in less than a minute. How will that be any different with the foot-pod? If the foot pod will resolve these issues, then which one should I get?
3. Should I go for a forerunner? I’m guessing that the plastic casing will improve GPS signal.
4. Should I opt for another watch? If you were living in the NYC area, what watch would you wear for mapping capabilities?
Many thanks for your response and feedback. I’m a first time Garmin user. My previous experience running was with phones. I had no idea that these types of issues could occur. I’m now stuck with a good watch that doesn’t fit my needs :(
Okay – my first real complaint about the 5X
I started my run today w 5% battery, admittedly low but I figured that my 235 allowed me an 8 mile run when intermittently notifying me of low battery
I finished my 4 mile run w no alerts, hit stop on the watch
Looked about a minute later to hit save, and the screen was blank
Now after recharging , the unsaved run details and history are nowhere to be found
The only record I see is “last activity” which shows time distance and pace but no detail
Clearly my fault but it would be nice for garmin to save the details of the current run before shutting down the watch, would also be nice to have low battery warnings ala the 235
So I could know when driving on empty, exactly how many run miles I can actually do
Ok, order placed!
I ordered from clevertraining.co.uk using dcr discount code! So thanks Ray!!
Hope to get confirmation soon from clevertraining..
Okay, this question is for anyone, not just Ray.
Based on what we’ve seen so far, is the 5X worth getting if I want it for running, cycling, general cross training workouts, and hiking? First impressions were that it’d be great for our frequent hiking excursions, a nice alternative to pulling my phone out to make sure we’re on the right track (which got real old in Colorado last summer). But the more I look at it, I’m not sure how useful the maps would be in that kind of a situation, especially not being touch screen.
Thoughts? Any input from the community is appreciated.
Are you asking about the size or the quality? I have an Epix, so the screen on the 5X should be at least as good if not better. The screen on the Epix is very good, much better than a phone in full sunlight, somewhat deficient in low light conditions. The maps are quite useful, and give plenty of context (I use Garmin’s 24k TOPO US and openmtpmap.org maps on mine). Topographic lines are legible, but the Epix doesn’t do relief shading (and neither does the 5X as I understand it). It looks like what it is, a tiny full fledged map on your wrist, but I find it big enough. The Epix does have a touch screen, but I rarely use it. The only time I’d miss it is when zooming in and out, but that you can easily do with the buttons as well.
If your hands are free, handhelds are better for hiking, since they can be clipped somewhere within easy reach, but they’re not good for running. Cycling is better done with a dedicated cycling unit, but the 5X can do everything an Edge can except be easily visible when cycling (especially if you’re using the built in HR).
Yeah, it was more a question about the maps, and their quality/usability on the watch. I saw another review which brought up the idea of getting the 3, or lower level 5 for the fitness stuff, which is fantastic, but then getting a really good quality Epix to take hiking. His big issue was not being able to adjust maps quickly because you have to use the buttons, since the 5 isn’t touch screen. We’re doing more hiking as my kiddo gets older, so I’m wondering if I should just put down some money on a dedicated GPS (and yes, we have paper maps too as a backup :). Thanks for the input on the functionality. It seems like it may be one of those that i really need to test in the store to see how it works for me personally.
I really do like the all around fitness functionality of the Fenix watches, since they can also be worn out and about without looking out of place.
That’s the best thing to do. Go somewhere where you can actually see the screen and compare devices. The 5X can certainly do everything you want, but it may not be the best choice for you (and just one device may not be the best choice). I use my Epix only for cross country skiing, hiking (actually, just long dog walks in places more interesting than where we typically go, no longer than a few hours), and recording tracks for photo geotagging (up to 14 hours at a time). I use an Edge 1000 for cycling. I rarely take the Epix cycling, and it’s never the primary device.
Right now I’ve got my Casio Pathfinder, which I love, a Garmin vivofit for steps/everyday workouts, an Edge 500, and then my phone with AllTrails for hikes. The problem in CO was that the phone on it’s own would be dead by the end of the day, but when I had the juice pack on it, it’s so bulky and not the easiest to get out of my pocket. I’ll definitely give the Fenix 5x a try when i start seeing it around.
Thanks again for the suggestions!
Which fenix 5 is your favorite?
according to GPS/PACE accuracy
I use my Fenix 3HR for my interval running training and I’m training on PACE e.g. 4:30/km. In winter times and running on open streets my Fenix is quite accurate. Right now the trees are filling with leafs and my pace isn’t that accurate anymore. My old Forerunner 610 is in that case much better.
One of the reasons to buy the 5x is the GPS accuracy before HR accuracy so I’m curious how the Fenix 5x performs in this case.
Best,
Jasper
I moved up from the F3 to the F5X just a few days ago and did my first cycling with the F5X. I used GPS + Glonass and it was right on except one spot where I veer off of the bike trail and go across and open field most of the time, The F5X got it right on my out bound ride, but put me on the bike trail on my return ride(when I took the open field instead of the trail). I think the heavy leaves on the trees confused the GPS/Glonass signal, because on one edge of the field is sparsely covered of trees and the other way has heavy coverage of trees before entering the field. That was the only mistake it made. Next ride I’m going to try UltraTrac, just to save battery life, since I don’t vary my routes that much or that often. I’m sure riding a bike at 13-16 mph also gives the F5X tracking/GPS more of a challenge than a running or jogging pace. I’d say the F5X is at least as good as the F3 based on several days of playing with the GPS and tracking in the car and with one cycle ride under its belt, plus the maps are awesome.
UPDATE: Just finished my first UltraTrac ride with the F5X. But before I get into that let me add something I left out in my first response. When I had a problem with GPS tracking because of heavy foliage, there was another effect I forgot to mention, before I come to one side of the field, I’m riding on the bottom of a 70′-80′ cliff along with heavy foliage, which means probably no GPS tracking at all for about 3/4 of a mile. The cliff side would knock out approximately 1/2 of the view of the satellites available for tracking since it covers 1/2 of the vertical sky view and heavy foliage probably takes care of most of the rest of satellite views. All that said the UltraTrac actually works as well in some respects as the GPS + Glonass on the F5X, which is really a surprise, but with different results. When I used UltraTrac on my F3hr it was totally lost and would read 25%-35% less mileage than my actually route(a route I’ve ridden 100’s of times over the years and know the mileage and time). With the F5X running G+G the mileage was exact, but the route missed one of my turns off the trail, across the open field on one leg of the route. With the F5X on UltraTrac the mileage was down about 7-8% of the actual route distance, but for some reason it seemed to follow the course all the way on the mapping of the route. That doesn’t make sense to me how it can follow my course, yet miss part of the distance traveled. I assume is has something to do with the calculation in the UltraTrac formula. I assume it just follows the bike trail that is on the map until it determines otherwise, so when it loses me with the overhead blockage of satellites, it just assume I’m on that bike trail, but it still doesn’t get the distance exactly right. Evidently, it doesn’t measure distance on the map, only distances when I’m in motion and then it has to calculate an estimate of that since it cannot track me the whole distance. Interesting results, but I’ll need more rides to confirm my theory.
Hey!
I’m thinking of moving on from just running to swimming and cycling, and I was thinking of getting a multisport watch. I already do a fair bit of hiking so the fenix looked like a good option. I was wondering, should I bite the bullet and get a fenix 5, or should I save my money and go with the 3HR? And also, is the sapphire model of either worth it? does it really extend the life of the unit?
Thanks
Sapphire screens are more scratch resistant (although still possible to shatter them by dropping on a sharp object), but for normal use the bezel usually provides sufficient protection. If you are regularly hiking through heavy scrub, scrambling on talus or rockclimbing where scratch potential is very high, then sapphire makes a lot of sense.
For ordinary running and cycling, sapphire should not be required. That said, buying a phone screen protector and cutting it to size seems like a smart way of protecting a $600 watch.
Thanks for the in-deph review, super detailed as always. I assume there will be a quick release kit for all three models? Most triathletes use the unit as a bike-computer as well although all the fenix 5 models now have optical HR, I still prefer the HRM-tri strap. Has this just not been released yet? I can’t see it being compatible with any of the older unit quick release kits due to the different strap withs?
Ray
Did you do any testing on how 3D Speed and 3D Distance affect battery life?
Jessie
Thank you for your very helpful review DC.
Does/can the 5X have/do live power curve estimating/averaging, if you do not have a power meter?
Just pre-ordered mine – really looking forward to it’s arrival.
Thanks again, GP
I should mention, I am asking about power watts when on the bike – I have ant+ speed/cadence and chestHR.
Thanks in advance!
Is anyone else getting ridiculous calories burned readings mine are off the scale but not all the time for instance I commuted to work today under 10 mins and one way was 337 and the other was 76 (realistic) was barely moving. Then tonight done hour and a half not mega intense it’s thrown out over 2,000. Come on this isn’t right is it? I’ve disconnected it from MyFitnessPal pal as it’s not helping me balance at all. As an aside and support for how ridiculous the kj from my Powermeter do not corroborate the readings even ballpark.
Hmm, that’s odd. Any chance your gender/age is incorrectly set on the unit?
No never changed my birth date in there but checked it anyway as well as gender. I also checked I hadn’t put my weight at 860 kg ? Just had a thought though… every time I check these things the lifetime athlete flag has been unchecked so just recently I selected again that I am a lifetime athlete. I’m not sure what that flag does but is this having a baring? my real confusion however is that in the same day on the same ride (opposite direction) the calculation for calories appears correct on one ride and not the other, luckily so far off that it’s immediately obvious.
Check out my cycling activity on Garmin Connect. #beatyesterday
link to connect.garmin.com
I thought my calories burned (as viewed in MyFitnessPal) were quite high. that when I learned that while garmin shows a calories burned thus far during the day, MFP will calculate the total end of day calories burned and display that number. Then it does some other math. I read about that here:
link to myfitnesspal.desk.com
Question about training load/stress….
I had a garmin 235, i run, ride and swim, obviously i run & swim with the watch(connect iq app for swim and i used trainer road on my iphone for trainer sessions…..so my swims and runs end up on garmin connect>>>strava and trainer road syncs with strava therefore i can see my fitness freshness on strava
however now i have a fenix 5 it will be tell me all the training load info as you describe above but unless i use it to record my indoor rides these wont affect the training load info, and if i use my fenix 5 for the session i’ll end up with two uploads to strava…duplicate activity
does this make sense and is there a way around it?
i’m guessing stop trainer road syncing to strava and record the activity with the watch there fore getting accurate training load and let garmin connect do all the syncing and get accurate strava metrics and no duplicates
let trainerroad look after itself!?
thanks!
Are you going to do a video of the 5X mapping functionality ?
I know you said you had rough footage – would like to see how it works before they get stock in the UK.
Garmin UK already have the 5x in stock. Mine is due to arrive in a day or two.
Congrats! I’m enjoying my F5x. Best fitness tracker/everyday watch combo I’ve owned so far.
I originally had a Garmin 910 and used the feature whereby we could insert co-ordinates and navigate with an arrow to them (for surfski races). When I upgraded to the 920, it seems that option was lost. You could only save a location and had to actually visit it first. Do you know if you can insert co-ordinates and run the arrow like set up on the 5X?
thanks
Hi Ray,
I’ve been for a few swims with the Fenix 5 and noticed that garmin connect consistently displays lap pace on the top graph that is faster than the actual pace per the detailed splits. It seems this also happens on my friend’s fenix 3. Is this an error or does the watch try to strip out the push/glide phase for the graph?
I’ve also set up an alert for each lap and noticed that it vibrates really late into each lap (eg quite a few strokes in) – where does the watch actually measure a lap from? Is it the end of the push off? Or is the alert just late?
Thanks for the awesome review as always!
Thank you for your in depth reviews, they have been very helpful! I recently acquired the new Fenix 5, and I’m very excited about it!
One thing I can’t quite figure out is how to do two different sports without saving in between (not multisport). Let’s say I want to ride my bike to the gym and ride home, and another day I ride then run, and another day I run then ride. I don’t want to create a multisport for every possible combination, what if I decide to do something different on the fly? With my 910, I could just change the sport and it would save them together. Is that option not available on the Fenix 5?
Thank you for all your hard work!
Thanks for the review – the only place I come to in order to make a decision – Fenix 3 is going, Fenix 5 ordered !
i have the fenix 5 sapphire on pre order and i currently use the fenix 3HR.. i run in a lot of river valleys here in Oregon and tend to have inaccurate GPS results… also my cadence has become increasingly important to me..
so my question is.. is there a benefit of using the garmin foot pod along with the HRM run (which i currently use)?
My experience is that the HRM Tri (same accelerometer as HRM Run) has very good and immediate cadence data to the unit. The big difference in my experience is that in the past my pace from the foot pod was very accurate and immediate. Without the foot pod I could not rely on the pace data even with very strong GPS coverage, average pace was ok though. The foot pod accelerometer had very good stride length accuracy and therefore the pace was very accurate. It seems the HRM Tri or Run rely on the GPS data for stride or distance information and only measures acceleration in the vertical plane.
If you want accurate and immediate pace information there will definitely be a benefit in using the foot pod as well.
if i understood it correctly in the new Garmin pod video, Ray shares the cadence doesnt come from HRM, but the wrist unit. I think it mentioned its a common misconception. I might have misheard him, but if its true, then not sure its likely that anything but the footpod would help with stable cadence/pace
Cadence can never come from HRM, as in heartrate data. It is measured by a Garmin HRM sensor, a cheststrap accessory. A typical F5 user won’t have that.
If F5 is measuring it then it’s not a result of HRM. And not too accurate either cause why else is there a new footpod introduced?
Cadence comes from the following sources:
A) Wrist itself (in the watch)
B) HRM-TRI or HRM-RUN straps
C) Footpod (ANT+ or BLE)
D) RD Pod
Cadence is pretty accurate in all of those. However, if you hold your wrist up for extended periods of time (such as while holding a camera), it can and will impact wrist measurement. It doesn’t have much of a tangible effect for anything else.
Pace can come from the following sources:
A) GPS
B) Wrist based accellerometer pace
C) Footpod (ANT+ or BLE)
Pace cannot come from:
A) HRM-TRI or HRM-RUN or HRM-Anything
B) RD Pod
My general rule of thumb is that wrist based cadence is perfectly fine for virtually everything. Wrist-based pace is usually fine in tunnels and such at your normal running paces. I find that if doing interval worksouts on a treadmill and at the extremes of your running paces (high or low), that you’ll see some deviation on wrist-based pace indoors w/o GPS.
Is de strap doing anything? I thought it was just the sensor. And that there was something else but what? in the strap (reason why you also have to moisten one side of it)
Pace is the speed? Not good to hear that HRM-run doesn’t do this.
Maybe you should also add the running dynamics. For what they’re worth……
Has anyone been able to connect the Strava Live Segments to their F5x yet? I tried the other day and either it doesn’t work, or I’m doing it wrong. Any help? Thanks!
I have the 5x, but don’t have Strava Premium. Looks like it will only work if you have the Premium.
I have premium and went through the steps listed on the 735 video, but no luck!
I bought a Fenix 5 and took it for a test run with my super cheap TomTom on the other wrist.
Does anyone know what’s wrong with the Fenix here? (It’s the orange line as you can probably immediately see): link to i.imgur.com
It’s leaving up to 7 second gaps between the GPS sample points, giving this very low resolution track that completely misses small curves. I didn’t use Ultratrak mode.
The TomTom is taking a sample every 1 second and obviously looks smoother and more accurate. (And this surely can’t be smoothing done after the fact, because it wouldn’t have captured the S shaped curves).
Never mind, apparently by default it does ‘smart’ recording which I assume produces that mess. I’ve switched it to 1-second recording now, and will try again tomorrow.
Hi Ray,
I received an update from Clever Training on my Fenix 5 February pre-order last night stating that Garmin is experiencing “unexpected production delays” and that further units are only expected end April. Are you aware of any problems with the current units or any other reason for these delays? Thanks!
Nope, simply Garmin being behind. That’s all.
I just got a ship notice from REI for my 5X.
I’ve been having a loud internal dialog about if I still wanted the 5X vs. a regular 5 or even the FR935.
I thought I still had at least a few more weeks to come to a solid decision, but no.. the 5X should be at the house when I get home today. Man, damn 1st world problems.
Any idea if the WiFi now meets none US specs. The F3 has a problem in Asia because Asian specs allows channel 12 and 13 and presumably the F3 was built to US specs. Or at least the one I bought from an official dealer in Thailand was. Even in Asia many people just use the restricted US spec routers but most cable companies now use routers that support the full range of WiFi channels. If your Router selects channels 12 or 13 it wont connect to the F3. It may be that the new WiFi chip now understands regions. Garmin Thailand Wont actually acknowledge the problem with the F3 so i cant see the point in asking them about the F5.
Hi DC Rainmaker
Just bought this, overall impressed. However, I had a great feature on my Vivoactive HR where I could enable phone call notifications only when exercising. On the Fenix 5, it seems to be only call or all notifications. If I could just disable call notifications I’d be happy, but it doesn’t seem to have this functionality. Do you happen to know if greater configuration of notifications is planned or if it’s actually there and I’ve just missed it?
Thanks
Matt
Ray,
Still waiting on the battery test?
Also, do you have any info on why Garmin changed the battery life spec sheet on their site? F5 went from 100-60 and 5x went from 75-35? There is no way the 5x only gets 35 hours in Ultra-trac mode
Sorry, just got slammed this week trying to get everything out (and last week with the FR935 too). I should be able to place them atop the roof tomorrow for the weekend after I get final comparative shots for my Suunto Spartan Sport Wrist HR review.
It’s also on my list to find out what the deal is with the downward revised battery numbers.
about revised battery life numbers
this is from Asia manual, even lower
How told Asia Garmin representative on call, they use different battery inside watch for asia, which sound insane for me
fēnix 5 Battery Life
Mode
Up to 2 weeks
Smartwatch mode with activity tracking and 24/7 wrist-based heart rate monitoring
Up to 21 hours
GPS mode with wrist- based heart rate
Up to 44 hours
UltraTrac GPS mode with gyro-based dead reckoning
after this weird call, I sent a letter to Garmin Asia, and call them again, after they eventually replied
this looks more reasonable
“For your information, the average battery life of Fenix 5 is in between 21 – 24 hours. US version stated 24 hours was based in theoretically statistic while Asian version stated 21 hours is based on actual field test. But both version share same hardware battery. As for UltraTac mode, it can last up to 60 hours with WHR off but only can reach to 44 hours with WHR on. “
Are men getting the 5s or is that too small?
Real men aren’t concerned and will get whatever fits their needs ;)
Personally, I would prefer it to the 5. The length of the straps seems too small and that was my hesitation. One guy did post photos on this F5 preview on this website of how it fit him. Garmin did not choose to offer the 5S in two different length straps. I also don’t know if I can handle the size of the 5 as I am a tennis player.
I have tried the 5 and 5s in a shop, but couldn’t really decide straight away.
I’m a tall man of almost 2m, rather slim and my wrists measure 18cm.
The 5s certainly fits – the band is short, it has only 1 loop but it fits easily around my wrist. A caveat is that if somebody wants to wear it above e.g. a neoprene suit this might become tight.
The 5 is slightly bigger, and the band is certainly much longer. It has 2 loops and when I close it around my wrist the tip of the band almost goes back to the watch itself. The couple of millimeters extra in band width give it a perception of being more “solid”.
I am inclined to get the 5S because of the smaller size. One thing that kept me from deciding on the spot was that the 5 is a actually bit more “balanced” in its proportions. The 5S is smaller but basically the same depth/height, so it appears to “stick out” more, if you understand what I mean.
@ your concern of too small: I am wearing a Submariner as my day-to-day watch, and it’s the same size as the 5S.
I also like the size and look of the 5s better than the 5 or 5x, because I will wear it for all occasions 24/7. What made my decision not to get the 5s was battery life at only 8 days in watch mode. My suspicion is these durable well made watches will only last as long as their batteries, which would be expensive and cost adverse to replace if not under warranty. I’ve been working with and testing lithium batteries as a hobbyist and with my son (graduate degree in electrical engineering) for over 10 years. There are numerous things that will shorten the life of a battery, but number one is number of recharges, usually 500-1000 for lithium, depending on quality of battery and an array of other factors. So in theory the 5s is going to have almost one-half the useful life of the 5 or 5x based purely on long term battery life and it cost the same price. Based on that I chose the 5x for both long term battery life and TOPO maps.
Men are absolutely getting the 5s. I did. A Rolex Submariner is 40mm, which is a plenty substantial watch for a man. I actually think the 42mm of the 5S is still a big bigger than I’d like ideally. In any event, I think the 5s looks much, much better for daily wear than did the 3. If I swap the band out for the 5s during the day, it looks fine with a suit.
The only downside I see is that it has such a skinny bezel. I wish it were the same size but with a beefier bezel. It wouldn’t take up any screen real estate because there’s already that black border.
I have the F5S with sapphire screen and black band. Great looking watch with impeccable build quality. My only criticism from a design point of view is that the lugs protrude out a fair way, making the watch look quite tall and slightly out of proportion with the relatively small watch face. I also think the band is slightly short even for my skinny wrist, and could do with being slightly wider to offer more support whilst running. Out of the 5S/5/5X this is the only watch I considered as the others would be too heavy for sports.
Ray, can you explain how the indoor track function works?
How does the use of sensors affect the battery?
Fenix 5 (1s) will last 24 hours
But how much can hold a battery with a sensor attached or a few
Tempe, footpod, RD pod, HR strap, STRYD?
Number of sensors increases battery consumption?
Im pretty sure it wont last 24 hours even without any sensor
It would depend on if in UltraTrac mode or not. In UltraTrac it would, but not likely 24hrs with 1s GPS.
Note that generally speaking there’s no impact difference between 1 sensor and 5 sensors. There does however tend to be a slight impact on battery for Connect IQ apps/data fields (more for apps).
how it could be same
the watch has communicated with each sensor
while I run with 920 it works longer then I biking with speed/ cadence sensor and power meter
Ray can check how the use of sensors affects the battery?
I’ve checked in the past on a number of other watches, there’s virtually no impact. In fact, I’ve even done some tests that show you can easily get upwards of 100+ hours recording time in GPS-off mode with the sensors on the entire time. And that was years ago – it’s far better now.
The reason is that the chipset is already powered up, so adding sensor load is such a trivial amount that it doesn’t even rank compared to powering up the display and GPS.
Will the 5 work with my old hrm from my FR220?
Yes.
So battery life.. if doing an ironman, is the 5s in trouble?
I’m really having hard time deciding.. 5s or 5.. or go with the chronos.
Take 5s, it should u motivated finished sub 9
Hi,
Between the three models and the forerunner 935. Which one have better or more accurate GPS?
Will a plastic bezel offer better GPS signal than a metal bezel? And will the small metal bezel of the 5S offer a better GPS signal than the other models including the FR 935?
Thanks!
Can anyone confirm if I collected this info correctly?
approximates:
3 (saphire): 51mm case and 198g with metal band
5s: 42mm case and 125g with metal band
5: 47mm case and 156g with metal band
Chronos: 49mm case and 184g with metal band, 103g with titanium band
The only thing I can confirm for sure is my F5x weighs 148g with a titanium band and my F3hr weighed approximately 138g with a titanium band. The Chronos at 103g with titanium band sounds a little light, because my titanium band weights about 50g. The Chronos does come with a titanium “hybrid” band, which is a little different than the regular titanium, but I think 103g is probably a little low for Chronos with titanium.
Hi Ray,
just got my Fenix5X .. it’s running fine BUT the vibration alarm is not working.
Software update done: Version 2.90 (a520a2e).
Found a youtube from a guy with the same problem, but no idea how to fix the problem.
Would be great if you have an idea how to fix it.
Regards Lars
I live in South Africa and am considering buying a Fenix 5x from the U.K. Whic I assume will have built in European mapping. How easy is it to cahna and put on South African mapping?
Updated to 2.9 last night and 3 of my sensors were lost including just the Bluetooth connection to the stages, Jabra elite headphones but most surprisingly my Garmin HR strap. The first 2 have found and connected but my Fenix 5 won’t even find the Garmin strap to add it to my sensors. I am one hour into ride so as you imagine it should connect. As usual the edge 1000 connected it instantly as usual. I think it might be time for mine to go back as it will think I’ve had a day off tomorrow and past 2 weeks learning willl be out the window. Unless anyone can help with this issue ??
Any help gratefully received and thanks to replies to my previous queries, Vince.
One thing I miss from my TomTom is the ability to set a distance (albeit it was a pita to do) and get an alert at 50% and 90% so for example if I was doing a 20km run I’d get an alert at 10km and 18km. I wonder if a ConnectIQ app could do that ?
Here’s a 5s with a leather strap. It’s a one piece, which makes it easy to swap for silicone when I work out, but it means I lose 24/7 monitoring, which I don’t care about. I suppose you could get a super long one piece strap and fold it back on itself if you wanted to get HR.
I like that type of band, one piece snap around the wrist type. I wore a band like that in high school and college while competing in middle distance races and cross country, in those days there was no wrist HR. I wore a combo watch with stop watch combo and it worked great for workouts and competition. Out of all the scores of watches I’ve owned over the decades that was probably my favorite watch band. BTW, where could I find that band today? Thanks.
This is the type of band I was talking about. It’s a metal clamp type cuff band inside and a leather exterior and it just snaps around your wrist. It makes it easy to take off and put on and it never feel off. But of course you lose HR.
Apologies if that has been covered already, but any chance we will see training load on 735xt? Worth holding my breath?
Finally made a decision.. went with the Chronos Stainless..
Now, does anyone know if the QuickFit bands work with the Chronos? Maybe the one for the 5X?
So how does the GPS/ultratrac mode work… and why are they on different screens.
I’m playing around with GPS in settings which allows you to use “smart” recording or “1s” recording.. So let’s you turn it to “1s” recording..
In each activity, you can set the GPS to “On” or “Ultra Trac”… So now let’s say you set it to ulta rac…
Does the ultra trac work with the 1s or override it?
I did some testing with recording in UltraTrac both in “Smart” and “1s Recording” and I can’t tell any difference in the detail (mapping) or otherwise. I did see differences between GPS+Glonass and Ultra Trac in (map) detail, but not within Ultra Trac with different recording selection. There could be a subtle difference, but I couldn’t tell it on information I tested. I suspect the Ultra Trac overrides the recording selection.
Where is the GPS setting to change from smart to 1s? I’m not seeing it anywhere. I only see where you can change from gps to gps/glonass within the activity settings.
Hold the “up” button down to go to “settings”–>System–>Data Recording, then chose recording option.
Thanks David!
Got my Fenix 5X this week and both outdoor runs I’ve done were well over the 10-minutes required to trigger a VO2 max reading, however nothing is showing up. I thought the wrist HRM never flipped to the chest strap on the first run, so I turned that off for the second run and everything recorded great off the chest HRM, yet no reading after running for over an hour. Any ideas or suggestions on how to maybe fix this? Garmin customer support is closed on the weekend, so I’m not able to contact them until Monday. Thanks!
I had the same thing occur. Did you get any answers? I was thinking that maybe you have to wait for the 7 days of data for that as well.
Hi Josh, It’s weird, but it finally started showing up after I recorded a quick, 24 minute walk with my dogs. Who knows why it didn’t record on my run earlier that morning, but it looks like it’s finally good to go. I’m hoping the training load data starts populating tomorrow or Wednesday as I received the watch last Tuesday. I’ll update once I see what happens.
Hi Josh, just a quick update. I woke up this morning and the training load data has populated, so it looks like I’m in business!
Hi Ray – thanks so much for all of your reviews. I’m an over-analyzer so it just feeds the fire :) I have a 235 that I have been satisfied with. I use it for running, and general working out (HIIT, spin, etc.) knowing that the HR might not be totally accurate but it and the step/calorie burn ballpark are adequate for my needs. And of course, pace for runs.
The only reason I would upgrade to the 5s is for wearability. I feel a little bit awkward wearing the 235 to > casual dress events, and it looks like the 5s (maybe due to bevel) has a much more appropriate face for a woman’s wrist and generally better aesthetics.
I realize comparing the forerunner and Fenix are kind of two different beasts, but really is there any way to justify a $300 upgrade to the Fenix 5s? As in – is there anything on the Fenix that would be a noticeable improvement for my usage that I can use in my justification argument to my husband? Thanks.
ok Ray….
I did some battery test this weekend and these are my results…They are not good…
23:30 for 1sec recording with OHR on BT off(good test, what it should be)
28hr for Ultra-trac recording with OHR on and BT off ( 28hrs? are you kidding me, how is it only 4 more hours when the GPS is only on every 60 sec instead of 1 sec?)
That is unreal. You stated in your “hands on” that the watch was supposed to do atleast 50 but more likley 75 hours. Now Garmin has even adjusted their website of 50 down to 35hrs. Something is going on here and its not good.
Where on their website do they say 35 hours now? I still see 60 (with OHR off) everywhere…
Also, what were your backlight settings, out of curiosity?
Also, to clarify – with the 1s and OHR on, what was the recording scenario? Meaning, were you inside at any point by chance? Or was the OHR on your wrist the whole time?
The reason I ask is that if you were inside for a portion of that, that would significantly impact GPS battery life. When you go inside the unit attempts to compensate for what it believes is poorer sky view conditions, by increasing power to the GPS.
The scenario was this.
-Charge the device to 100%
-Go outside and select an activity with 1sec recording.
-Make sure it got GPS lock and set it in the spot for view of the sky.
-When that was done (22:30hrs in the watch was at 4%) I brought the watch back inside and charged it back up to 100%
-Repeated the steps but instead changed the activity (hike) and verified the GPS recording was on Ultra-trac.
The watch was never inside except to charge back up to 100%. Also the watch was never on my wrist. I am going to do another test, with OHR off for Ultra-trac but still pretty disappointing for Ultra-trac battery life.
described scenario tested with OHR on without real hand more close =OHR off
testing Utra-trac without moving = no gyro working = longer life
So your saying it should have lasted longer with the gyro working or not ? Either way 28 hours in ultra Trac is awful by any calculation. It makes zero sense why it only lasted a few hours longer than 1sec. My old Suunto ambit 3 peak goes from 20hrs on 1 sec and 200hrs in 6p sec. Now I’m not saying the Fenix 5 should get 200 hours but it makes zero sense why it last 2 weeks in watch mode but only a few hours longer in 60 sec mode compared to 1sec.
with gyro it will last shorter
I posted here already but can do it again
Garmin revised battery life for Fenix 5 and Fenix 5X
it was
Fenix 5 (US manual and Garmin website)
GPS/HR mode: Up to 24 hours
UltraTrac™ mode: Up to 75 hours without wrist heart rate
now it’s
GPS/HR mode: Up to 24 hours
UltraTrac™ mode: Up to 60 hours without wrist heart rate
For Fenix 5X
it was:
GPS/HR mode: Up to 20 hours
UltraTrac™ mode: Up to 50 hours without wrist heart rate
Now:
GPS/HR mode: Up to 20 hours
UltraTrac™ mode: Up to 35 hours without wrist heart rate
BUT
Asian version manual and website stated different numbers and it even lower
Now it’s:
fēnix 5 Battery Life
Up to 21 hours
GPS mode with wrist- based heart rate
Up to 44 hours
UltraTrac GPS mode with gyro-based dead reckoning
Fenix 5X
now:
Battery Life
Up to 20 hours
GPS mode with wrist-based heart rate
Up to 30 hours
UltraTrac GPS mode with gyro-based dead reckoning
I sent letter to Garmin, and here their reply:
Thank you for contact us at Garmin Corp. I am happy to assist you today.
For your information, the average battery life of Fenix 5 is in between 21 – 24 hours. US version stated 24 hours was based in theoretically statistic while Asian version stated 21 hours is based on actual field test. But both version share same hardware battery. As for UltraTac mode, it can last up to 60 hours with WHR off but only can reach to 44 hours with WHR on.
if fenix5 going from 60 to 44
for 5X from 35 to 25.5 if tested with moving (gyro) and real hand (whr on)
probably 5X using a lot power by them self, and gps 1 sec or 60 sec, doesn’t change a lot for battery life
But my experience with 310/910 and especially 920, tells my, if garmin stated numbers, should cut it at least 30% for real working time
Still doesn’t sense why GPS on every 60 sec should be that close to 1 sec, on top of having 2 week battery life on watch mode with everything else on.
Basically the gyro and Ulta Trac mode is useless. There is no reason to use it over 1 sec unless Garmin team figures out hour to get ultra Trac up to atleast 50hrs
Hmm…maybe to ask the obvious: But does the UltraTrac track if you dig into it actually do the recording properly? Or is there perhaps a bug that it’s sticking on 1s recording?
All of my units are currently on the roof…
(And here’s to hoping the GoPro doesn’t fall off of said roof or have a pigeon take, since that’s the only thing I couldn’t tie down due to the rotating thingy I stuck on the bottom of it…)
Just finished my second Ultra-trac test. This time with OHR off. It barley got 34hrs. Thats only a 10 hour bump from 1sec and OHR on.
So far results
GPS 1sec OHR on BT off = 23hrs
GPS Ultra-trac OHR on BT off = 28hrs
GPS Ultra-trac OHR off BT off = 34hrs
Fwiw – here’s the results of the regular battery test (got the units off the roof this morning)
5S: 14:23:29 (claim is 14hrs)
5: 23:36:06 (claim is 24hrs)
5X: 24:41:31 (claim is 20hrs)
I’ll detail more in a section in the review. Specs for all of them were identical: OHR on, GLONASS off, 1-second GPS on, Bluetooth off. All Sapphire models, but WiFi isn’t enabled in sport mode. No ANT+ sensors connected to them. All on current production firmware.
I’ll probably try an UltraTrac mode test in California later this week, but since I fly tomorrow morning I won’t have time to put them back on the roof and let them finish.
Where in California will you be?
Everywhere!
Starting in San Francisco (but only for 24 very packed hours), and then down the coast to Monterrey for Sea Otter, then eventually down the coast further to LA, and finally San Diego. About three weeks in total.
If you’ve got the time while you’re in San Diego I’d love to take you out for a trail run in the local mountains. It’d be good terrain for UltraTrac testing.
Cool! I’ll hit you up on the side. Thanks!
I appreciate your dedication to this. I’ve been searching up and down for actual field tests on the watch for battery life, and you are the first person to report in actual numbers.
Are you sure OHR was really on?
while watch on wrist it’s all the time blinking/lighting, if take it off it will stop blinking after a couple sec
Do u think while it just lying on the roof without real measuring heart rate is it real test with OHR on?
No, of course it’ll turn off the OHR here and there (it also samples frequently as well). It’s not perfect, the test has many flaws – but it does get as close to a ‘best case’ scenario as possible. A high watermark if you will.
My test Fenix 5 Sapphire
Watch was 100% charged at 6pm Sunday (9 apr), wifi and bt off, I ran 7 times, overall time 8hr45m GPS +hrm on,
+1 hr gym GPS off
wearing it on hand in watch mode 1 night (8hr), and 21hr at day time hrm on
rest of the time in a watch mode on a shelf
and for now left 5%
overall:
8hr45m GPS+ HRM on
+1 hr gym GPS off
8 days watch mode
used wifi manually for transfer 8 times
Pretty close to Asian manual numbers
This test is no test under real conditions. I think you know that. During the normal use, you have several button presses, scrolling through the data pages…, maybe intensive use of the map page with routing (5x)…
This is how Garmin slide down battery life
link to youtube.com
Hi Ray, I live in Vietnam and cannot order here on Internet due to some custom issues so I had a friend get a F5X from HK for me. However he could not get the metal band version and would like to order the metal band to be delivered to France where I’m going soon. Do you have an affiliate link to order the metal band in France? I’d like to support (a bit) as I enjoy your reviews :-)
Thanks Justin for thinking of me!
Unfortunately I think only Garmin themselves is stocking the metal band as an accessory outside the US (I’m there might be a few retailers here and there), but I haven’t seen it on Amazon.fr or Clever Training Europe. Sorry!!!
But thanks for the thoughts!
I looked, but didn’t see anything about being able to recharge on the run. Does the Fenix 5 keep this ability from the 3?
You can charge while tracking.
But the placement of the port on the underside of the watch means you would either have to drill a hole through your wrist, or take the watch off your wrist to charge it.
For an ultra running, many that I know dont mind holding something for awhile, or putting on the hydration pack. As to charging, here is crud charging rate data I took today (from AC) so usb charge is likely a little different.
I was curious, so in an unscientific way, I wanted to see how quickly the F5x charges. Before starting my watch was at 24% charge.
At 15min intervals, this was the progression, when F5x was connected directly to the wall AC.
Time 0: 24%
T0 + 15min: 36%
T0 + 30min: 48%
T0 + 45min: 60%
T0 + 60min: 72%
T0 + 75min: 84%
T0 + 90min: 96%
~T0 +98min: 100%
drill a hole in the watch and solder a cable on the board
My recharging numbers were about the same. In contrast, as a hobbyist who has worked with lithium batteries for about 15 years, I’ve noticed that lithium battery life actually improves after about 5-8 recharges on a new lithium battery. Improvement can be anywhere from 15% to 30% longer battery life depending on the battery quality and the application. It’s important not to ever let the battery go down to 0% or even under 10% if possible, it will kill both the longevity and endurance of the battery.
DLuna : Interesting, so it’s better not to ever let the battery go down to 0% or even under 10%. In another post of a user in this blog I read that the life of a lithium battery depends on the number of cycle of recharge. After reading that post, I begun to let the battery of my armband optical heart rate monitor (Scosche Rhythm+) and the battery of my watch Garmin FR35 completely discharge, so I recharged the Scosche and the FR35 just once in a week.
Do you think that I was doing a wrong thing and it’s better to recharge every two or three days, ad example when the battery is 50%? Or even better after every single run (as I usually do with my Garmin Foreronner 610 that a has a short battery life)?
I’ve never had a long activity with the F5x, or started an activity when the battery was low. But the F3 would power itself off once it reached some minimal level. Meaning, that is to say, that the F3 would not let you run the battery to 0%. My assumption was that the F5 series did the same (in fact that should be common practice for all lithium battery in any device these days)
The Fenix5 will kick you out of a workout at 5% battery. You can then use the watch without GPS down to 0% battery.
The point of companies doing that is to ensure there isn’t a workout data loss situation in a file during an unexpected power-off due to loss of battery juice.
There are an array of factors that determine longevity of a batteries life. Number of charges is limited to between 500-1000 over the life of a lithium battery, which is the number one factor in a batteries life. If you allow the battery to go down to less than 10% then you’ll probably get closer to 500 recharges. The most stable status for a battery when stored for weeks or months without use is between 30% – 70%, which means it’s happiest in hibernation in that range. So in theory if you keep the battery between 30-70% for about half of its life(while in use) which happens with normal use above 10% charge, then it would last closer to 1000 recharges. Some studies show that if you only charge it up to 85-90%, then you would get even more recharges than charging to 100%. In other words, try and keep it in the 30%-70% range for as much of its life as possible without discharging it completely. Hope I explained that comprehensively.
DLuna thanks!
Hey Ray. Love your reviews. Did you ever manage to finish the skiing video? Also any details on the ski data reported on the Garmin app? Saw some of the data on strava but is very basic in comparison to what a skitracks app would give you on the phone.
Keep up the great work.
Jim.
No, still slow on my ski video.
But, here’s what Garmin Connect shows:
link to connect.garmin.com
link to connect.garmin.com
link to connect.garmin.com
link to connect.garmin.com
The splits tab will note the ‘runs’, automatically. Though unfortunately Garmin Connect doesn’t have any logic to re-word some of the UI elements online. Which is too bad, such minor tweaks would really help.
Hi
Now i’ve used my Garmin Fenix 5X for about a week. I’m seeing the same issue as i did with my old Garmin Fenix 3. The Max speed of a workout “spikes”.
I.e If i look at the summery of one of the last two workouts the MAX speed is 4.07 min / km and the average speed is 6.09 min/km.
Today I ran with my Fenix 5x on my left arm and 735XT on my right arm. The above mentioned issue happend again with the Fenix 5x. There were no such issue with the 735xt.
Anyone else experiencing this?
Have you tried swapping arms?
Sounds silly, but just curious.
That I haven’t tried. :-) Since most of my runs have lots of left and right turns I hadn’t even considered it. :-) I’ll put 735XT on my left wrist and the Fenix 5x on my right for my next run.
This is not silly at all. In fact, it’s been the only way for me to get optical HR working for quite a time.
After losing 20 kg of my initial weight, my wrist is quite skinny. However, my dominant hand seems to have a few more muscles than my non-dominant hand, so the wrist of my dominant hand works better.
My ranking of oHR sensors is the following:
1. Polar A360 – the best by far, works on either wrist, but not good for running for quite a number of reasons so it went back :-(
2. Fitbit Charge 2 – Good for resting HR on my non-dominant wrist, but only works consistently for running on my dominant wrist.
3. Vivoactive HR – Takes quite a time to lock signal (30-50 seconds) and then quite a time to settle to the right HR (5-10 min), but works then. Takes significantly less time to give a good signal on my dominant wrist.
Also tried earlier:
– Mio Link – when I had 10 kg more – never really worked (although device had a good track record in most reviews).
– Charge HR – worked well when I had 10 kg more but was unusable after losing weight.
I think oHR is varying wildly between users and is highly individual.
This is a huge problem for manufacturers because at the moment users have no possibility to test devices without buying a new device and manufacturers have a high risk of returned devices and frustrated users.
Can we use a Suunto HR monitor (either ANT+ or Bluetooth) with the Fenix 5? Or do we have to use the HRM-TRI or HRM-SWIM?
You should be able to use the newest Suunto ones that are legit Bluetooth Smart, for simple HR. It cannot transfer recorded HR from the Suunto straps (you’d need the HRM-TRI/HRM-SWIM for that).
Note that the older Suunto straps are actually private-ANT, and not AN+T, so those won’t work at all.
Thanks Ray. So the Suunto Bluetooth HR strap will work for running, but not swimming? (Since swimming requires recording and transfer after the workout?)
Correct.
First of all I love your reviews and appreciate all the work that must go into them.
Do you happen to know if the VO2max calculation takes into account climbing hills? I train almost exclusively on hills, climbing about 2k feet of elevation each session. My VO2max reading on my current Fenix 3 seems low and I can’t figure out if it’s not taking into account the fact that I’m climbing hills or if I’m just out of shape. I’m thinking it’s just looking at the time it takes to cover a given distance and how much energy I’m expending to do that.
I’m wondering if perhaps the Fenix 5 changed the way this figure is calculated. I read on First Beat’s website but wasn’t able to find anything addressing hill training.
Michael
I vaguely remember a conversation with the FirstBeat folks that it does, but maybe I’m imagining things. I’ll reach out and ask.
OK. thanks for the info. It is bad to hear but good to know. It is a bit of a shame that something in theory works, but in practice no.
That must be the standard issue with BT really not being able to perfectly mate with watches, just like Ray was mentionning with power meters…
In any case thanks for the feedback!
Just an fyi. The fenix 5x doesn’t do well with changing up strokes in the middle of a lap. I know you mentioned that stopping in the middle of a lap during a pool swim caused inaccuracy … But it turns out so fits switching strokes during your lap. This is despite being an outdoor pool which you would think would help if the watch also uses GPS? During a pool swim. It’s disappointing particularly given that swim team often requires stroke changes during laps for swimming drills. The watch is amazing when you swim a single stroke though!
Even in an outdoor pool, it won’t use GPS (accuracy isn’t good enough for such tight turns/situation).
Yes, I thought so. I wonder if more similar strokes would be better? Swam breast/free, maybe fly/free would cause less physical change that would result in more accurate readings? time will tell
Received by 5X from BH Photo last week. Watch seems to be working as advertised. Haven’t really been able to test it thoroughly since I’m recovering from a fairly severe bike crash. The one thing that’s really strange is difficulty connecting via USB to my 2015 Macbook Pro Retina (latest OS Sierra). The Mac Finder just will not recognize that the watch is connected though the the Mac’s system report shows it present. So far I’d say my success in connecting is about 1 in 10. Accidentally found that turning off the Mac’s bluetooth increases frequency of a successful connection. Tried connecting to a Windows based machine and having no connection problems. Might add that I have an Epix and F3HR which connect fine to the Macbook. Did talk to the folks at Garmin and we really can’t come up with an answer. I’m putting this out just to see if anyone else is having an issue connecting to a Mac.
Have you tried reaching out to Apple directly? They might refer you right back to Garmin but they’ll likely be able to identify if the issue is on their end or Garmin’s. I’ve called them, was able to speak to a real person almost immediately who was very knowledgeable and spent a good half hour with me trying to resolve my issue. Worth a shot.
Apple Support
1-800-275-2273
Michael
Having been a life-long Suunto guy, I finally gave up on the intermittent Ambit 3 bluetooth sync issues and decided to switch to Fenix 5X. This review was a big factor in doing so, it made me think that Garmin got their act together and their GPS and WHR actually worked in real life.
What a joke.
In the past week I’ve spent more time trying to get this watch to sync, to track my run without claiming 125 mph runs, to measure heart rate with any degree of actual accuracy, or to just bloody well even boot up (yes the dreaded triangle) thann I’ve spent on my suunto issues in the whole of the preceding life time…. not to mention the idiotic menu system, the moronic garmin express, how it kills android battery, how the website fails at even the most basic functions…
So – advice to those looking to leave their slightly afflicted Ambit 3’s behind – grass ain’t greener on the other side – it’s just artificial turf.
You see, people who write elaborate and exhaustive reviews that seem to avoid talking about the major issues with garmin’s software that render these devices largely useless (just sign up on garmin forums and you’ll see) do so because they ultimately need to make a living..
so connect the dots and beware.
Thank you for nothing DCRM.
I dont write long review. My F5x is syncing just fine. I almost never use Garmin Connect, once one in a blue moon after I setup to auto upload to strava. Garmin express. one time again to setup wifi. No comment on the menu system, except I prefer it to prior iterations. OHRM seems on pair with most others on the market. Garmin Forums? well by nature of the forum, people go there to ask questions or understand issues. Happy folks dont just post for no reason. Read plenty of short and long reviews on the Suunto Spartan ultra.. but opted to stay away. seems light years away. Maybe not.. but that was perception. Maybe you have a bum watch, or maybe not. If you like your Ambit 3. great.
Happy to help Max!
I can very well understand your anger! All the time wasted. No one ‘on the other side’ ever realizes how terrible that is. Especially when you’ve done something after proper research and considering.
I agree reviews, even DCR’s, tend to not mention all negative aspects. For a part because these aspects haven’t been encountered but it’s an illusion to think the relations with the ‘suppliers’ never play a role.
Garmin already for a few years now isn’t the company anymore that it once was. It starts with having too many products and goes down to all parts of their operation.
It’s not only them. Look at Tacx…….. There’s not even manuals online anymore.
We have to hope for the younger companies I think.
(BTW: too bad to see you had problems with Ambit. I’m considering to fly to that device, since the ideal external display for the phone still isn’t on the market. Was it only BT syncing? Cause I’m used to that already! (Fenix (older model) to be returned for repair but which I never wanna see back))
flee to that device :-) I fly as little as possible
If you seldom use something………. I can mention 5-10 GC things that don’t work. Some of them for months already. Garmin maybe doesn’t even know. I tell them and they come back with stupid answers (what type of device are you using?? !!!!) Not to speak about how little possibilities it has)
OHM maybe relatively OK (when you’re lucky) but absolutely?
Forum users with problems can basically be divided into 2 groups: the ones that failed to RTFM and real users. Average people just use a small part of device’s possibilities, whatever kind of.
Suunto shouldn’t have reacted on F5 introduction. Buy they also have shareholders………..
The problem with the original post is that it’s all high-level without actually being specific.
Which specific Garmin Connect “basic fields” are missing?
You said your Suunto unit had problems with your Android phone and syncing, and now the Garmin unit does too. Maybe it’s your phone?
Killing battery life? Also, sounds like it’s your phone.
Have you called Garmin about the boot-up issue? If so, what’d they say? Or were you trying to load OSM/other maps on it and perhaps have a bad map?
Folks complain about somehow missing details here in my review, but then gloss over the details themselves in their criticisms.
And while we’re at it…Raul, it took me 3 seconds to find the Tacx manuals. Here:
link to bfy.tw
It’s the first link returned.
I can give some hints on GC:
Disappeared:
* search name field (in Activities)
* hide filters button (Activities)
Not shown:
* runcadence graph (reg details), while av. value is listed, but no max. (reg details), not in cadence column (Activities) (Wahoo RPM)
* power values (in export splits) (see screenshot, in Dutch sorry)
* all newer items in cycling splits overview not exported. (same screenshot)
Incomprehensible:
* moving time always lower than time while user was moving all the time, having no autopause active. The total of the column is equal to……..that of the time column (???) (Activities)
* sum strokes in cycling activities. What use? (Activities)
* best Segments result won’t appear in list (Segments) (screenshot)
* graphics don’t scale according to values, have a ridiculous range (what’s the use of going until -100 m. in the altitude graph?)
There’s more but the report already became longer than I wanted…. I don’t get paid for this.
This is the website of the world leader of sportcomputers! Some of these phenomenons are going on for months. It looks like the site is managed by trainees. The kind that fixes 1 thing (or tries to) but meanwhile creates a new malfunction.
aforementioned screenshot 1
And 2
Ahh Ray, I don’t consider a Quick Start as a manual. Tacx neither, the subtitle is ‘assembling Neo Smart’. The info even isn’t clear, which forced them to release an additional doc. No info on updating, to name just something. For which you don’t receive any notification; the investigating why the machine wasn’t functioning properly was a waste of precious time.
I was more referring to TTS4. Also on that I spent many many hours to find things out. (ever tried to re-ride an own reg?) Time that I would rather have spent on core stability, exploring cycling apps or sleeping! The available manuals are from 2013! They’ve decided to produce only Youtube video’s. At least I bought my Neo for $ 750…..
DCRM – you are embarrassing yourself, I totally understand that you need to make a living out of this website, but surely you must realise that it’s loyal following that trusts your advice, and not the odd click-throughs to amazon that will ultimately matter to your commercial success?
Surely you must realise that people like me and Raul aren’t just going to flame Garmin for no reason other than genuine frustration with a product that’s so clearly half-baked?? We do have day jobs…
So it’s because I have a day job so I’m only going to recount the so-desired “specifics” that jump to my memory in the next 5 minutes:
1) Dreaded triangle happened within the first 25m – suspected cause was the strava live segments sync to GC (as supported by many posts to be the cause) – and don’t blame strave, this entirely a Garmin feature. Full hard reset (yes, where you have to stand on one foot and touch your nose while pressing and releasing buttons in a moronic sequence) got me back in business… but I dare not try live segments again (yep, another 5x promise in the bin)
2) Sync issues… where do I begin.. issues with Garmin express (ie with a cable) – just shows a red message every once in a while, no explanation of what happened, just that it failed. Issues with bluetooth synching with the android are DAILY and unfixable without a cable, my Suunto was occasional and fixable through phone restart- maybe it’s the phone.. but it’s the same phone.. sync audit shows a “timeout” of 90+ seconds to download a file… only cleareable through synching with a cable.. synching over wifi.. have no idea if that even attempts to work as I’ve seen no evidence of such
3) GPS – i won’t even bother, suffice to say it’s just random.. comes out of the box with “Ultra” enabled (Ultra=Ultra-bad), so expect schizo zigzags, then even when glonass and 1s tracking enabled, will just randomly loose track and back to the zigzags…
4) Battery life – very obviously related to the failed synchs – but when it gets into that loop of failed synchs, I can actually feel the phone getting hotter (no, it’s not a galaxy)
5) Heart rate – tried it while running outside, on a treadmill, on a stationary bike… about the only time it tracks “well” is when I’m doing little to nothing…. Other than that it will go super-eratic (ie 120 – 180 and back repeatedly) or just tell me I’m resting when I’m in the red zone… I get it, WHR isn’t perfect – but this is WAAY worse than expected.
6) Idiotic UI… maybe personal, but who rationally thinks that menu and up should be the same button? i mean you press menu and the next click scrolls it up??? how about navigate VS run? why not navigate WHILE run?
Honestly, not that suunto is perfect, and it sounds like spartan is fraught with issues, but man… getting a garmin is like buying a chinese fake of what they actually advertise..
I dont have any sync issues. None. GPS is at least as good as F3, and that was always perfectly fine for my short runs, and my ultra (not ultra trak, dont need it. 18hrs for 1hr usb recharge is fine for me). OHRM, I’m still getting a handle on. during treadmill, rowing machine, and eliptical, it was spot on. at least compared to my taking my own pulse and grabbing the HR. Strength training, it was off, garmin forums have theories about OHRM and strength training. UI? I’m running through trail. I dont spend any time using the UI. and once done, its no issue. Apple vs Andriod PC vs Mac. ask a 1000 people and get a 1000 different replies on every UI known to man. it works anything else I dont personally care. Strava segments? Not a feature I care about. Considering its new on most garmin, I dont know if its working for any. If you dont like the F5. If the day comes I dont like the F5, I’ll return it. At present I must be amongst the 100 of thousands are quite satisfied.
re Ambit 3 – it’s just BT synching, cable synching is rock solid.
The issues are intermittent, I’ve had them both on iphone and the android, so I suspect it’s Ambit and not the phone like DCRM alleges.
They are normally cleared with a reboot of the phone (i know) – but that seems to somehow reset the connection on the ambit.
Other than that it’s a very solid thing, I’ve done a 22h ultra with 1s tracking on 1 battery, and it has survived all sorts of crashes and wipeouts, software is simple by comparison, but works. I was thinking of selling it when i got fenix, but i’ll hold on to it now, only using the 5x as more of a gadget, hoping the software will get fixed…
Ted W – “GPS at least as good as F3” – F3 was well known to be pretty bad compared to Suunto… so that explains… if you going to make statements re: OHRM, then please don’t compare them to “hand-sensors” on treadmills.. one generally compares WHR to chest straps as that’s the biggest selling point… as for UI, granted, it’s largely personal, but there’s a difference between ratoinal and irrational… suunto lasts longer and can be re-charged WITHOUT drilling holes through your wrist, and doesn’t crash during that time and still shows the results…
Point about Strava segments is that it’s illustrative of the kind of half-baked quality you can expect from the product.. why is it ok for something new not to work for anyone?? what kind of logic is that? would you like your tesla to start half the time? or worse stop only half of the time because it’s new??
i’m well aware of my option to return the F5, I am just making sure people of this popular blog realise that there DEFINITELY is a quality issue with garmin software (at least)
while not at all scientific, use this quick n’ dirty method to judge the noise level – google “fenix 5 issues” and get a hit count… then do the same for “suunto ambit 3 issues” – the ratio is 5X (hah) and then consider the fact that suunto ambit has been on the market for 5 years..
As I said: owners without complaints don’t put the device to the test.
Relative judging is not something I’ll ever do. (OK, on Chinese stuff)
I’m using my 310 again! And never went off the 810. That syncs in a couple of seconds while the Fenix I had used minutes (for a shorter reg)
I’m not going to respond to every point, because honestly it just seems like your throwing out random stuff. I don’t disagree there’s issues (see my bugs section), plus others I’ve seen in the comments, but I don’t think they are representative of everything. Certainly your Strava boot-up issue is something that a handful of people saw on some segments, but most others haven’t (I’ve got 30-40 segments loaded in mine, no issues). I believe Garmin figured it out in the latest firmware update.
That said, I’ve never heard of someone complain about a long-press for menu. Never once. So I think you’re out in left field there. And I don’t understand why you put it in UltraTrac since you knew that’d be bad GPS, and then went onto complain about bad GPS?
As for Raul – he actually doesn’t have a unit to my knowledge. So basically, it’s stirring the pot here. He’s posted 29 times on this Fenix 5 thread alone, and not once actually with respect to offering a solution or a question – but rather just to poke other owners/etc… He’s welcome to do that, but it doesn’t go unnoticed. Whether or not he has a day job as you presume, I don’t know. We all have jobs – my job is to look at comments and figure out either A) If I can help fix the issues or B) If they’re not making much sense….or C) If they’re just here to stir the pot without any technical backing.
I will always be about ‘prove it’. You can see that below with someone that came with a legit issue on Apple Health, and backed it up with legit data. I was able to repro it, pass it on, and Garmin is already working on it. That all within just a few hours?
I do the same thing when it’s a Suunto issue or even an Apple or GoPro issue.
“while not at all scientific, use this quick n’ dirty method to judge the noise level – google “fenix 5 issues” and get a hit count… then do the same for “suunto ambit 3 issues” – the ratio is 5X (hah) and then consider the fact that suunto ambit has been on the market for 5 years..”
Not really, Google doesn’t work that way. Plus, if you search that way and explicitly seperate “Fenix 5” and “Suunto Ambit 3”, then you’ll see that you actually get more results from the Suunto Ambit. But who’s counting.
I don’t like very much Garmin Connect, I think that it’s too complicated and that it has a lot of things that are not useful. Even the simple things, like graphs, are not so clear (they are too small). I think that Garmin could improve this website a lot, but ok, it’s free, so we can live with it, better than nothing. If we had to pay for Garmin Connect, probably Garmin would care more about it.
But I think that the hardware of the watches has improved a lot with time: battery life, water resistence, weight, ease of reading during running, ease of use, wearability, size range, software stability.
Random? I agree, the way this is thing is failing is rather random… Since yesterday it has been unable to sync via bluetooth – I’ve done everything short of hard reset at this point – if you’d like to help, be my guest, sync audit output is below. I’ve de-installed/re-installed the app, un/re-paired the watch, etc.. It syncs using cable, but fails completely using the app.
regarding stuff I randomly threw out: Ultratrac is the default setting on 5X, I didn’t set it – Garmin did, and by your own admission, it’s pretty terrible
what concerns me is how you’re willing to put your credibility at risk by resisting the obvious truth: Garmin software is buggy, the GPS is inferior, your readers should know this, and Garmin should improve the quality of their software. You seem to have no issues slamming Suunto spartan (perhaps deservedly) yet not Garmin?
Here’s the sync audit log:
—GCM App Version—
3.16.1
—Timestamp—
Tue, Apr 11 2017 @ 3:28 PM
—Garmin Device Info—
[device information] unit id: 3944824354, bluetooth friendly name: fenix 5x, product number: 2604, software version: 290, device name: fenix, device model name: 5x
—Android Device Info—
Ver. Release: 7.1.1
Ver. SDK: 25
Ver. Codename: REL
Locale: en_HK
Manufacturer: Google
Brand: google
Model: Pixel
Device: sailfish
Display: NOF27B
Fingerprint: google/sailfish/sailfish:7.1.1/NOF27B/3687361:user/release-keys
Hardware: sailfish
Host: wphm12.hot.corp.google.com
ID: NOF27B
Product: sailfish
Radio: 8996-012511-1611190200
Serial: xxxxxxx
Tags: release-keys
Type: user
User: android-build
Board: sailfish
Bootloader: 8996-012001-1701181700
CPU 1: arm64-v8a
CPU 2:
—Sync Info—
******************** SYNC RESULT ********************
Upload Status=FAILED (Unable to download file [2] from the remote device: Data Transfer Timed Out)
Download Status=NOT_STARTED
Time Sync Status=SUCCESSFUL
Overall Sync Status=FAILED
Origin=5037_0
*****************************************************
UPLOAD:
LISTED { listed=1977ms }
– 2 (80/ACTIVITY): EXTRACTING FAILED [Unable to download file [2] from the remote device: Data Transfer Timed Out] { extracting=106969ms }
– 48: not processed
– 44: not processed
– 1: not processed
– 49: not processed
– 50: not processed
– 47: not processed
– 46: not processed
– 40: not processed
– 41: not processed
– 51: not processed
– 52: not processed
– 53: not processed
– 54: not processed
– 55: not processed
– 56: not processed
– 57: not processed
– 58: not processed
– 59: not processed
– 60: not processed
– 61: not processed
– 62: not processed
– 63: not processed
– 64: not processed
– 65: not processed
– 66: not processed
– 67: not processed
– 68: not processed
– 69: not processed
– 70: not processed
– 71: not processed
– 72: not processed
– 73: not processed
#Auto Upload=true
#Types=[32, 35, 4, 38, 44] | [FIT_TYPE_28, FIT_TYPE_38, FIT_TYPE_9, FIT_TYPE_35, FIT_TYPE_44, ErrorShutdownReports, FIT_TYPE_32, GPSData, FIT_TYPE_4, FitnessHistory, GOLF_SCORECARD]
*****************************************************
SYNC#h@5adf13 [3944824354]
#BitMask=932447
*****************************************************
-job: busy all day. No TV (except for things like Paris-Roubaix last 100 k, while on the stationary), no social life, no books nothing.
-no owner: like many posters
-stir in the pot: if that means what I think: someone should trigger things. I’m the opposite of the grey mass. Find it unbelievable how ‘uncritical’ people are, nowadays generation?? Don’t know better?
-29 posts: haha. It’s all about digits. Apart from a few sarcastic ones they are ‘substantial’. Not about colours, sizes etc. But I’m done.
-doesn’t go unnoticed: ??
-your task: you shouldn’t put time/energy in that! Garmin read this forum, being glad it’s there. There’s brands that even respond directly in forums. Makes them a lot sympathetic….
Byebye!
“what concerns me is how you’re willing to put your credibility at risk by resisting the obvious truth: Garmin software is buggy, the GPS is inferior, your readers should know this, and Garmin should improve the quality of their software. You seem to have no issues slamming Suunto spartan (perhaps deservedly) yet not Garmin?”
I’m not sure what I’m resisting. I’m simply asking you to show data for your claims. It’s really pretty straight forward. If you say it has bad GPS in a regular tracking mode – then show it. If you say it has bad GPS in UltraTrac, then nobody will disagree with you (including me). It’s really rather simple.
My point is your making claims as if every unit out there is having the issues your seeing. I’m simply saying they aren’t. There’s some 800 comments here, and the issues your talking about people aren’t seeing (except one person saw the same thing on a specific Strava segment of his, as noted).
“regarding stuff I randomly threw out: Ultratrac is the default setting on 5X, I didn’t set it – Garmin did, and by your own admission, it’s pretty terrible”
It’s not the default on running or cycling or most other modes. I haven’t hard reset my unit , so perhaps it is on hiking or some other mode. But to be clear, it’s equally horrible on Suunto in their long-tracking mode.
Raul:
I’m pretty sure folks find it useful that I respond to comments here. I’d save a heck of a lot of time if I didn’t (3-4 hours a day of savings time).
I think people are as critical as ever before, which is great to be critical of claims. There’s nothing about generations here. But when one crosses into doubting everything and making claims without data, then isn’t that the opposite of what you want?
I guess I don’t really get the idea of posting lots of stuff that’s simply inserting doubt into peoples minds without any backing. It’d be one thing if one has a unit (as Max does) and is having issues and can show it (like his Android log). Or the person below with the Apple Health issue. Or the other person below with the LiveTrack oddity. Those are great things to track down. But coming on and just inserting doubt on every topic every day without substance…I don’t really get?
Maybe I’m of the wrong generation…
would love to show you the data if the thing actually synch’d… but as it is, not synching anymore….
you’re right people are talking about all manner of issues and not just mine – while your own list of “bugs” is very disturbingly superficial
and i’m not speaking for every device, i only got 1 – but even a cursory glance on the web tells you there are significant issues with garmin’s software quality.. even your own loyalists admit as much by suggesting you shouldn’t use “new” features
anyway, it’s been tiresome and wasteful, you won’t hear from me, much like i won’t hear back from garmin who have thus far offered no help, (yes, they got all my logs and data… )
but suffice to say, you’ve lost all credibility in my eyes with your condescending responses – quite clearly, your commercial imperatives leave your fairness askew
Sigh…ok.
My list of bugs is bugs I saw that I found. I don’t make up bugs to appease people. I can’t fake Strava segments to make things appear/break – I’d say trying on 30-40 segments on three continents is reasonable I can’t possibly find every combination of things that one person does one way, and others another way. Similarly, I find bugs that others don’t find due to the way I use it. I’ve included every run/ride/swim/etc in my review. Folks are free to analyze my data how they see fit. The road goes both ways.
Just like fairness goes both ways. I’m fair to both consumers and companies. If a company says something can can’t back it up, then I call them out for it (like seen in the HR accuracy section here for cycling). And if someone says something they can’t back up, the same goes. I’ve never really understood why it has to be a double-standard that we can’t question claims on both sides. After all, that’s exactly what Raul asked for in this very thread. Or perhaps after years of doing this I’ve seen so many cases (on a daily basis) of folks simply making up things or outright lying about what happened. So maybe I’m biased towards asking for supporting evidence for anything – be it company or consumer.
As for your data, you can simply plug it into USB to get the same data off to share (it’s in the Activity folder). If you find me simply asking for data to back claims or to help troubleshoot condescending, I apologize.
Max and Raul, I sympathize with your sentiments about Garmin. I have lost many workouts due to corrupted FIT files. Recently it happened to a friend of mine on a ride he had been training for months at!
Thankfully, it has not happened to me yet at an important event…
(for evidence, just go on strava and search for #garminfail)
You sound like the kind of users who just don’t want to be helped, everything is the end of the world but when people try and help you you do nothing to help yourselves. I currently have a dodgy iPhone 7 but rather than bellyaching on a non official site I collected evidence via video and reproducible steps and spoke to Apple about it. They are replacing it as we speak but I realise it’s not all iPhones that are defective and if it were I’d ask for a refund and walk away.
Some people just want drama but the vast majority of readers trust the reviews here, I personally think the Fenix 5 review was a bit light in places compared to Rays usual standards but I don’t ever think he is hiding anything or changing stuff for commercial gain.
Last I read, F3 GPS is still regarded as better than any recent Suunto. Some want GPS accuracy that is military grade on a consumer handheld device. I suspect those people will never be satisfied. Not sure what handheld treadmill sensors you are talking about. I’m talking about my own finger taking my own pulse. Something doctors and nurses to Thousands of times a day around the globe. Pretty reliable. If i measure my pulse at 150 and the F5 says 150, I’d says its darn close. If during strength training my Garmin reads 98bpm and I read my pulse 120+bpm, I would say something is off. I dont care to talk about Ambit 3 or 910xt or anything else that 3 to 5 years old. If you love your Ambit 3 and its larger external antenna in the band. GREAT! I prefer the color display and mapping on the F5x. and I guess my unit is different since I’ve not had any of the issues you’ve encountered. And for the price, that stinks for you, and others with those issues. During my time with the F2, F3, I’ve done a large number of 50k, 50m, 100k, 100miler. In all those, I’ve had maybe 3 lockups. Not fun. But I’m still alive, and the world didnt end. So I look forward to giving the F5x equal chance to prove itself. After Plantars recovery, my next ultra is in June.. so Ill have to wait a bit to test the F5x.
@depicus – and you sound like you work for garmin or just just a DCRM fanboy, or you just looking to flame… or all of the above – i didn’t come here to solve my problem, i don’t need DCRM or your “good boy” examples of how you video your iphone problems… (if you think it’s ok to shell out $700 on a device that then needs you to create a video documentary of your problems, just so that you get it replaced… you go for it, you stud)
the point of the this site is to provide consumer advice -> the advice should be complete to cover quality issues -> i simply raised a point that DCRM’s *very* short list of bugs sounds more like a fake-out because perhaps garmin sends him free devices and he sells bunch of them through the links… drama? sure, it pi$$es me off that the guy who takes up the first three search results on garmin fenix review is refusing to accept what the rest of the web shows clearly – and frankly I just hope that whoever’s thinking about buying one of these reads it and makes up their mind on a more complete data set.
btw – i do give DCRM credit for putting in the work to get the data together – so to show my appreciation I will do a run today with ambit 3 on my right wrist + HRM strap, and fenix 5 on my left wrist, a phone in my backpocket, jabra HRM headhpones in my ears – all tracking data (yep, will look ridiculous) and post comparative data, whatever it shows, (and whenever my fenix 5 will actually synch again)
Well Max if you didn’t come here to solve a problem then why did you bother ? I don’t think you quite understand how the interweb works. This site doesn’t owe you anything and doesn’t have to list bugs if it didn’t want to but thankfully this site does list bugs than the majority of users are seeing. Things aren’t always perfect that’s why we have warranty and yes it’s frustrating when your device doesn’t work as expected but if you’re not willing to help yourself then why would you expect others to.
let me try again… I bothered because it bothers me that the guy who’s supposed to be a pre-eminent reviewer of these things (certainly most voluminous) seems to be out of synch with a) my experience of the product and b) the experience of many others (who can be seen both here and on other forums) – so I post here out of the desire to warn others not to make the mistake I made – just because DCRM says its a great product with only “minor” bugs – it ain’t so.
i’ve helped myself plenty, i’ve gotten the watch to finally synch – (4 hard resets later) and know I know the hoops i have to jump through next time it starts to flake out… but that’s the point – people who are expecting quality out of a $700 watch must be ware – Garmin certainly doesn’t advertise their issues, so who can be trusted to highlight them? or is this site just a long commercial for Garmin? If so – it should state so at the top, there are actually rules governing this sort of thing. I’m also intrigues by how DCRM hasn’t once denied Garmin’s support of his site that might distort his perspective… why is that?
I was busy focusing on your issue, rather than responding to all your made-up stuff.
No, Garmin doesn’t pay me. No, I don’t keep the devices. In fact they are with me at present boarding a flight to go back to Garmin. Heck, I’m even covering all my own travel costs to speak at the Connect IQ Developer conference (my ticket within the US alone was more than $1,100 to make the schedule work…plus hotel/etc…).
Made up? really? So any flaws you don’t mention are made up? Get over yourself, Ray.
Ok, maybe I’m being unfair – perhaps you don’t do it for kickbacks, you just think you’re always right..
as promised, here’s some data from my lunch time run: link to mygpsfiles.com
This is with 1s, GPS+GLONASS enabled tracking on Garmin
and 1s normal GPS om Ambit
and who knows what Pixel was doing…
Frankly, it speaks for itself – Garmin clearly has “freak out” moments, rendering it far less reliable than Ambit 3, and not what you want out of a top-tier device. I remember you slamming Spartan… yet you just won’t admit that Fenix 5X is even worse. It’s interesting.
I was speaking to your made up accusations about being paid by Garmin.
As for your data, congrats, you made a bad track. I can do that for every GPS device out there (including the Fenix5 as shown in the review).
But, that doesn’t represent what the vast majority of users are seeing, either here or even on the forums. Perhaps your device is defective, or perhaps there’s something to do with the environment…or whatever.
The point myself and others are trying to make to you is that you assume your issues are widespread. They clearly aren’t.
There’s just no pleasing you, is there… – you ask for data, for proof, I give it to you and now you tell me I “made” a bad track and that “vast” majority don’t have problems… cursory count of posts in response to this review reveals that most are talking about issues, not praising the device – and interestingly, most of the issues are not the ones you short-listed. (emphasis on short), I was going to post the heart rate data comparison which is shocking, but why bother – you’ll just toss that to the side as well… “nothing to see here”, eh?
So keep up the good work, defend the defective, let the sales continue, and if unhappy buyers post here – discredit them, tell them they’re especially unlucky, and that the rest of the web complaints are equally unlucky.
I’m not sure I discredited you anywhere. I first asked for details, which took you a lot of teeth-pulling to get. After which you posted a single run.
I then simply said the majority of users aren’t seeing what you’re seeing on that single track. And most comments here are more questions on how things work, or understanding how to figure out something. Discussion about those having an issue tends to go longer within a thread, since usually it’s about figuring out what said issue is and a possible resolution.
But as pointed out earlier – nothing really pleases you, even solution suggestions. I suggested perhaps your unit is defective, and perhaps you should call Garmin to get it swapped out. Or maybe swap out your Pixel, since that definitely sounds defective. I’m guessing it’s widespread.
As for your HR data, I looked at it too – and none of the three units you used matched (not even close), so…which one is right?
Seems there is no pleasing you either Max, why not just return the unit if you are not happy, and I suspect you never will be for some reason. You cannot complain about a problem then do nothing about it. Yes people have problems but grown-ups do something about it instead of repeatedly posting nonsense on a site – what are you expecting, some magic fairy to come and fix your “problems”.
“your condescending responses – quite clearly, your commercial imperatives leave your fairness askew”
Wow. Just wow. Ray is doing a very well job at being polite and helpful, and you classify this as condescending, when all your posts here were “wah wah, I miss my Suntoo”?
Got a Fenix 5 last week. Running, biking, short and long rides, syncing via wifi, via bluetooth, pairing with multiple sensors, sleep tracking, OHR, all work just fine. If you have that many problems, I rather think it’s a problem with your setup, because I don’t think I got a special Fenix 5 unit.
Leaving aside the heated and angry debate going on here, and looking constructively instead at the GPS track data instead – I see that the Ambit track looks very good indeed, which isn’t surprising considering the huge antenna bulge it has (I also have an Ambit 3 peak which I really like). Also, it is in a very challenging area for GPS I would think – I used to live just there, in Monticello on Kennedy Rd, … lots of dense foliage on the trees and many high rises in the lower parts of the track. You are also in the “shadow” of “the Peak” which is probably blocking out several satellites too.
The Fenix track does look poor though and the Pixel also. Do you have any friends with other running watches? And, if so, what are their experiences running in that area?
Maybe you should just return the Fenix and give something else a try? The Foreunner 935 seems to be doing very well, with no compaints about GPS problems at all in the forums and people saying it gives better tracks than the Fenix 5. Something to consider, that’s all.
I don’t want to get involved in your argument with Ray, but I would like to say that I think we can trust him when he says he receives no financial support from Garmin. I have no reason to believe otherwise, and I appreciate his solid work and willingness to run around Paris looking like a complete nerd for our sakes ! :-) Keep up the good work Ray!
Hi Max, Hi Ray,
I will jump in to the conversation that I have been following quite closely for the last couple of days.
First of all, it’s time to take it easy gents!
Now up to you Max, I understand your frustrations with your issues and I have faced the same GPS issues you were facing. And actually mine are a lot worse than yours. At first, I thought I had a faulty watch so I got it replaced but the same problems resurfaced. So guess what I did, I returned the watch…end of story. I will probably get the Forerunner 935 or a Suunto instead.
Ray is a well respected person in the industry. I believe that people who buy Garmin watches are less swayed by the marketing hype otherwise they would have bought an apple watch. And these people wait for Ray’s reviews before making a purchase. Just look at the forums and people who state, “I will wait for Ray to make his review before taking the dive.”
However, I’m in position to judge whether Ray is getting support for Garmin or not, but judging solely from his reviews he is trying to be as exhaustive as possible. However, he can not test in all the conditions. I have been searching for weeks to see if there were others that were facing the same issues that I was. I looked at the Garmin forums, I searched on Google. Max, you are the first one that I saw with these issues. I honestly feel that we were simply out of luck on this one. I know I’m running in a very difficult environment for GPS signals. I’m running in an area with tall glass buildings. I have posted my issues for you to see and this is by far not the worst one. I’ve seen 5km being added to a 7km run.
The Garmin fenix 5 was my first GPS watch, initially I used an iphone or samsung phone and never looked at the GPS tracks closely. But when I saw these issues with the Garmin watch, I started researching. I started learning a bit more about how GPS functions. And then I realized one thing, even the phones were struggling in these areas. My first 2 kilometers, I was always appeared to be running at a faster pace when I was running a warm up pace. Well guess what the phones were struggling in these parts and they have assisted GPS as well to help. A garmin without WIFI assisted GPS will struggle a lot more in these circumstances.
Now to you Ray, I’m in no position to ask anything of you. What you’re doing is already a great job but if you ask I can give some recommendations that can help and avoid these issues. Because, initially I thought something in your review was wrong before I did my research.
Cheers to the both of you!
I don’t need your help, I’ll take care of my problems myself – all I ever wanted was to highlight to your significant following that your reviews are, despite being voluminous, are clearly biased or at least less thorough than they appear, often in the most fundamental parts of what a sports watch supposed to be.
If go back to the original post (all of 3 days ago..), if you read your review, you get a number of *misleading* conclusions:
on Wrist-based HR:
YOU > “So overall – I’d say things are pretty good”
ME> THIS IS INVERSE OF THE TRUTH, it works sometimes, but NOT most of the time.
on GPS:
YOU> “So overall, it’s not too shabby.”
ME> Pretty damn shabby if you ask me. And anyone else who looks at these tracks. What shocks me is that you bemoan spartan, but I suspect this thing is much worse than spartan. (And btw, in the tracks, I don’t know how you can say with any integrity that you don’t see my point.)
You asked me for data, and at the very next opportunity, ie – next day, I posted data, if you call that “pulling of teeth”… talk about impossible to please!
it’s ok, as I could not return the damn thing (shop wouldn’t take it back), I’ll keep coming back and posting more data, I’ll get the device replaced and post results after that here, which will probably prove what other thorough testers have been saying – GPS subpar, WRH unusable, software – buggy – a low quality device that should not be bought by anyone for that price (no wonder all your strava pics feature suunto… ;)
p.s. // As for the rest of your cheerleeders, you guys just relax, no need to get abusive in defense of your object of adoration, it’s a conversation, Ray can take care of himself.
@Steve, @Youssef – I tried to return the watch.. they wouldn’t take it back!
@Yussef – have a look at link to fellrnr.com – it’s not just you and me – the GPS on this thing is pretty horrible. I wish I had read that one.. but I instead I trusted DCRM too much.
But yes, ok, you guys are right, this has become personal, I never meant to start a flame.. was just annoyed at my $700 brick (honestly!) that doesn’t do any of the things I bought it for well. (wrh, gps, synch)
but since I’m stuck with it (unless ray wants to buy it?) I will only post data and no commentary from now on.
You clearly didn’t read the fellrnr article and just cherrypicked the part that suited your view. He was using Smart, GLONAS off – come on really….
And I find it hard to believe you could not return the watch or even pick up the phone and call Garmin and maybe get a replacement. Seems you may not be telling the truth or trying to hard, not sure which.
Please stop!! It’s enough!
D.C. Rainmaker
Great review but one point I’m not sure I understand, can I use the Garmin Connect app on my phone to plan a route and send it to the 5X or can I only do that from a laptop/PC?
Thank you in advance
Will the battery test include wifi/sapphire model versus non-wifi/glass? I’m wondering if the Wifi/Sapphire models have a bit lower battery life if the wifi and bluetooth aren’t the same module and there’s an extra component to power at times. If they’re the same module, it makes me wonder if a software upgrade later might allow a paid upgrade path to wifi in the non-sapphire models.
No, I only have the Sapphire models.
But I wouldn’t expect any battery life change. The WiFi piece isn’t ever powered on until the end of an activity once you hit save, and then only for about 5 minutes if I remember correctly.
OOOOoooooh. This makes so much more sense now. I’ve had my 920xt for 2+ years and never understood why some small portion of my workouts didn’t sync. It’s the ones where I’m not ending at home, or getting home within five-ish minutes of having saved the workout! Duh. Understanding how the wifi works, I should now be able to more deterministically get more of my workouts autosync’d. And that sells me on upgrading to a wifi model if I get a Fenix 5, because I love that I don’t have to use the data cable anymore like on the older 910xt yet with the 920xt the BlueTooth/iPhone app has been just clunky enough that I’d be an unhappy customer if that app was always in between me and my data. Wifi to the Garmin Connect website (and Strava and other connected sites) and life is simple and good. If Garmin have a place for feature requests, bug reports, or especially focus group that feeds into the UX/UI/UCD team for the iPhone app, I could easily bend their ear for an hour or more. Based on today’s comments on this article, it sounds like I’m not the only one less than happy with that app, but wifi frees you from that dependency for the most part.
With the FR920XT, I believe you can force sync via WiFi by holding one of the left buttons down. I don’t have one handy in front of me at the moment connected to WiFi, but it’s somewhere in there.
Handy if you come home/back later and want to sync then.
Yes!! Just searched this out and long menu button press pops a menu including at the top of the list “connect to wifi” on the 920xt. I’m assuming that’ll be the same when I get my Fenix 5. THANK YOU for the tip!!
Searching the pdf manual for “wifi” and “wi-fi” I only got two irrelevant hits in the past. But re-skimming it around the areas for the menu button, this menu long press option is actually clearly documented. Something about how the PDF is rendered is causing text search to not work.
On the F5x, once you bring up the round menu circle, there is a “sync” option there. I presume that would sync both BT and Wifi.
F5x firmware v2.90. I’ve got v2.50 installed. And I admit to expecting a notification on my watch about a software update being available. The F3 would do that. i have wifi enabled. Should I be getting notifications about the new update? or are some upates ..only.. thru garmin express?
Hey, that swimming pool is in my club in Barcelona!!!
#BeatYesterday? #DeleteYesterday!
I bought the Fenix 5 because a sports shop around here had a -30% off of everything, so why not? I was looking for a sports watch that I can wear everyday, that has an included barometer for hiking, great battery life, etc.
And I was looking for a sports watch that fully works with my iPhone 7 Plus because I aggregate and store all my health data there to have it readily available. And in this area, Garmin completely drops the ball. Garmin says that Garmin Connect Mobile is compatible to Apple Health / HealthKit: link to support.garmin.com
Well, Garmin is blatantly lying, because it does not: Active Energy, Resting Energy, Flights Climbed & Walking + Running Distance are written to Apple Health / HealthKit only to be deleted from there again the day after – which is insane.
Karen from Garmin Customer Support lied straight to my face via chat: “how the data displays in Apple Health is not under our control.” and “Our app does not have the control to remove data from Health.” – off course, Garmin Connect Mobile does. What is made available to Apple Health / HealthKit is shown there and what is removed/deleted from there, isn’t. In addition their support forums are full of threads about problems with Garmin Connect Mobile and Apple Health, yet the people at Garmin are “unaware of any issues between Connect Mobile and Apple Health.” (Twitter)
I don’t know any other company that releases such great hardware on one hand, such broken software on the other and gives such a shit about customers and even lies straight to them. A company like this won’t see a single € from me and the Fenix will be returned to the retailer, because it can’t be used the way it’s advertised.
What’s somewhat interesting to me is that I can roughly see what I think you’re referring to (Active Energy shows for today, but not previous days). But what’s curious to me is if there’s some other bug there – because Strava is writing that data in for older days, but that’s the only other service (aside from the phone itself). I should have other service pumping in data too.
I know in the past it didn’t used to do that – since I’ve got screenshots in older posts going back some number of days showing it working just fine. The thing I’m not super clear about though is that if it’s a but on the GCM side or one on the Apple side. It appeared to have ‘died’ on/about Mar 31st. Since then, I don’t see ‘older’ data. Which likely would have coincided with the version dropped on/about the FR935 release.
Either way, I’ll shoot it over to some folks.
Ray, I’m sure you see my e-mail, so feel free to get in touch if you like – should work for iMessage as well ;-)
GCM’s Apple Health integration is somewhat broken, so I try to detail it further
1) I just deleted all Garmin Connect Mobile data from Apple Health, uninstalled the app, reinstalled it and gave it enough time so sync its stuff.
Garmin says that it sync data to Apple Health 14 days prior to setting things up. This is true for values for Steps, Trainings, Sleep Analysis and Heart Rate. Values for Activity Energy, Rest Energy, Flights Climbed as well as Walking and Running Distance (remember these 4 data categories!) are only shown for the current day – the day Garmin Connect Mobile was installed and setup to sync with Apple Health.
2) From previous tests I can confirm and have proof for this behavior: Values for Steps, Trainings, Sleep Analysis and Heart Rate are written constantly to Apple Health and stay there – just as they should. Values for Activity Energy, Rest Energy, Flights Climbed as well as Walking and Running Distance (same 4 data categories like in 1) are only saved to Apple Health for the current day, but deleted/removed on the next.
It seems to me that GCM only keeps/syncs/downloads data for values for Activity Energy, Rest Energy, Flights Climbed as well as Walking and Running Distance for the current day, then removes it from local cache / Apple Health and never again syncs/downloads them again.
Ray, if you use GCM on an iPhone with Apple Health do the following: Open Health, select Sources, Connect, Data, Activity Energy – you’ll see, that there are only values for the current day. Now go back once and select Steps: All previous data is there, see?
There are other annoying things in GCMs HealthKit integration, but the above is a complete showstopper, dealbreaker and in my opinion a clear violation of Apple Store Review Guideline 5.1.3 (ii): I would say that deleting user data is “wrong data”.
And this problem is way older; found this thread from mid January on their forums: link to forums.garmin.com
Most annoying is Garmin’s arrogant and idiotic “There’s nothing wrong.”, “Things work as they should.”, “We don’t know of any problems.”…
“I should have other service pumping in data too.”
What services are you missing?
Yeah, I was speaking to those specific categories with a Garmin source in seeing near-term data previous to today disappearing as well. Yet, data previous to April 1st actually is there from those categories from a Garmin source being there. Meaning, I think it was working fine until April 1st (or perhaps March 31st, hard to decide exactly).
As for support, I wouldn’t overthink that too much. It’s a low-level support person that may very well be seeing something for the very first time. Nobody else has brought it up till now, and if it just happened in the last 10 days, then that’s likely why (not sure if January was an isolated incident, a user incident, or a brief blip).
I wouldn’t say that it’s a violation of the user terms. There’s actually good reason why a company might want to be able to clear out bad/incorrect/ data. Obviously, it’s mistakenly doing so (or something is), but saying it’s a violation is a bit strong.
Either way, it’s on my to-do today to forward over. As for other apps, I’m oddly seeing Withings missing in rest energy. But I haven’t investigated that too closely.
Are you sure, that you have values from Activity Energy, Rest Energy, Flights Climbed as well as Walking and Running Distance previous to end of March / beginning of April in Apple Health?
Would you mind sending me a screenshot (‘old entries’) of the following screens: 1) Apple Health – Sources – Data – Rest Energy – rift between ‘old’ and new entries. 2) Apple Health – Sources – Data – Rest Energy – any ‘old entry’. Maybe things can be pinpointed to a certain version of GCM?
Withings works fine for me and writes Rest / Activity Energy to Apple Health – but only a couple days back. But Withings seems to unable to read GCM daily aggregated step count from Apple Health, where other apps have no problem with…
Attached showing Mar 31st for Flights Climbed. Though oddly I’m missing other entries too in there, kinda a blend. I wore a Garmin floor-capable watch every day since Jan 3rd or so, so certainly I’d have that data.
In any event, Garmin is digging into it now. I sent them over a note along with a link to this specific portion of the thread. I’m on a production GCM iOS app version (whatever is current in the app store).
So, I guess we can agree, that things are fundamentally flawed and/or broken and don’t work as intended and/or advertised by Garmin.
Could you by any chance also ask, why they don’t write data to Distance (Cycling) and Distance (Swimming)? I can’t get my head around this “design decision” (Garmin Support on Facebook).
I have been suffering this same Garmin/HealthKit issue since January when I got my first garmin device for many years. It is not a new HealthKit issue like you think and Garmin still refuse to accept it’s anything to do with them.
Any reply from Garmin yet? Do they acknowledge that GCM’s Apple Health integration is broken?
Wondering if this issue has a proposed solution timeline. I am basing my purchase decision on whether this works or not.
Did you ever get a resolution to this issue? Active/Resting Energt is still only maintained for one day for me. I actually have a call with Apple to see what their response is.
Hmm, I’m a bit worried about the battery life.. In another review (wearable) I’ve read the following:
“We managed around 14 hours of fully GPS tracked hiking in our testing, but when we tried to put the watch into UltraTrac mode, we got exactly the same level of battery drain. -clearly something is awry. Garmin says you should get 60 hours of UltraTrac – so for multi-day hikers, the jury is still temporarily still out.”
Above is in line with other comments on this page that battery life isn’t close to the promised specifications. I want to use the watch mostly for running and hiking so this is a major concern for me. Are there any people who already used the watch in UltraTac mode and give feedback on battery life?
Ultratrack may not be perfect but if its the same battery life as when its turned off then sounds like a bug. Now does Garmin know about this bug? Ah, the problem of people complaining on forums where those who could look into and fix bugs will never find out about the problem.
Ray, maybe you should see how Garmin finds out about bugs (support desk only? forums?….) and how to best tell them of a problem? (best meaning lowest burden on us, their end users)
Just finished my second Ultra-trac test. This time with OHR off. It barley got 34hrs. Thats only a 10 hour bump from 1sec and OHR on.
So far results
GPS 1sec OHR on BT off = 23hrs
GPS Ultra-trac OHR on BT off = 28hrs
GPS Ultra-trac OHR off BT off = 34hrs
Something is def going on. I for one purchased the watch for the Ultra-trac mode because I go on multi-day hiking trips and I dont want to charge it every night.
Generally speaking, forums are the worst way to send in bugs. The very best way to send in bugs on the Fenix lineup is to validate said bug is still present on the latest Fenix beta (if available), and then send in to the e-mail listed there. Seen at top here: link to garmin.com
Second best is to contact support via phone/e-mail (I prefer phone). Third best is Twitter.
But really, the best way for a legit and ideally reproducible bug on the latest version is that e-mail. As with all things tech, being thorough and offering specific evidence (i.e. photos/data/etc…) is best. If one sends in a but that just says “Watch stopped tracking”, that’ll likely just get deleted.
But if you send in a but that says “I was 4 hours into a ride with a PowerTap P1 power meter using Bluetooth Smart and optical HR enabled. No other sensors, but my phone in live tracking mode, with GLONASS enabled and when I crossed over this Strava segment (Segment named XYZ, link to Strava segment) the unit reset. Attached is my device.fit file, my activity.fit file, and the ERR.log file. Also, when it restarted, it did not give me the option to ‘resume activity’. This is the first time I’ve seen this.”
Then, you’ll likely get not only a follow-up answer, but probably a fix – and usually even within the next firmware update. A typical watch firmware update (from Garmin or Suunto or Polar) may list 5-8 big ticket fixes on it publicly, but in reality it’ll have 30-50 fixes in it.
Remember, techies trying to solve the issue don’t care about excessive commentary or why this means you hate/love Garmin or the product in question. They just want to fix the issue. Keep it to the point, clear, and helpful. Put yourself in their shoes if you were trying to fix something. It’s not really the place for a dissertation.
(Obvious note: The above example text is not a real bug, it’s a made-up bug, but it roughly on the same level of detail as I provide. Though, I usually provide a lot more detail.)
Might be useful to have that in the bugs/quirks section of the review. Think of how many bugs could be fixed if people reported them so they knew to fix them instead of just complaining to people who can’t do anything about it
Agree mostly, but keep in mind that I was looking for confirmation if this is a real bug. It would hold me from buying the watch. When multiple users experience the same problem it’s a real bug instead of wrongly using the product. I’m sure garmin keeps track of some forums btw
Maybe the gyroscope ends up consuming more than initially thought…
Ray, thank you fo this great review, I choose to buy the watch after reading it…
Today I tried to set up the autolock function for triathlon swim section, enabling it into the activity menu, but it doesn’t seem to work.
Could you give me explanation on how to use it?
It will be fantastic not having to bother of buttons pressure during the chaotic swim starts…
The way it works is that after each sport change, the watch automatically locks itself. To unlock it, you’ll need to long-hold a button, and then you can switch to the next sport. So basically, it adds a long-hold vs just a single tap on the lap to switch sports.
Thany you Ray, I was finally able to set it up!
Autolock will be always on in my swims.
Yesterday i received my Garmin 5s, black with silver bezel (non saphire).
Bought from clevertraining.co.uk.
So far i’m really happy with the watch.
I wanted sport watch which i can wear to work (i’m wearing suit, everyday) and it is acceptable with suit.
There where some chatting about sub par quality from 5s, but i can say that the build quality is very good. Buttons are solid. No complains.
So thanks Ray for your review!! And keep them coming!
Awesome – thanks for the support!
Bug, bug, bug. Reveived my Fenix 5 today. Played around with menus a bit… and now no way to sync up watch with iPhone. Culprit seems to be Livetrack but it’s impossible to deactivate it without being in sync and even after resetting watch to defaults, Livetrack shows up on watch screen and sync up fails. Running out of ideas. Will try Garmin express. Disappointing.
Well. So here is the deal… I am an engineer and I cannot figure out how to get out of this bug. Already wasted 2 hours on this. Tried factory reset on the watch but as soon as I try to pair again with iPhone, LiveTrack starts and sync up process fails. How do we deactivate buggy livetrack? From the app only? Is it only accessible when the watch is paired? Will try to find time and contact Garmin support tomorrow. Like I said, disappointing. At this “arrogant” price point, I was expecting more robustness.
Just to clarify – was iPhone sync working and then it died once LiveTrack started, or?
I haven’t seen any issues with iPhone sync in general. On the flipside, it’s been a month or so since I tried LiveTrack on the F5. I use LiveTrack on the Edge 820 almost every every day with the same phone, fwiw, and that does still survive.
You can disable the automated live track option (if you had enabled it) on the app under device settings. It’s a manual configuration, as it doesn’t turn on automatically.
Hi Ray. Yes, I had absolutely no problem pairing my phone with the watch at first. I set up Wifi, Connect IQ apps, played with lots of functions (including activating LiveTrack)… until the watch stopped syncing up with my phone. So I ended up unpairing the watch to reinitiate the pairing process. Then, everytime I tried to pair, at the very end, of the process I would see the watch try to launch LiveTrack and the phone would say pairing process aborted or something like that. I may be wrong but it seems the LiveTrack menu only appears when a compatible watch is paired. And since I unpaired the watch I could not deactivate the function anymore. What is surprising is that even after a factory reset (powering with lap button pressed), the watch was still trying to initiate LiveTrack during the pairing process. That I did not understand. And at my third attempt at factory reset, the pairing process went through. Go figure!
Anyway, I am redownloading all the ConnectIQ apps I need again and set up all the screens again. I will keep LiveTrack active to give it a shot again and hopefully the watch will remain in a stable state. If problem comes back, I will document it better and probably make a video out of it and file a ticket.
I had an issue with Livetrack tonight as well. It worked fine yesterday, but today it would not end the session and would not let me sync my run via BT.
Finished my run and tried to sync, got a message saying it needed to end Livetrack session which I said yes to. Then I got the message ending session failed and could try again. I did that several times to no avail. I ended the session through the App on my iphone 7 and disconnected the phone and watch BT connection several times and restarted the app to reconnect. I was able to reconnect, but not sync (same message). Turned watch off and on disconnected phone and watch then repaired. Still no luck on sync. Decided to drive home and play with it at home. On the drive home I tried to turn off Livetrack on the watch itself and got the same message that it failed and asked if I wanted to try again. At that point I tried starting another activity (run) while I was still driving home. I let it run for a few stop lights then ended the activity and discarded the activity. When I pulled up to my house I checked Facebook to see if I could see the link from the Livetrack and it said the session had expired, so I tried to sync again and it finally went through.
I have a 5X with SW 2.9 and Connect app version 3.16 Livetrack was set for auto start with email and FB activity was a run
Not sure if it is normal, but Livetrack notification (saying it was active) on watch came up about .5 miles into my run and it only sent the link to one of the two email addresses I had listed.
For some reason the pairing process went through the 3rd time I tried. Will reconfigure the watch entirely tomorrow…
Any thougts about possibility of replacing straps on hrm TRI & SWIM wheh they are worn out. I have F5 an I’m thinking about hrm…
Thanks.
Garmin has dramatically afterwards changed the battery life in the ultra trac mode, now they should really provide an angled charging cable for charging on the wrist during use!
For the 5x now downwards “up to 35 hrs” (the manual still says “up to 50hrs”…).
Hi Ray,
A few folks over at /r/garmin were musing over the inadequacies of Garmin’s mobile app nowadays (subjectively ugly, complex to use, does not adhere to platform guidelines, etc…). It was also given a scathing review by the mainstream website the verge recently
Any chance Garmin is planning a make over?
Did you try setting waypoints from the watch or can that only be done from the computer first?
Hi Ray thanks as ever for all this info. I have a question I’d hoped someone on the Garmin forum would have responded to but no luck.
As I mentioned in previous posts I don’t seem to get a great signal on Fenix 5 (Ant+ and BT) and to be honest I think I preferred the bigger Fenix 3 who’s Ant+/BT signals were absolutely solid.
In honesty I’m looking to justify swapping my Fenix 5 for the 5X and there’s 2 Qs that will help me.
1. Does the 5X have a better antenna (or whatever it takes) than the Fenix 5 in terms of receiving signal from Ant+ and also to my phone (BT). Maybe not even a better antenna but is there evidence of it performing better in that regard.
2. I wouldn’t necessarily use the maps but am interested to know if the hardware / processor is better as a result of having to (ahem) process them and consequently it would likely then feel a little slicker to use.
These are the 2 questions I cannot find answers to anywhere in the universe, if anyone has a view then I’d be grateful to hear it, I read every comment on here (granted I brush over the angry people’s somewhat)
thanks, Vince.
Hi All,
Thanks for the great review, DCR, as always. Question about the FirstBeat on F5 models. I have been sifting through the comments so my apologies if this has been asked already.
If I record an activity on a different Garmin device, such as F3HR, will that transfer over to the F5 using the TrueUp through GC and be utilized in the training load calculations for FirstBeat? Or will all of the activities for FirstBeat calculations need to be done on the F5 only?
Thanks!
I have exactly the same question, would be great if the date from an Edge bike computer linked up via TrueUp. Anybody know whether this works/is planned?
I have a Fenix 5S and seeing issues syncing with GC on an iPhone 6. My previous watch was an FR235 and I experienced no issues.
Sync rarely occurs automatically and live track doesn’t stop automatically. I’m guessing there is a link. Tomorrow I will try with live track off.
The watch is connected, receives notifications etc but refuses to sync. Sometimes I can force syncs if I turn off the phone an restart it but even this doesn’t always work.
Has anyone else seen a similar issue?
I currently own a Fenix 3 HR. I wear the watch 24/7 and when the optical HR sensor kicks in in a dark room during sleep it is quite bright due to some sensor light. Since the Fenix 5 measures every second: is this sensor light visible in dark rooms and is it annoying?
If I move about and the watch is loose, I can see flickers of the sensor. But since the bump is small, I have to try and actively move my hand to see that.
In other words, doesn’t bother me at all in dark rooms.
I went from a F3hr to a F5x and the hr sensor lighting is not near as bright in the night, while sleeping, on the F5x because it does set closer to the skin and there isn’t as much illumination escaping between the watch(F5x) and the skin as with the F3hr. My wife complained about it with a couple of my fitness trackers with hr through the years, including the F3hr, but now I haven’t heard any complaints about the blinding(stimulating) light coming from my F5x in the middle of the night. lol
Ray, Thank you for your dedicated work. No review is perfect, but I find yours to be the best by far (actual workouts, complete comparisons, clear and funny writing style). Juste un petit conseil: ne te prends pas trop la tête avec certaines chaînes des commentaires; vaux mieux pas donner à manger le trll ;)
This one is for Ray fanboys:
@inaki – hah, everyone who questions Ray’s reviews is a troll now? keep feeding yourself that
@depcious – read carefully the review of F3 and you’ll see that it fared not much better, 1s / glonass and all… (also found an interesting comment he makes about the relationship between free gear and review quality… seems I’m not alone in this suspicion either!)
Yes Max I remember the poor GPS performance on the F3 and it was written about on this site but that doesn’t detract, much as you’d want it to, from the fact fellrnrs methodology is flawed. If you are trying to get the best gps track then why not turn on the two things which will get you better gps tracks. And only when asked in the comments does he mention this fact !!!
As for reviewers getting “better” kit – no shit sherlock I’d be shocked if they didn’t. If I worked for Garmin or Suunto I’d have somebody test every part of the review devices I sent out so I didn’t get slammed in a review.
And because I’m sure you’re interested as you mentioned as much before I’m getting my iPhone replaced under warranty because the GPS was so poor it overstated runs by about 10%. It wasn’t difficult and I didn’t need to moan that every iPhone 7 was shit and broken. I, as a grown up, could appreciate that sometimes these things happen and just because it happened to me (and others) doesn’t mean everything is shit.
Hi Ray
I’ve been using the Fenix 5 for a couple of days now. Unfortunately, I cannot make the OHR sensor providing me with useful information. The HR reading is completly off the chart. I tried everything – I even shaved off the hair under the watch. It didn’t help.
Check out the picture attached. I did 10min uphill intervalls and the HR does not correlate with the effort at all.
Do you have some more information on the topic?
Thanks, alex
wow.. you shaved the hair??
sorry mate, join the club, it’s useless for real exercise, look at the graph vs chest strap, i could understand some deviation under stress, but it’s actually dangerous – it just straight up lies to you…
(but beware – crowd here don’t like you questioning reviews here…)
Mine works fine. No idea why yours doesn’t. My GPS works fine as well. As doesnconnecting to my Powertap P1 powermeter pedals.
Maybe you got a faulty device – so why not take it back and get a refund or get it changed for a replacement?
Thanks for your comments.
I actually got a new watch already but the issue remained the same.
Btw, the altitude information is in meter not feet. And one Intervall lasted for about 10min as well as the subsequent recovery phase. There were no sharp pick-ups in pace or effort.
Best, alex
High intensity intervals, especially in hills, are the most difficult for optical heart rate. Before analyzing how to troubleshoot this difficult workout, can you tell us how your fenix5 behaves in an easy steady run (for example 30 minutes in a flat area with a constant pace or with a constant heart rate, for example 140 beats per minute)? If in a flat easy run it functions well, it’s a good start point.
General tips for optical HR (regardless of vendor), roughly in order of importance:
1) Ensure it’s snug (it doesn’t need to be crazy tight, just shouldn’t wiggle)
2) Ensure it’s not on wrist bone. Ideally it’s about 2-3cm up from it (towards elbow)
3) If both of those are done, consider changing wrists. I’ve definitely seen many cases where a watch works on one wrist, but not the other.
4) Try it out on the inside of your wrist, that’s technically a far better area for optical HR measurement, since it’s not as ‘hard’, so it’s easier to get a lock. Some actually prefer wearing their watches running this way anyway.
5) Also, this probably goes without saying, but ensure you have a lock (HR icon not blinking) before starting the run. If you run before that, it’s hopeless honestly.
6) Ensure you don’t have two watches side by side, with optical measurement that will impact the blood flow and often changes results (I actually just saw this in a quick fun test I did this weekend).
7) With respect to hill intervals, usually going up is no issue, since cadence is low enough it doesn’t get confused. Sometimes during recovery (going downhill), you can get oddities if the watch is loose.
For the vast majority of sensors these days, arm-hair isn’t an issue. Neither is darker skin. Sometimes it impacts things, but I haven’t seen that be the case for most people on the major sensors in a few years.
Max NS
In your HRM comparison graph there is a 1.5km difference in distance between the two…what happened there??
I just picked up a Fenix 5 Sapphire and it struggles to get a HR on my skin tone. I also got a vivosmart 3 earlier in the week and that struggles also. Both only seem to work on the inside of my wrist. Disappointing that for what ever reason this year Polar(a370) & Garmin(in my experience) released products that have serious issues on people of color.
Hi Ray,
I have a Fenix 5 Sapphire which I bought Tuesday. Love it so far. One question though – I found the broadcast HR feature, but wondered if I am also able to do an activity with the watch while broadcasting the HR?
Thanks
Assuming the software is the same as the 935, the answer is yes. Go to the heart rate widget settings. Under “Heart Rate Options,” there is an option for, “Broadcast During Activity.” It will broadcast as a HRM during any activity. I’ve been using it to broadcast to my Wahoo Bolt during rides, and it works perfectly. It definitely drains the battery more quickly, but not in an outrageous way.
Ahh yeah found it. Great thanks.
You hinted that there might be the technical possibility to implement Galileo GNSS in an future update. Do you actually, personally, think that this is going to happen someday for the F5?
Would be pretty nice :)
I am trying to decide between the Fenix 5s and 5x. I want this for every day wear and for backpacking. I’m not a runner. I’ve read you can download map routes to the 5s and also read you can’t. I like the smaller size, but also like the mapping on the 5x. Need to know how useful the mapping is on the 5s or if I am better off with a handheld gps unit or the 5x. I have never owned any garmin before. I just received the 5s saphire in mail yesterday but don’t want to open it if the 5x is the better choice.
I thought the look and size of the F5s was more to my liking as well, but I chose the F5x instead for 2 reasons. First the TOPO maps are awesome, I like to know what’s around me not just where I am in a breadcrumb path, if I want to find a or body of water or something else near by, it shows up very nicely on the maps. The second reason I chose the F5x was for battery life, which also translates into long term usability of the watch. Since the F5s only last about 8 days on a charge verses the F5x at 12 days, you’re talking 150% more time per charge. Lithium batteries can only last 500-1000 charges for it’s life, so the usable life of the F5x will be 150% longer than the F5s based on battery longevity. I’ve had dozens of rechargeable products over the years and in 90% of those products it’s the battery that goes dead (not chargeable or won’t hold a charge) before anything else. So I put my money on the F5x.
You mean the battery will last 50% longer or the battery will last 150% the length of the 5S/5? My 920 is still going strong so I see it as an excuse to but the next generation when it comes out
But more seriously, what is the map for? Follow and record a hike? 5X is good. Browsing the map to find things? probably not so good
8\12 =1.50, so depending on how you word it it can be 50% more or 150% of the F5s, as I remember it being stated in math class. Within the map app there is a search function that can search for different categories of destinations: restaurants, gas, hotels, landmarks, etc. As long as you have good eye sight or have your glasses with you, it is very readable and you can zoom in and out and move up, down, left and right on the map. It’s quite functional for it’s small size.
They were talking about backpacking. Most of the time when hiking its the scrolling around the map to find things and see where a trail leads that is important. Yes the 5X can do it but not as easily as other units.
Personally I’m hoping the Edge 1000 gets replaced at Sea Otter and the replacement has a hiking mode as that size screen with a better way to interact with the screen would be much better for hiking
Eli,
Were you suggesting that a hand held GPS such as the Sea Otter Edge 1000 would be a better choice for a backpacking GPS than the Fenix 5X? I am trying to avoid having to carry and charge multiple electronics on a 7 day Teton Mountain backpacking trip. It would be nice to have storm alerts, ABC, and know the true distance to the next camping zone. My other use for the Fenix model would be daily wear and activity tracking, but not for training and all that other golf stuff.
Big advantages of a handheld: much bigger, better screen, better antenna, many handheld models can be run off of normal AA batteries, so you don’t have to carry any electronics at all to keep it powered. Big disadvantage: you have to carry it somewhere. You can’t just strap it to your wrist (well you can, but you wouldn’t want to). Generally that’s not too bad, since you can clip it to a belt or a strap. Garmin already makes “Sea Otter Edge 1000″‘s, they have several lines of handhelds, and a lot of them pair with ANT+ sensors.
Hey Ray! Do you know if the Fenix 5S allows you to pause an activity, start and finish a new activity, and then return to the paused activity. For example, I’d like to be able to bike to work, pause that bike, go for a run after work, and then bike home and have only 2 activity entries, not 3. Thanks in advance for the info! =)
Hi Julia.
Unfortunately not. I do the same sort of thing. After a ride to work I select Resume Later but when I want to start a new activity the only option is Resume.
The only workaround is to use a different device to track your rides, I have used a Garmin Edge 800. But this method screws up the Recovery Advice and other metrics.
I just save each portion of the day and it actually looks much better on Garmin Connect and gives better results.
Hope this helps.
Good health.
Ray,
Sorry if this has been addressed before – I’ve seen a metal fenix 3 strap – I think you said this would be good for my 5x. Is that correct – thanks :)
The F3 bands do fit the F5x. I transferred my F3hr titanium band to my F5x and it fits perfectly. The metal band will be much heavier than the other options, but it will work.
I do my runs around Monceau park and so far I found my iPhone better at GPS tracking then the F5. Which is a bummer because I was expecting the opposite.
– Fenix 5 link to connect.garmin.com
– iPhone 6s (via Runkeeper) link to connect.garmin.com
You can see it gets very zigzaggy, especially around Lisbonne street.
Maybe cellular helps, I don’t know. Have you tested smartphones with F5?
That’s pretty ugly.
What’s your GPS settings on the 5? I just got my 5x and took it on a short run yesterday. I found it did okay with 1s and gps only (it thought it was set for both, but I just checked the run settings. I personally think that should be a global setting).
There was a short section where I was immediately adjacent to a building (one story) where it wandered off more than what I think was acceptable, and in a couple of turns at the beginning where it was putting me on the wrong side of the road more or less. I’m comparing to an iPhone 5s using Runmeter. The comparator tool I’m using says the 5x had 1206 points and the 5s 229 points. Nearly a thousand less data points. I don’t know how the exports work though, if any smoothing is done pre-export or if it’s complete raw data, etc.
Tomorrow I plan to do a longer trail run, we’ll see how it does. Still early spring here so no canopy in the trees yet, should be as easy as it gets for GPS on the trail.
So my first trail test on the 5x went pretty well. The course was just over 4mi, compared to an iPhone 5s there was a .11mi difference between the two viewing from 5x watch face/GC (4.15mi) and on the phone app (4.26mi, Runmeter). Nothing jumps out to me on either track as being significantly off. My gut tells me the phone was the better track, but both are acceptable.
Here is where I think things get interesting. I export out the .gpx file from my phone and the .gpx file from GC, upload to a comparitor app to overlay the tracks and the distances match (the app doesn’t accept .fit). Furthermore, if I upload the 5x .fit file to Strava distance matches the watch (4.15mi), if I upload the .gpx from GC it then matches roughly the phones distance (4.27mi).
in km:
6.676km using .fit
6.880km using .gpx
I don’t see a difference in the map tracks between the two, but I haven’t overlaid them.
It seems as though they must use different algorithms, but not sure what to make of it.
Why are there different distances for the same run and device for .gpx and the .fit file?
Attached is the comparison using .gpx files. I’ll create another post to show the .fit distance from GC.
Here is the .fit data screenshot from GC.
To summarize, depending on whether I choose the .fit or .gpx as the export file of choice for the same activity there is a noticeable difference in the calculated distance. Why?
By any chance do you have auto pause on?
Good thought Paul, but no auto pause on either unit.
To add, I have the option on the runmeter phone app for either gpx or tcx file for export. I get the same resulting track and distance for either format.
On GC, the tcx file distance matches the fit file, which are both less than the gpx file distance.
It’s obvious what’s happening is that sometimes you’re being told what the device says, and sometimes you’re being told what the GPS track says when the distance is recomputed from the track. I’ll bet if you look at the GPX file it doesn’t have a header or trailer entry for total distance, while TCX and FIT do. Garmin Connect believes whatever the device tells it, while other sites (Strava I think) always recompute the distance from the track and ignore the device. I asked about Auto Pause because that’s one way that can happen, the device mistakenly thinks you’re stopped while your still moving and so you actually add distance while the device doesn’t accumulate distance because it thinks you’re stopped. The track (unless you’re on a unusually twisty track) will give the right distance while the device won’t. If you don’t have auto pause on, though, it’s probably just yet another new device bug on the Garmin side.
Hi Scott, I am experiencing exactly the same issues. The watch reports the wrong distance in the FIT files, but if you export it to a TCX or GPX file you get the correct distance. Why am I saying its wrong, well the TCX from fenix 5 files are nearly exactly the same as the fit files from my 520, and fenix3, as well as those of fellow cyclists on the same route. I get the same errors with running files , but the discrepancy is less. It is as if the watch is calculating the wrong distance in the fit file (like a rounding error). The differences is consistently shorter, between 3-8%. I have made sure that its per second recording, and all the settings are exactly the same for all the devices. I am on all the latest versions on all devices. I did log a call with Garmin but have not had any feedback as yet. Have you had any success in resolving your issue?
Thanks for all the efforts you put in to the reviews Ray! Really enjoy reading both reviews and the more ”social” blog parts! If you ever end up in Sweden – send me a mail and I will be happy to show you around and to train with you.
With that said – here is a suggestion. Why don’t you add a testing method for the in depth reviews – run or/and bike the same route several times with all the tested devices (e.g. like fellrnr does) just to see how they behave. Then everybody can judge by themselves what they think is acceptable in terms of accuracy and consistency. All testing methods have pros and cons but I believe that this would add a dimension to the in depth reviews.
If you need assistance in running the same route I am pretty sure that you will find people willing to assist you. If you decide to take me up on the suggestion send me a mail and I will get down to Paris to assist in running the same route for a weekend. :-)
You could create a segment/segments and then we all could go there and run/bike the same route to test our devices and also compete with each other. :-) The DCR testing route.
As far as I know (haven’t tried downloading someone else’s track from Strava), no one is stopping you from doing that. Everyone who’s listed on a segment has a GPS device and a track. Choose an existing segment with lots of traffic, download all of the tracks, build a database and do whatever tests you like on it.
As for testing on just one track, suppose brand X has algorithms that are superior in cases of multipath reflections off buildings, but are lousy everywhere else, where brand Y works superbly everywhere else but is inferior in cities. If Ray tested on just one track in the city, it would falsely show that brand X is better than brand Y, where as if he tested in a variety of places and conditions as he does now, the assessment would be far more realistic. These devices aren’t used just on one track, so testing on one track can lead to false impressions.
If I had to choose inly one testing method I would go with Rays current set up so – Paul S – You are right and I agree. It would be misleading with a one route test. However, my point is to ADD a standard route test to what he does today.
I guess it would be possible to find a route with both buildings, open space and some trees – pretty much as many of us usually run.
A bit like the standard European Driving Cycle. Everybody knows that it is close to impossible to reach the same fuel consumption in real life driving but still it adds something to have a standard cycle used for testing of all new cars.
I would like to sound creative and not negative towards todays methodology and certainly not as negative as some of the guys/comments above but rather the other way around.
I guess it would extend the idea to other places than France/Paris. Ray could ask some guys to test in different parts o the world – running standard routes in different places with different devices. If asked I would consider to be the Scandinavian guy. :-)
In most cases, the challenge is more logistical than desirability.
With unlimited units and time (and people) I could devise many interesting tests. But units actually is really the limiting factor, at least early on in a product cycle. I usually only have 1-2 copies of each unit, and if it’s two copies, one is often a beta/pre-prod device where I wouldn’t want to base accuracy portions of the review on it.
The other problem is that in watching other people do standardized accuracy tests, most screw it up (I mean that in the nicest possible way). Rarely on purpose, but just on accident. Forgetting to switch from smart recording to 1-second. Or not having GLONASS in equal settings on all units. Or just using the wrong software. Or forgetting to start with full satellite, etc… Putting units directly next to each other (bad), and so on…
Much of that could be resolved via checklists and so forth, but it’s tricky to get others on the same page. I keep meaning to finish a ‘how I do accuracy testing’ post for both GPS and power meters. There’s a lot of nuances that aren’t necessarily apparent to the casual observer, while I suspect many commentators here pick-up on them quickly or already know them. Someday…
I agree it might be logistically difficult to get a broader sample of GPS readings for a better overall performance picture of the watches.
However, for oHR readings it would be sufficient to find one or two people in your circle who struggles to get good readings and post their results too. I think many people (including me) have/had unrealistic expectations of oHR based on the graphs you post(ed) in your reviews, because the technology seems to work very well on your wrists.
Hello,
First of all, thank you very much for the reviews ! So much details ! ? I have a Fenix 5S (a recent gift !) and I have a few long hikes planned. I tried different settings to try and find the best options to save battery life and ensure it would last for the entire hike which could be up to 11 hours. The specs say it would last 14hours with wrist HR and normal GPS but on recent runs I found that it was using up to 10-15% of battery per hour. I tried to use a chest HR instead of wrist HR but it got worse… I tried ultratac but it failed miserably (better at battery but no GPS position for several hours!!!). I turned off the phone connection. What would be your recommendation to get a good GPS route and still save batteries? Thanks a lot ! Laurence
You should actually try running it 11 hours and see what happens. The battery indicator isn’t linear (you can’t extrapolate) and isn’t always correct. I have 2 Garmin watches, the original Fenix and an Epix, and both have no problems going 11 hours. (But of course, neither has optical HR). Garmin specs are usually wrong, but the indicator may be misleading you, too.
First, you’re the best! The best site out there for real reviews!
Question – I’ve been using the Fenix 5x for the past 2 weeks or so and wonder if anyone else has run into this problem. It will notify me I’m approaching a starve segment while running or biking and if I don’t continue on the segment it continue to re-route me to the segment. If I then go to the navigation menu and stop navigation to stop the re-routing to the segment I feel like it then stop notifying me of upcoming segments. What should I do if I don’t state on the segment?
Interesting. My experience is if I deviate from approaching the segment I immediately get a notification that I’m off segment. It will sometimes remind me that I’m approaching but after I’m about 200 ft and counting from the segment start i don’t get that reminder anymore. So hat translates into a notification of approaching segment and then if I don’t take that turn I might get one or two more reminders and then that’s it. A little annoying but not awful. I have the F5. I thought it would only notify me of starred segments in strava, but it’s showing me all of them. I haven’t found a setting to only show starred either.
I just noticed after a run this weekend that when the “approaching segment” notification countdown comes up, it has the option to press the down button to dismiss. I used that several times and it was perfect for when you’re approaching a segment but not going to take it. Or if you just don’t want to see stats for that particular segment. Hope that helps!
Been using the fenix 5 at the pool this week. Working perfectly at counting the laps. No single lap missed. I also really like the optional 3s second countdown before each interval that I believe was not present on the 735XT. Also set an alert every 4 lengths to help me keep track of where I am in the set without looking at the watch and I am happy to see that it resets at each interval. Well done!
Now, it’s the first time I own a watch with a barometer and I noticed what I believe is a bug but please let me know if I am wrong. Here it is: Everytime I get out of the pool, the barometer is ~70 mbar higher and altitude ~500 m higher. This is normal since the watch was immersed but what I do not get is that it stays in this state after I get out of the pool (even hours afterwards) until I recalibrate the altitude (manually or via GPS) in which case both the altimeter and barometer goes back to normal values. I do not understand why the pressure changes when calibrating altitude. That does not look right at all. What’s other people experience with other watches?
I know there are some Ant+ issues with Shimano Di2. However I just upgraded from a Fenix 3 and I cannot connect the Fenix 5 to either of my Shimano Di2’s…. Both bikes have the most current d-fly’s, the cylindrical Ant+/Bluetooth version. I was able to connect all other sensors (and I have tons) to the Fenix 5, but neither bike. The bikes connect to my Edge 1000 no problem. Does anyone know if this is a known issue?
PB
@DC Rainmaker
I am a proud new owner of Garmin Fenix 5. Your article really helped me decide.
Yesterday I did roughly 11,000 steps but today syncing wirelessly or wired steps show roughly 7000 steps. I tried garmin express and I tried garmin connect. Same results. Watch shows yesterday at 10k steps. Any advice here?
Yes and I also created a garmin ticket. I see other forum posts where step counts are off by 25% since 2015 in many cases. Nobody posted the solution so I’m still on the hunt here.
Amazon UK is selling the “regular” Fenix 5 at £439, if anyone’s interested.
Great price and good spot, if you are looking to catch the best price on Amazon I can recommend https://uk.camelcamelcamel.com to get price alerts before things like this sell out.
Shame it wasn’t the 5X ;)
Is there any update on the Stryd / Fenix 5 issue? am considering getting one and would like to know if there would be any issues…
@Steffen What issue is that?
As Ray mentioned in his review, the Stryd apparently has trouble keeping the connection with the Fenix 5. i.e. frequent drop-outs. Read on Garmin Forum that other people also have this problem. With the 5X apparently things are fine…
Not sure specifically about the Stryd, but many are reporting decreased sensor dropout with beta firmware 2.96.
Hey Ray,
Thanks for the review as always – you are amazing!
I am at the Boston Marathon Expo and the Garmin rep said the Fenix 5 should fit the bike mount of the Forerunner 935.
Do you think this is true?
Has anyone tested this?
Thanks!
To be clear, I was referring to the Quick Release kit for Triathlon (for wrist and for bike handlebar/zerobar), NOT just the bike mount part #010-11029-00.
I’ve asked this question as well. If it is in fact the case that the Quick Release Kit for the FR935 (010-11251-0S) will work with the Fenix 5 (22mm bands) then the Fenix 5X and 5S still needs some kind of quick release.
I’ve ordered the Fenix 5 upgrading from the FR920XT, but the quick release kit is a deal breaker, no way I’ll do ironman without the quarter turn system from swim to bike and then to run.
I’ve posted this on the Garmin forum and I’m hoping someone here might be able to help me. My watch crashes when I do the commands below —
Start button
–> Navigate
–> Courses
–> Select a course
–> Do course (but do not “start” course with the “start button”)
–> Press the down button a few times to scroll through the data fields
Hold the menu button
–> Navigate settings
–> Data screens
–> Down button a few times
Back button repeatedly until I got back to the watch face
Down button a few times to scroll through the widgets and then the back button to go back to the watch face
This usually results in the watch face showing the second hand moving as normal but the buttons cease to do anything. If it doesn’t crash by that point, I can open the “save location” app and exit it, then open the “walk app” and exit it, then repeat the above with the navigation app, wait five minutes and it’ll always crash shortly after.
I’ve already reset the watch once.
The watch does not seem to crash if I load a round-trip course or I set the watch to create a course based on a given location. The crashing only seems to occur with imported courses.
I’ve been waiting since around June of last year to get my first garmin watch. I’ve had the original TomTom cardio HR for a couple years. I was hesitant on the fenix 3HR because I felt like the form factor was a couple years old already since it didn’t change from the F3. When garmin announced the F5 and F5X I started again one over which model to buy. I ended up going with the F5 for the more compact package and after a couple weeks I absolutely love it. My brother bought the F5X and I totally have map envy, the maps for trail running or hiking are really really cool. But for 95% of my use cases I don’t need maps so I went smaller. If they figure out how to put maps in the F5 casing next year I’ll probably upgrade again, but for now it’s fantastic. I love the sleep tracking data, steps, all day HR, Strava love segments are so awesome I’m totally chasing some KOMs, I’ve had great swims with it and I look forward to mountain biking with it and skiing next winter. I got the sapphire glass black on black and before I bought it I was bummed I couldn’t get the silver gray bezel without buying the expensive metal hand. But now that I have it the black on black is super cool. It reminds me of a military tactical watch or something. The styling is awesome. It looks super close to “normal” for a bigger sized watch, whereas with my brothers F5X I feel like it just looks and feels slightly uncomfortably big. But the maps are awesome if you want them.
Is anyone on the fence about the F5 vs. the 935? I have ruled out the F5S due to the short straps that I do not believe would fit my wrists. The F5 has that look of a real watch and looks great. For me, the weight is the concern. I tried the F3 HR and it was too much for me. The F5 is smaller, but not by much. The 935 has it all, but looks a bit plasticky though. Did you have the same concern over the bulk of the F5 and how did you decide on it?
John, I have the Fenix 5, and I’m facing a similar question of F5 vs 935. I ordered a 935 and will be comparing the two. I love the look of the Fenix 5, the weight is noticeable, but not a deal breaker for me. What I’m more concerned with are the GPS tracks and pace accuracy and consistency of the 2 watches. My Fenix 5 is not giving bad data (GPS track and pace), but it’s not as good as I was expecting (coming from the 920).
Based on the 935 and Fenix 5 forums, early reviews seems to indicate the 935 performing in terms of GPS track accuracy and pace stability, and I’ll be putting the units head to head here in the coming days.
There is another point to consider, the software that runs on the devices. Currently the 935 is a plastic F5 but it is unknown if that will continue. If the F5 follows the pattern of the F3 there will be features added in down the line that the F5 doesn’t have now. Will those features also be added to the 935? Its unknown.
(Not saying everyone cares about future possible functionality)
link to forums.garmin.com
Thanks for the feedback Chris. Eli also raises a good point. F5 will likely receive all of the updates as that is the crown jewel of the Garmin lineup.
Another related thread… Fenix 5 Conversion Club
link to forums.garmin.com
Ray, thanks as always for the exceptionally in-depth review. I’ve had the Fenix 5, which I am hoping can replace both my Vivoactive and Edge 520, for about 6 days now, during which I’ve worn it basically 24/7 and for an HIIT treadmill workout, an intensive spin class, a 10-mile hilly trail run, and a 42 mile road bike ride. I’m having some difficulties with the ORH. In addition to some of the expected issue flagged in Ray’s various reviews of Garmin OHR watches, such as difficulties tracking sharp intervals and some issues with road cycling, I’m finding random spikiness and unreasonably high readings in what should be less challenging situations. This morning I recorded my normal morning walk to work as an activity and uploaded to Strava. This was a downhill walk at a pretty constant pace. I have a pretty low RHR, and I believe that my HR during this walk is typically in the 70-90 range. The HR graph shows several sharp spikes, into the 120’s with gradual declines. There is no way my HR ever got that high and the shape of the graph is entirely implausible.
Any thoughts about what could be causing this or how it might be addressed?
Hi CMP,
I have exactly the same issue! I’ve had the Fenix 5 (Sapphire edition) for almost 2 weeks now and everytime I go out for a run HR wrist is showing approx 30+ beats. Yesterday decided to go to the local Garmin vendor and they informed me to wait for 3-4 weeks more cause Garmin might issue updates which might solve the problem. They guided me to run with the chest strap for now. I used my old HR chest monitor this morning and Fenix 5 mapped out correctly my HR data.
One of the main reasons I bought the Fenix 5 was cause of its optical wrist HR!!
Marvin
Hi,
Any recommendations which one to prefer:
Fenix 5 without WiFi or Fenix Forerunner 935 with Wifi and plastic body?
Currently several people return their Fenix 5 in order to replace it with a 935 because of GPS issues (very erratic instance pace and sick-zack GPS routes).
Saying that I still own my Fenix 5 saphir and I’m ok with the GPS.It has it flaws (compared to other GPS watches that I own [several Garmins and a Suunto Ambit2]) But for distance and basic tracking it’s still ok for me.
So if GPS is an issue for you, maybe something to consider.
I can only speak from my experience with the F5x. The GPS is about average in my estimation, but I take a route that gives GPS some challenges, no matter the product. About a mile of my route being at the base of an 80 foot cliff, which leaves 1/2 of satellite views blinded. Another 3 to 4 miles is under heavy vegetation(tree foliage). In GPS + Glonass sometimes I get a zip-zag on the mappoing, but the mileage is always right on. With UltraTrac, the mileage is off by 7-8%, but with the challenging satellite views. The HR monitor is the best I’ve experienced for wrist based HR. I’ve owned about half a dozen wrist HR monitors, in including the F3hr and the F5x works well for my wrist as long as I have it snug enough. Some others have had issues, but that ‘s common as I understand it with different skin types, wrist size and shapes and so forth. The best thing to do is buy it from a place with an easy return policy so you can at least try it out for yourself.
I’m using the Fenix 5 since the release day and I really like it.
In particular I’m really satisfied with the new Training Load function that seems to pair well with my traning program.
The only problem is that I don’t like to use the Fenix as my main bike instrument. I prefer a bike computer which is easy to mangae during bike runs expecially if you are on a triathlon bike.
Donig so I loose all the Training Load informations of my bike rides and so my profile isn’t as complete as it could be.
I know I can use both the Fenix and the Edge 820 at the same time but I already know I will usually forget of pushing the buttons on both!
I’m wondering why Garmin hasn’t already implemented a function to use both instruments in a kind of syncro mode, so that you could have both instruments display the same data and set laps just pressing the button on one of the two instruments.
At the end they already has the Varia Visor that is doing quite the same…
Hi,
I have been using Garmin 235 and thinking about moving to Fenix 3 HR or 5. Just wonder for heart rate accuracy is there any improvements (especially Spikes) of Fenix 5 over Fenix 3 as the comparison with Fenix 3 using heart rate strap? If none, I will be moving up to Fenix 3 HR instead for better value.
I had the same thought as you but the Fenix 3HR hasn’t dropped as much in price yet as the Fenix 3 plain (which can be had for as low as 270$ refurbished these days).
Additionally, despite its young age, Garmin stopped software development for the Fenix 3HR (and FR630). This means the Fenix 3HR will probably never be compatible with newer gear like the RD Pod, nor will it ever support IQ2.x+ apps.
That convinced me to pony up a little more for the F5.
I do have to say that oHR just doesn’t work for me (haven’t had a single run without issues), while for many other people apparently it’s great. I read a post by a guy on the Garmin forum saying upon complaining a dealer told him to sit tight for a firmware release that is coming which supposedly would improve oHR on the F5, no idea if there’s any truth in that.
I haven’t’ used the 235, but I have used an HR strap with several devices and also owned a F3hr and how have a F5x. I can give you a comparison between those. Of course, the HR strap is the most accurate of the three, although it’s not perfect either, especially during warm ups at first picking up on HR. The F3hr has only about 75-80 % the accuracy of the HR strap and does suffer from spikes on HR data from time to time. The F5x is about 95% accurate and I haven’t had a problem with spikes showing up on HR data. The F5x is not as sensitive in my experience with how it sets on your wrist as the F3hr was. It doesn’t seem to lose consistency when there isn’t a good wrist connection. If there is no connection at all, it just leaves the data blank, it doesn’t try and fill in the blanks. The only time I’ve had it leave data blank is when the band is too loose or I take the watch off my wrist. The F5x is about as accurate and consistent as you’re going to get with a wrist HR monitor. For my purposes, it’s about as good as it gets, but I try not to be a perfectionist either, even though I want good consistent data.
Here are some examples of the oHR problems I’ve had with the F5:
link to forums.garmin.com
I’m seeing heart rate spikes and, in particular, heart rate getting exceptionally high towards the end of runs. I’ve seen some professional reviews where they were sent new hardware than then provided better oHR results and others recommending waiting for firmware.
Any good advice on whether to push Garmin for a new device or just wait?
Question for those with Cycling Power Meter:
When setting up power meter sensor, is there option to enable auto calibration prompt (as would be in Edge series?) This is one feature solely lacking in Fenix 3HR right now and very annoying to go through hoops of menu. Might be tipping point for me to upgrade… (another reason being size)
Hi Ray.
I created a 120 mile course on Garmin Connect and sent it to my Fenix 5.
I selected do course. It then said 50 course point max. exceeded. Final 83 points will not be shown.
When creating courses I usually have the settings set to keep on roads.
I didn’t know of this limitation. Do you have any tips besides splitting my ride into multiple courses.
Fortunately I had the same course loaded onto my Edge 800.
I notified 2 problems:
1) there is not possibility to activate /deactivate data pages. Once you create a page you have to keep it for each training session (you cannot deactivate it) you can only delete it if you do not wont the page for a specific session.
2) F5 does not pair with power meter Stages (Ultegra)
Ouch on not pairing up. Have you tried resetting stages? I’ve had stages having that with Garmin 520 while back when I had it too. Not sure if you have other power meter that pairs up… but if you do, can you tell me if you have option to enable calibration prompt for power meter?
I change the battery to the stage and downolad the last firmware.
IT DOES NOT WORKS :-(
(it works perfectly with my 920xt)
How can I reset stages?
Hi. Had an interesting issue this morning on my 1 week old Fenix5X and wondered if anyone else had seen it. I woke up and watch all seemed fine. 4 hour HR was showing a pretty normal looking track while I had been asleep. I synched it with garmin connect after I woke up and Garmin didn’t have any sleep data and it seems to show that my HR locked at a 105 at 9:30pm last night and just shows a flat line right through and “bizarrely” is currently showing a flat line all the way through until almost 4pm today (it is currently 6:55am). I have synched multiple times but nothing changes. I did a basic restart on the watch (not a full reset) and when it came back up the 4 hour HR graph was empty (not sure if this is normal behavior or not as I have never restarted it before). It is synching to my phone however because it seems to have already synched into the future the data is not overwriting it seems. One thing that implies it has some idea what the data really was is that the HR range stated in the connect app screen is “45-105” but all it shows is a flat line at 105.
No sleep data synched and it seems like all the real activity data is lost…or it is at garmin and something has gone wrong on connect.
Screenshot of my gamin connect app for today (at 6:55am) is attached. As you can see it is saying that it already has data until almost 4pm…
Anyone else seen this? Any ideas? Is there a better to way to handle when this happens so you don’t lose the data? Perhaps I shouldn’t have restarted the watch?
Is there any way to delete the activity tracking data from Garmin connect? I can’t seem to find a way to do this for activity tracking.
Tks
Dan
My Fenix 5 arrived today. I’m surprised. There is no watchface wich includes the hour of the day and the heart rate. Is it too simple, there are the two datas i need the most of the time. Do i miss something ?
You can download watch faces from Connect IQ in GC, sync and personalise them. You might like the “A2” watch face I’m using.
Hi. Is this the original silver bezel (with granite blue strap) and you’ve fitted a black band fitted instead?
Unplugged 5x today and it started a live track session while not in an activity, hadn’t seen this prior to 2.90. Anyone else notice it?
Hi.
Is this the fenix 5 with silver bezel which you have fitted black band instead of the original granite blue?
Looks pretty cool.
Thanks
hi ray,
I recently bought fenix 5 as an upgrade from my previous 920XT. I am interested in additional Firstbeat feature called Performance Condition. Do you think this feature also takes elevation into its algorithm? I cannot find any explanation on this, so I don’t know for sure wheather it may yield into incorrect calculation if we use it for uphill running for instance (indicate we are more somewhat “exhausted’ compared to flat terrain run)
link to firstbeat.com
And:
link to forums.garmin.com
Dear Ray,
Many thanks for your work – I love those reviews … great help in the battle raging in my head (and heart) at the moment – whether to replace my Suunto Ambit by the Garmin Fenix 5 Saphire or the Suunto Spartan Wrist HR.
I very much would like to get rid of my heart rate belt (for most activities), and the bottom line for me seems to be that the Garmin product has advantages when it comes to overall features (not so important to me) and GPS accuracy (quite important), whereas the Suunto probably offers the most valid heart rate measurement (the reason to retire my Ambit in the first place).
Now for my question: I possibly found something that is not covered in your review … :-) Don’t think me ungrateful, but may be you have information on this that would also be of interest to others.
When the glass of my FR305XT shattered after intensive contact with Austrian rock and I asked Garmin for repairs, they offered a new FR305 at a reduced price. I am no friend of this throw-away mentality, and, in contrast, I was able to get a full range of repairs from Suunto: Glass/bezel, wristband, battery. All on short notice and at reasonable prices, also for older products like a 2001 Suunto Vector. I like that.
Do you have any information on the support for the Fenix 5 (3) with regard to battery, bezel etc.?
Many thanks again … Pleas keep it up!
Tarek
Salzburg, Austria
I’ve wondered too if this device line is meant to be more serviceable given the screws on the front and back. If so, that’s a very nice plus versus the Forerunner NNNxt line.
Is it possible to download streetmaps on the fenix 5?
Thank you.
Not the 5. Only the 5X.
I upgraded from Forerunner 235 to Fenix 5 — essentially to get more battery life: I don’t do a lot of workout, but I walk a lot to stay reasonably healthy, typically 20-35 km in cities and in the country side in the course of a 12-14 hour day. In between: lots of breaks in cafes, etc., while reading, taking photos, etc.
—
So far, I’m disappointed! In many ways, the Forerunner 235 worked better, and I don’t understand some of the Garmin design choices…
* With Forerunner 235, I could pause the GPS logging, and after some 2 minutes, the watch went into hibernation and turned off GPS. When I resumed, the logging continued on the same leg.
* With Fenix 5 (I have set up the Fenix 5 with activity “Walking” while the Forerunner 235 was set up with “Running”), the clock does *not* go into hibernation — at least not for quite some time!
* With Fenix 5, after some time (5 minutes, or is it more?), instead the paused watch starts to count down towards Auto Save! Why? This is insane (to me!), I want to decide myself when to save the activity. What is worse, if I allow for auto save to complete, when I resume, a totally new, independent activity starts.
* If I touch the up-down arrows during count down to auto save, auto save stops. But it seems like the log is terminated and a new log is initiated — even though the km (or mile, if you will) counter is not reset. And after 30 minutes or so, count down to auto save starts again…
* When I pause, I can choose Resume Later. But this also creates a new log — just like the above case.
* When I import a walk into Connect which has been “resumed later” or where I have stopped/delayed auto save by hitting the up-down keys, it seems like the total length of the activity is shown, but the map only shows the *first* leg, i.e., until I paused the watch.
* Because there is no real hibernation (like after 2 minutes for the Forerunner 235), the Fenix 5 “burns” battery, and it certainly does not last as long as I have expected.
Questions:
1. Is my problem due to my choice of “walking” instead of “running” as activity? If not,…
2. Is there a way to change settings so that I can get rid of this stupid “auto save”?
3. Is there a way to change settings so that I can pause the activity, and resume in a proper way while keeping the same log — so that I can view the track of the *entire* activity in Connect?
4. Is there a way to change settings so that the watch can hibernate the GPS system after, say, 2 minutes — just like it works on the Forerunner 235? And not after 1 hour or so…
To me, the possibility to see the entire track in the map is a big motivating factor for my walks.
I understand that I’m not a typical/important type of customer for the Fenix 5, but still — the choices by Garmin makes no sense to me.
Try link to www8.garmin.com not got mine yet but this should help
Hi,
Thanks for the detailed review. Just a question. Have you ever tried out Polar’s training load function? If so where can I find the review? Can you do a quick compare between the two?
Thank you,
My HR seems to be a bit more that slightly out when cycling.
Run today, moderate pace, all well. Average of 140bpm, tops out at about 160.
Cycle ride yesterday of 80 miles, good pace, 1800m climbing including some Cat 4’s, average rate of 80bpm, max of 120. I’m not Indurain!
TT on Friday. 10 miles, 23 mph, average of 77, top of 125. Hmm.
So I’ve updated to 2.95 today to see what difference it makes. I don’t mind being slightly out but it seems consistently way off.
I am just getting to know with my new Fenix 5.
Could anyone help me please to find the menu item from Ray’s review showing: “Also, the Fenix 5 can record HRV data from an HR strap to the activity files” It is the image # 107.
Thanks in advance.
Long press the “UP” key.
Select “Settings”.
Select “Physiological Metrics”.
Select “Log HRV” to turn it on or off.
Thanks a lot Phil,
Great help! (I though I need to look it in the Running menu.)
… So many features, hard to find my way along them …
Im really wantingto get the fenix 5 but i cant decide on wether to get the 5 or the 5x, could anyone hear give me any more advice on here whos got one, as i cant seem to get y hands on a 5x yet to compare them.
thanks in advance
I got the F5x and the decision for me was really between the F5s and the F5x, since the F5 and the F5x are only 4mm and 10g in size difference, I’d just as well have the Topo maps of the F5x with that small amount of difference. The other thing that swayed me was the F5x uses the same size bands as the F3hr, which I owned also and had a titanium band that I transferred to the F5x(see picture). The reason I was deciding between the F5s and the F5x is about a smaller stylish look of the F5s for everyday wear, which was my plan in replacing my 30+ year old well made watch that I wore everyday. But I decided to go for function of the F5x over the style of the F5s mainly because the battery life was so much different as well as screen size with no increase in pixel density. So it came down to function over style in my case. For me personally the size difference between the F5 and the F5x was minimal, for the availability of the Topo maps.
What can you say about endless pool swimming with the fenix 5? How it works? what is the best option. Indoor vs. outdoor EP sessions.
There aren’t any swim watches I’m aware of that track distance in an endless pool. Unfortunately no good options there.
Thank you for that reply, most helpful, I think as soon as I can get hold of one I’ll go for the 5x and try to find a metal strap for it. And I must apologise for the poor spelling in my post I didn’t read it through properly.
For a different perspective: I found that the size difference between the F5 and F5x felt rather substantial on the wrist. While for me (rather thin wrists) the F5 pushes the limit of what seems like an acceptably sized everyday watch, but the F5x is definitely beyond it. I originally intended to get the F5s, but after trying on the F5 decided that it actually looks pretty good and therefore opted for the slightly better screen resolution and longer battery life of the F5. Of course, if you need mapping, the 5x is the only choice.
Anyone knows what’s the battery capacity of the fenix 5? I can’t it anywhere. If it’s only 300 mah like the Fenix 3 HR, I’m now worried about the battery life that much because during a multi-day hike I can recharge it more than ten times with my usb powerbank.
I looked for that everywhere as well and could not find any mention or confirmation of battery size. My guess is it’s the same 300 mah as the F3. From what I gather, Garmin is hoping to get more out of the 300 mah with more efficient firmware and software applications. I assume that will be an ongoing process.
Actual battery capacity is pretty much irrelevant because capacity combined with draw is what determines life. If the electronics in the F5 are more efficient than the F3, then you don’t need a larger battery.
Assuming that Garmin measures battery life consistently across devices, the comparative life numbers are all you need.
Hi DCR
Have you found a way to turn off the POI symbols on the Fenix 5X .
There are so many POI symbols around I can’t see the map itself.
Attached is a picture.
As I recall, it seems there is a detail adjustment you can make on the Topo maps for the most detail, average detail and less detail. I’m not sure if that effects that data on the POI, but it’s worth a try.
Hi!
Thanks for this great review! I really thinking about 5 & 5X choice. In fact, I’m not really sure about 5X mapping capabilities are so stunning to spend so much.
What about your advices guys?
Hi. I had the same thought before going for the 5. It’s smaller, nearly flush hr (makes a comfort difference). Better screen. But best thing for me is the running first beat status. It’s great. Also, future proofed through connect iq2.2 (which fenix doesn’t have). One I haven to tried is training peaks Integration for better structured workouts.
Thanks
Matt
Hey dcrainmaker,
I have a hard time deciding whether to get the Fenix 3 HR for $649AUD or the Fenix 5 for $799.
I mainly use it for simple hiking, running and day to day activities. I cycle as well but I use the Garmin520 on my bicycle.
Can you give me some advise? :)
Before buying the F5 I looked into this too.
I think the Fenix 3HR hasn’t come down enough in price to justify it as a worthy alternative, consider that refurbished F3s (without wrist HR) can be had for 270$ these days.
Another thing to consider is that software development for Fenix 3HR has basically stopped. New watch Apps/faces/data fields in IQ2.x+ are not supported and newer accessories like the RD Pod don’t work on the F3HR either. I’d pony up a little extra for the F5.
Anyone seeing this issue with Stages connecting to their Fenix 5 with Bluetooth? …
Because my Stages Power Meter (running latest firmware) ANT+ signal is so weak with my new Fenix 5S I find ANT+ unusable with nearly 95%+ dropouts when in riding position. If this is the fault of Stages for a weak signal or Fenix 5S for having a less sensitive antenna compared to my past Garmin products I don’t know. I haven’t had a problem connecting the ANT+ to my Garmin Edge 820 and the Bluetooth to my Fenix 5S however. When both devices record the same ride the recorded power and cadence values in the respective devices look nearly identical however when viewing the ride in Garmin Connect the ride with my Fenix 5S (using Bluetooth) shows accurate values recorded for cadence/rpm but then an average cadence value nearly DOUBLE the real cadence value. This is causing the estimated calorie burn to also more than double. Also I have attempted to calibrate my Stages before a ride and your iPhone app shows the calibration as “899” the Edge 820 shows the calibration as “900” and my Fenix 5S shows the calibration as “899” using ANT+ (which is then unusable if I ride) or “0” if I use Bluetooth. Despite this the actual recorded values for Power look nearly identical between ANT+ and Bluetooth? Is this normal?
Here are two examples using a leisure ride where I wasn’t trying to put out big power values…
Fenix 5S using 2.90 firmware
Stages using 2.0.82 firmware
Fenix 5S PROBLEMS (Stages Bluetooth): link to connect.garmin.com
Edge 820 CORRECT (Stages ANT+): link to connect.garmin.com
Anyone have any wonky values with Stages and Bluetooth? Thanks!
Hey David I was having exactly those issues and whilst general opinion was the problem was the stages it turned out it was a mixture of stages and Fenix, I had the Fenix 3 before it and that was perfect. I also disconnected Garmin Connect from myfitnesspal due to the ridiculous kcalories it was churning out.
I never did get the Fenix 5 to connect to the Stages using Ant+ and BT was also hit and miss in the end I sent my watch back to Wiggle as unfit for purpose.
I then bought the Fenix 5X as I was curious that the bigger Fenix 3 worked fine, lo and behold I haven’t had any issues with the 5X (if you don’t count the GPS issues – see link)
link to connect.garmin.com
To be honest I was hoping it wasn’t just me (again) Vince.
Same problem :-(
That makes me nervous Vince. So question… when you say your Fenix 5X works with Stages are you talking ANT+ or Bluetooth? If you are talking about ANT+ perhaps it’s because the larger 5X has a better Fenix 3 style antenna that picks up the ANT+ signal better … BUT if even Stages Bluetooth is properly parsing cadence and the 5/5S isn’t… woah. I’m hoping this is a firmware/software error in way Garmin is parsing the left only data via Bluetooth but if it’s hardware that would *suck*.
Also a sign of hope for a fix… although the watch and Garmin Conmect are doubling the true average cadence and calories when paired to Strava the file is parsed correctly and shows the proper cadence and calories. I truly think this is a software or firmware issue so the real question is does Garmin or Stages have the ability to quickly fix this since it’s a bit niche.
GOOD NEWS… the 2.96 firmware beta APPEARS TO HAVE FIXED THIS. Cadence average and calories are identical/near identical on ANT+ vs. BTLE on a very, very short test ride this morning using my two devices (Edge 820 & Fenix 5S). This fix wasn’t listed in beta notes but there was an update to the ANT/BTLE stack in the beta. There is still a tendancy to “smooth” or be less responsive to change via BTLE so you see some lag when you stop pedaling etc. but the differences vs. ANT+ are fairly minimal. I didn’t check to see if there is still an issue with calibration via BTLE reading an odd offset, as my wattage is a bit difference BTLE vs. ANT.
Here is an example using the beta firmware:
5S: link to connect.garmin.com
Edge 820:link to connect.garmin.com
This is probably a dumb question but with the 5x – I can create a “Round Trip” course and it let’s me select my activity type – but if I create and upload a course, how do I do that course as a “Run”? I’ve tried several different ways and they all come back as “Other” for Activity Type.
Thanks in advance!
I figured it out – it’s weird but you have to start the timer for running – stop the timer and then go into navigation and select a course – seems totally backwards – but that worked.
Hello DCR, nice and longgggg review, thanks.
Is there a way to turn off POI symbols on the 5X ?
Where I live, there are so many POI’s and because of their symbols , I can’t see the roads, streets anymore as the roads are fully covered with POI symbols.
Is there a way to turn off these symbols ?
Thank you
I have some questions about the 5x and it’s maps/route creation.
1. The review says I can select a POI near me and it will create a route to it, but can I program it to create a route to my home from another location? Or would I need to select a POI near my home? If so, does the POI need to be within a certain range for it to be selected? (eg. my home is 10km away but it only shows POI’s within a 1km/5km range).
2. When it creates a route, does it use popular Garmin/Strava segments or is it more a random choice of roads/paths/trails?
3. I’ve noticed when creating routes on Garmin Connect, it doesn’t have all the trails (Hong Kong), but Strava does. Are the maps similar to those on Garmin Connect or are the TOPO maps different to this and have more details?
4. The review said you can select a direction you want the route to go, but can you select an elevation as well?
5. For people that have used this feature, do you really think it is worth it?
What About Mud??
Does anyone anyone tested it ? Does the watch survive?
I do spartan races.
The tiny hole at the side of the watch which holds barometer/thermometer will get stucked with mud. I would never use this device for that.
Tkz for the advice..
does anyone recomend with one Mud resistance??
Hi There,
I like the tests and the results. I’m still using a 310XT and love it to bits (Even its glitchy connectivity and sometimes slow startups!!) Its a reliable machine and has served me well over the years running, cycling, swimming, surfing, windsurfing and snowboarding. Ihave fitted the quick release strap which means it mounts nice on the bike!!
So, my question is now I am thinking of upgrading do I go for a Fenix3HR at reduced price or shell out the extra on a 5? and if so which one?? I’m keen to get the better downloading via phone but think I will get that either way. I think i’d also use the Optical HR quite a lot but both do that too if you buy the right options. Arguably the Fenix3HR looks better bang for your buck with the 5 adding some functionality that I probably wont miss if i’ve not had before??
Comments or guidance welcomed….
It’s several days that my Fenix 5 barometer shows only —-.-.
Is it that normal? If not, does anybody knows how I can I fix it? I have tried an altimeter calibration but that doesn’t change the barometer setting…
I wanted to buy one of these from Garmin’s website – but their website says it’s not available yet.
But people are obviously buying them; they’re advertised as available on Amazon and at REI (tho’ REI says they only have them at their New York store and at one store in Alaska – go figure).
Why would Amazon and REI have them, but not Garmin themselves?
– Tim
Garmin.com orders for whatever reason have always been behind everyone else. In theory it’s to keep the playing field more even for retailers. It’s been this way for years.
Huh – so odd.
I tried to order one from REI, but it immediately went to “Back Ordered”.
I called REI, and they told me that that was because they only had stock in their Alaska store, and since the device contains a battery, it has to be shipped ground. And they don’t ship ground from Alaska. So complex.
I’ll wait awhile until they are more generally available I guess.
– Tim
Best Buy.com has almost every model in stock. Ships same day. Crazy, huh?
Regarding the GPS signal strength: you can read out the GPS signal strength every second in a datafield. I did this and included it in my datafield (YARF) in two ways:
1. You can visualize the signal strength live during your workout by activating it in the YARF’s settings. By doing so, the signal strength is shown live as a ring similar to garmin’s initial GPS fix.
2. Independently of the setting above the GPS strength is written to the fit file and can be analyzed in Garmin Connect afterwards.
The read signal strength is one out of 5 values:
QUALITY_NOT_AVAILABLE = 0 -> the ring is gray
GPS is not available
QUALITY_LAST_KNOWN = 1 -> the ring is blue
The Location is based on the last known GPS fix.
QUALITY_POOR = 2 -> the ring is red
The Location was calculated with a poor GPS fix. Only a 2-D GPS fix is available, likely due to a limited number of tracked satellites.
QUALITY_USABLE = 3 -> the ring is yellow
The Location was calculated with a usable GPS fix. A 3-D GPS fix is available, with marginal HDOP (horizontal dilution of precision)
QUALITY_GOOD = 4 -> the ring is red
The Location was calculated with a good GPS fix. A 3-D GPS fix is available, with good-to-excellent HDOP.
Notes:
– I don’t own a Fenix 5, 5X nor a FR935. Therefore I need your feedback what is working and what not. You can help me to get one by spending me a beer or so (see the links in the app’s description)
– The contributing to the fit file is very buggy from garmin’s side. Please give me feedback whether the contributing was successful (successful is, if you can see a graph in your workout on Garmin’s Connect site.
– Furthermore I am interested in those graphs regarding GPS signal strength of a Fenix 5.
The app can be found here (it’s the link to the german’s website. I hope the english speaking guys are redirected to the proper website):
link to apps.garmin.com
It looks like this:
link to dropbox.com
I’m sure I missed the info in the body of the article but does the 5 track sleep?
A question: can you purchase and install maps of EU countries from Garmin that will work on the US version of the Fenix 5X? I’m going to Italy and would like to use the GPS while there. I think I remember that in one of your earlier reviews, you were using the 5X while in Paris. Was that an EU version of the watch? Thanks for your thoughts.
Les Cutler
I’m about to buy Garmin Fenix 5x in US. Could someone assure me that I can upload and successfully use European TOPO maps to the watch bought in US?
I haven’t done it myself, but from the research I’ve done on the F5x, I’m sure that will work just fine. On my F5x, using Garmin Connect, there is an option to download several different types of maps or to search for other maps that may not be shown at the moment. The Garmin 5 series is built for international use, not so much like the audio/video industry or cell phone industry that limits usage by international regions. I’m sure you’ll be good on that one.
Does the F5 alert you of coming turns when following a course? My 735xt did, but I tried following a loaded course yesterday and was only notified when I was on/off route.
If you click on each intersection/turn when you draw the course in Garmin Connect, then it will warn you ahead of each turn. The distance of each warning is dependent on speed – I find the F5 warns me earlier when descending fast then when climbing slowly.
Thanks, I’ll give that a try, Worst case scenario, I have the DW MAP app which works flawlessly so not a big deal.
Yes it does and it’s without flaws. I’ve been running using the built in navigation of F5 – it warns you 30-40meters before and at each turn. The navigation screen mimics what you’d get on dwatch (which I also have and loved its performance on my FR235 and Fenix 3, for 10bucks/year it’s a no brainer).
One very minor point – I prefer (by a very small margin) the visual appearance of the Fenix 5 with its navigation though – it’s clearer, arrows/numbers are bigger & easier to see without having to stop.
Is the “general multi sport mode on the fly” still thereby doesn’t work by me.
What do you mean by it doesn’t work?
During a run I press, or press and hold, the middle left button. I can then change the settings for “run” but I can’t see how I could change to for example biking.
When you have Garmin TRI belt connected to F5 can you read HR from it on Garmin Edge 1000 at the same time? I prefer to have Edge 1000 on bike while racing triathlons (I would like it to display HR and power) – but I would like fenix to capture whole race (swim, bike – with power from p1, run with power from stryd)…
Yes. I do that on pretty much every ride.
I really enjoyed your in-depth review of the Fenix 5 series. I’m in the market for a new multisport watch, primarily for triathlons, but also for a variety of activities, as well as regular daily activity tracking. My current watch is the Forerunner 910xt but I’m now leaning towards the Fenix 5x. Did you find the Fenix 5x to be a comperable triathlon/multisport watch to the Forerunner 920xt?
I do own the F5x and I think it’s a very subjective thing as to whether it would be too heavy and cumbersome for a triathlon or marathon type event. Even though I really like it for activities in the one hour range, personally I might be given to go with something like the 920 or 935 for a longer activity carrying that load on one wrist. If you can find a lighter snap on band like the titanium band, you could easier switch wrist during activities when the watch gets a little bothersome, which I’ve done a few times, especially if I’m wearing it 24/7 for any length of time.
Keep in mind that the F5X is the same size as the Fenix3, which up until January of this year was very much favored as a triathlon watch by many. So, as DLuna points out, it’s a size thing.
That said, for myself, I preferred the smaller size watches (i.e. FR735XT and now FR935). But again, totally a feel thing and nothing to do with technology or logic.
I Have just bought a Forerunner 935, been using the 910 xt since release, considered the 5 or 5x, in the end I went for something lighter, depends if you want maps, for the difference in price between the 935 and 5x you could buy a decent second hand gps with maps of the size you could use, could be wrong, but the price for the 5x well all of them is crazy. one thing that is disappointing with my 935 is the data fields, the size of the numbers coming from a 910 it’s too small, a big screen, but they have not done a great job with it, bigger display on the same size screen allowing bigger numbers, then it would of been a winner, the fenix 5 is pretty much the same I think.
For cycling; if I buy/use the Fenix 5 (considering purchase- I currently use and Edge 800) with a heart rate strap but no power meter (so no VO2 max estimate calculated), which of the training load metrics will work /not work.
I am particular interested in training load, status and recovery hours.
In the absence of a cycling VO2Max, it will use the running VO2Max.
Contrary to Ray’s review comment, I did receive a separate Cycling VO2max from my Fenix 5X with just an HRM4-Run strap without a power meter.
Does anyone know if you can use the Fenix 3 watch bands on the Fenix 5 series? If the pin is removable like in the Fenix 3 then I would think so……
The Fenix3 bands work on a Fenix 5X, but not the smaller watches because the bands would be too big.
Can you use fenix 5 in triathlons without no problems? With TRI belt, Powertap P1 during bike leg and Stryd during run (IQ field)? Does it pick up those as at the start P1 is in depo probably saving energy and Stryd somewhere on the shoe saving energy too :)
Yup, all that will work no problem.
Hello Ray – Have you heard anything from Garmin about the Stry connectivity issues with the F5? Do you think this is software or hardware related? Ant+ connectivity is definitely a problem.
First – I’m not an expert.
I think the problem lies in the antenna range
I did a little experiment by putting Garmin on the lower leg. Great STRYD signal without dropouts.
I’m also experiencing problem with dropouts of P1 power pedals signal
Don’t know is it software solveable…
If it’s not i will be very disappointed
(the watch – Garmin 5 Sapphire)
In a nutshell, nothing in terms of good news there.
It seems both Garmin and Stryd are trending towards it the 5 having lower signal reception than the 5X. The 5S sits somewhere in the middle.
Both companies have noted they’re still working on a solution though.
Any updates from you Ray, or anyone else, on battery life of the 5X in use? Specifically in a long event such as ironman or ultra? I specifically want to know how far it goes with GPS on 1s sampling (I won’t be using wrist-based OHR because it is too unreliable for me, but I will use Scoshe Rhythm on my arm, which works great). It would be great if this would get all the way through a 50mi or 100km trail ultra under canopy for a slow runner (that would be me :) )..
Here’s my first set of results for 1-second recording:
link to dcrainmaker.com
(See above/below that comment in the thread for a few others that have done testing as well).
I’ve gotta finish editing the video I made that talks to both 1s and UltraTrac options…
This is really helpful to know. I (and some others on the Garmin forum) are experiencing running dynamics data dropouts with the Fenix 5 and HRM TRI and RUN.
I spent more than an hour with Garmin support yesterday but they denied having hardware issues and blamed the dropouts on me adjusting the heart rate monitor (which was not the case). Easily one of the worst support experiences I have had with any company.
Hi Ray,
Stryd has confirmed on the Garmin forums that the Fenix 5 has issues with all ANT+ sensors and I note that they no longer list the Fenix 5/5S as compatible devices on their website. Others have had problems even with Garmin’s own sensors (HRM TRI/RUN).
Do you know how widespread the problem is and whether Garmin will own up to it? I returned my Fenix 5 due to poor reception (thinking it was a faulty unit) and I am awaiting a new unit but I am concerned that I am just wasting my time. Garmin support had denied any issues when I contacted them.
I (and assume many others!) would appreciate your views on the matter.
Thanks!
Yup, Garmin is aware of it (they have been for a really long time).
That said, I wouldn’t necessarily assume either party is directly to blame. From talking to both parties it’s sort of a ‘takes two to tango’ type of thing. Both companies are basically optimizing their signal strength in order to save battery. Usually that works out – but in this case it’s causing the issues seen on the 5/5S, as that has a slightly different design there.
Both companies confirmed to me (in person and via e-mail) while at the Connect IQ Summit that they are working to find a solution. It remains unclear to me how much leverage or space either company has though to make that happen. Both companies could likely make small tweaks to signal strength, but again, to what detriment?
Either way…sucks.
Add me to the list of customers experiencing major drop-out issues with the 5S and power meters. Has been driving me crazy, almost a relief to find this thread and see I am not alone.
In the household we own road and triathlon bikes, two Tacx Neo, two pairs of P1’s, Edge 520, Edge 820, three 920XT’s and the most recent acquisition, a Fenix 5S.
The 5S is hopelessly unreliable with the P1’s and sketchy with the Neo.
All other combinations of the P1’s, bike and head units work fine. This one is definitely on Garmin. They screwed up with the 5S. Absolutely love the watch otherwise, but if it can’t track my power numbers correctly it’s useless as a bike and triathlon watch.
Ray, really appreciate if you can keep us updated on any progress (or lack of it) on this issue.
I haven’t heard of anything new there unfortunately. :(
I know they were looking at ways to address it, but of course it’s a tricky balance with battery life. I didn’t use the 5S as much outdoors cycling (mostly 5/5X), though did most trainer rides with it (blend of Quarq, P1, and Neo), and didn’t see any issues on final hardware. Likely though elements of environmental/position that may help.
I’ll circle back on it again with them.
Please keep in mind, that it is not F5-Stryd Problem, but a general F5 Ant+ reception problem.
I experienced problems with Favero BePro power meter (however, seems to be quite ok in last few workouts, however I switched BePro to max transmit power)… Unfortunately, as Garmin does not beep anymore, when a sensor is disconnected, its difficult to identify on garmin connect, whether it is a dropout or just pause in pedaling.
Hi Ray, have you had news on this issue from Garmin? Garmin either denies the existence of the issue or promises a future software update (depending on support person) but after months the ANT+ reception is still unacceptably poor for a flagship product and we do not have any resolution in site. There is a very long thread in the Garmin Fenix 5/5S forum where owners have tested and confirmed the ANT issues (but unfortunately no solutions other than returning the units).
Nothing new. I had a chat with some 3rd party folks last night about the issue, but am circling back to Garmin today on it again.
Having chatted with the other folks I’m a bit more clear on the exact cause for it. Of course, it’s something I saw early on too (as noted in the review) with certain devices. In my case I can’t use Stryd with mine. And more recently I ran into an issue with the Power2Max NG.
It sucks.
There sounds like there’s some informed 3rd party thoughts on how to address it via firmware update, but whether those thoughts are technically viable (for a number of reasons) isn’t clear. If they made the suggested firmware change it could (likely would) impact aspects like battery. Else it would take a hardware change to resolve it.
Anyway, I’m getting clarify on that piece from Garmin and whether that suggestion is valid. If it’s not valid, I’d assume that’s the end of the road, short of a manufacturing change.
A quiet manufacturing/related change wouldn’t be out of the norm. It’s why folks getting replacement Fenix 3HR’s for the issue that surfaced last winter for some aren’t having issues (or, shouldn’t be anyway). They made some backend manufacturing tweaks that resolves that.
Count me in as another one with power meter dropouts. I’m using the Watteam POWERBEAT which works perfectly with the Edge 520 but is essentially useless with the Fenix 5. As with others, I wanted to use the Fenix 5 for the data collection to get access to all of the Firstbeat metrics and to have a single point of collection throughout the day.
These problems are documented by many owners at the Garmin forum here:
link to forums.garmin.com
Garmin needs to get their act together on this – this is their flagship product and it’s pretty useless for serious athletes or anyone who runs in a city (GPS sensitivity really lousy too).
Hi Ray
Were you able to get any news from Garmin on a solution for the ANT+ issues on the Fenix 5/5S?
Thanks!
The signal strength of the 5 is abysmal.. Disconnects from my phone when my phone is less than a metre away (granted I may have my arm against my body.. But 30cm away?
Power drop outs from my Power Tap render the data rubbish. The average power is in the ball park but for intervals, the power is way off (segments in strava really highlighted this for me, I was doing repeats of a hill (only a one minute effort) power reading on one occasion was 213w for Fenix 5 and 420w for the 510.. That is a crazy difference..
The Fenix 5 gives you stats like Vo2 but if the data is is using to do these calculations is garbage, then the stats are garbage. The Fenix 5 is a fail for athletes who train with power on their bikes.
Hey Ray,
Just got my fenix 5s and am loving it. I was pleased to see that it would run Garmins sailing apps. Do you know if it syncs with the nema 2000 boat sensor data like the Quatrix watch line does?
Thanks for the thorough review! As always.
Question that I could not determine if it was answered in your review.
What are the actual differences in the size of the ‘digital’ face between 5s/5/5x?
It looks as if the bevel seems significantly larger on the 5x, accounting for much of the size difference, but the the digital face is not significantly different.
Thanks in advnace
Hi guys.
I am returning my Suunto SSWHR. Thus, I will be buying Garmin. I was thinking about Fenix 3 Sapphire HR, but there is a F5 now… Soooooo… Could you advice me on this?
I’m basically “happy” with features of F3HR, but I love that F5 (regular) is smaller in size. They are the same price (I’m talking about regular version, non-Sapphire). So, does F5 have all the functions of F3HR – except WiFi?
Also, in Suunto I sync my data via Bluetooth and I’m OK with speed. Does WiFi in Garmin is only for faster sync?
Like… no one? ﴾⇀ᨓ↼﴿
The F5 has everything the F3HR has except WiFi (depending on versions). WiFi does sync faster, but I think for most people the BT sync on the Fenix5 is fast enough that you don’t really notice it. It just happens quietly in the background in usually 20-40 seconds.
Ray, thank you very much.
I figured the multisport on the fly-option out.:) Now I have another question: Does Activity class still matter or is the watch smart enough to know me without it?
By the way, I do love this watch. What could be of nterest for us over 40 with tired eyes is the screen. With the FR 735XT I didn’t see much of the data fields while on the run. Now I do.
I’ve done a minimal comparison of my new Fenix 5 (sapphire/wifi; f/w 2.90) versus my prior 920xt (f/w 9.20):
I had the 920xt connected to chest HRM to compare with Fenix5’s wrist OHR. As others have noted OHR was a little slow to “latch on” at the start of an exercise, but I don’t usually look at my HR in the first minute so..meh. OHR also as others have noted sometimes overshot a peek when the real HR is coming down where a chest HRM accurately measures that immediately.
I compares on an indoor bike spin and a short outdoor suburban run.
On the bike spin the speed/cadence cut out a few times. I had this happen alao early on in the 910xt and 920xt lifetimes, but didn’t later after firmware updates. I haven’t tried the newer Fenix 5 beta firmware. Production firmware update bricked my 910xt back in the day and I had to send it in for replacement, and I do software and have a specialization in device software update so….I’m generally conservative on taking beta firmware if I don’t have a board header and flashing tool to unbrick a device. I’m hoping to see the drop outs go away as some others have reported with the as-yet-to-be formally released Fenix 5 firmware.
On the run I wore both on my right arm. I’ve been very happy with the 920xt and wondered if the metal on the Fenix5 would be a detriment, but no appreciable difference between the two. Sometimes the 920xt tracked closer to where I truly was and sometimes the Fenix5 was. Both GPS tracks were accurate within my expectation. The OHR heart rate again was what’s to be expected versus a chest strap. I still like the chest strap for the run dynamics aspect, but for a simple run I’m quite happy to have HR without having to wear the chest strap.
One final note: the device does not know you’re in the water. So I spent two hours in the pool today without formally tracking my activity, and wanted to see what the OHR recorded during that time. It had a HR the entire time and based on a few quick manual pulse counts, was reasonably accurate. It would be nice if Garmin let you turn on the OHR during a pool or open water swim.
I’m quite happy with the upgrade!
Great Review!!! I have a fenix 3 and use it for kitesurfing following a course created on the watch from waypoint to waypoint, the thing is that whenever it marks i’m of course which is very often the field “distance to next waypoint” stops marking the distance to that next wypt instead of adding more distance to it or decreasing it which is a real downside. I tried the same on a 5s and it does the exact same thing. Before buying one, I was wondering if on a 5X it would do the same, or if it actually would mark the distance to the next wypt on the course even if at times i’m of it. Thanks a lot for your answer because that would be the only reason for me to buy a new watch and put out that kind of money.
I’ve put OSM maps on my Edge 1000 with the instructions here: link to dcrainmaker.com
Do you know how to do something similar for the 5x? BTW, ideally, I would like to “add” vs. replace. But if you have to replace, what files should be backed up?
Thx!
If anybody is interested…. I finally figured it out. It is super simple. You just add the files to the Garmin directory with any filename and the watch picks them up. This way you can add as many countries or regions as you want/can. I downloaded the UAE from link to garmin.openstreetmap.nl named it uae22042017.img (as 22-Apr-2017) is the version of the file and voila! Worked like a charm. Will be adding others.
Hope this helps!
Adrian: thanks for that comment… I’m also in the Emirates, and had used Rays instructions for loading up maps on my Edge 1000… didn’t want to splash out for the Fenix 5x while unsure if it could be similarly loaded. Glad to see your confirmation! John
Hi Ray,
I know that you wrote: “There’s virtually no risk of these popping off in an open water swim or the like, because the lever is below the band against your wrist.”, but I still wonder, how does it work in practice? You made a great test video of how the charging cable fits the watch. What about a “stress test” of the quick fit band in a triathlon-like openwater start, with other people kicking or pulling your wrist? :) Is the QuickFit comparably secure to e.g. 920XT without QR?
Yeah, the thing is the lock simply isn’t accessible. The only way it could fail is if someone actually snapped the wrist strap itself – which is pretty much the same case as any watch.
That said, I’ve got a little baby that loves trying to pull/remove/eat the watch while on my wrist – and thus far she hasn’t succeeded in removing it. ;)
Hi Folks,
I often do hiking or back-country skiing where I explore unknown terrain. Currently I use my phone and different apps where I preload the local map and also the route and just follow it on the fly. This is not always easy, especially when conditions get worse as well as its simply bothering me to take the mobile phone out of the pocket every time I am not sure about my position. I am interesting only on loading (preferably open street) map for a specific area, zoom the map to a high detail and also import my own gpx/tcx and follow it. I am neither interested on poi-s nor rerouting. Would I be able to do this on Fenix 5 or any other Garmin watch as I can simply do it on my Edge 520 (link to dcrainmaker.com) ?